The United States and European countries sometimes feel worlds apart. And it’s a natural thing for different nations to develop unique cultures, systems, and institutions. But once you start traveling a bit more broadly, you start comparing your destinations. Each place has its upsides and downsides, but the differences can be striking at times.
Redditor u/TREE__FR0G, an aspiring herpetologist, asked people to share the things that are completely normal in most places in Europe but would seem very strange to someone living in the US. Scroll down to see what the internet thinks are the biggest differences between Europe and the US.
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Providing healthcare to sick people without bankrupting them.
If anyone tells you how difficult Universal Health Care is to do, remind them that only 35/36 of the largest economies can make it work.
Prices already includes taxes
Should be this way everywhere, so no one's surprised by the full cost. I know what is taxable and how much tax where I live, but not where I travel.
Nudeness.
No, we don't all walk around naked all day.
Yes, we have nude beaches. Yes, on most regular lakes where people go swimming, you most likely see their little kids running around nekkid. Yes, most saunas are "nude only". Yes, you see boobs, a*s and penis on TV (like, if there's a movie and the situation "demands" it). Yes, we have sex education where they use books with images of naked humans in school.
It's just a body. And no, nude doesn't mean "sex!!1!".
A major peculiar aspect of life in the States is the existing tipping culture. As we’ve explained on Bored Panda recently, one of the issues with the way the culture exists in its current form is that it tricks some consumers into paying more than they planned to. In essence, Americans are falling victim to tip inflation or tipflation.
As a result, some customers might decide to boycott some chains or local restaurants, preferring to go elsewhere, where they feel less pressure to tip extremely generously. If tipping is mandatory, it’s not really tipping, now is it? It’s just a hidden tax—one that might not be reflected in the menu.
I’m a project manager in the US and it baffles me that my European team gets an entire month off in the summer.
I’m over here saving my vacation days incase I get sick.
dd/mm/yyyy
SO sensible and completely logical. Also, meters, kilometers, degrees Celcius. It is just plain stupid that the US clings to imperial when nearly all the rest of the world is on metric!
Being British I use some weird combo of both metric and imperial. I know my height in feet and inches and my weight in kilograms
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ISO8601 (yyyy-mm-dd, as used in Japan) is even better - you don't even have to know it's a date in order to sort it, just do it alphabetically.
Agree, everyone I know who writes code does it this way too.
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I'm a programmer so I use yyyy-mm-dd routinely. Even Excel can't screw that one up
Ha! Excel and its obsession with dates is so annoying.
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It's funny, anyone who's been in the military can handle this, and we don't celebrate July 4th, we celebrate the 4th of July, so what's our problem?
I do underatand that Americans use m/d/y because it's how they say it (ex. March 21st 2023). But in my country, Denmark, we say it as OP mentioned (ex. 21st of March 2023). So.... I don't really mind how Americans do their dates as long as they make sure it's clear that they are Americans/using American terms. It can get really confusing otherwise.
I just can't with that. I'm not going to say 2nd August, I'm going to say August 2nd.
American here, idk why but I sounds so professional and old when you like say "the 4th of October 2023" ratter than "October 4th 2023". Just my opinion
I like it. Sounds like a story opening... "it was the fourth of October, year 2023"....
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As someone in the UK I'll admit I use them all depending on the thing being measure. Smaller things usually mm, a car length I'd usually use feet and inches. When it comes to a website date that has to be input I'm never sure what the site wants.
For some bizarre reason, cars dimensions are always reported in inches in the US. I have no idea how long "186 inches" is, so I always have to convert to feet. Everywhere else seems to report them in mm, which is even less logical.
Load More Replies... I also like and use the one where the numbers that chance most often are in the beginning or end. So dd/mm/yyyy or yyyy/mm/dd. But I do see the logic in mm/dd/yyyy als well. It simply goes the lowest changeable number to the highest. 12 months/28-31 days/(hopefully) infinite years.
it differs, when you don't know which format is used. I get yy/mm/dd, I get dd/mm/yy. But why mixing them?
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Yyyy/mm/dd makes the most sense in terms of finding things in chronological order.
It might be sensible, and as a French woman living in Canada, it took me a while to get used to mm/dd/yyyy. But when naming files/versions on a computer, it groups all files from the same month together, so it works for me now.
How did the US ever work out clocks? Minutes, then hours, then seconds would be bloody confusing for me.
It is not logical. It should be yyyy-mm-dd so the dates are sorted correctly.
I go yyyy/mm/dd for easier file naming convention. But makes more sense than mm/dd/yyyy.
I have PTO to be used for both sick time and vacation time. When we are out for medical reasons, surgery and such, we have to burn 40 hours of pto then short term disability kicks in at 60% of our pay to a maximum of 12 weeks. PTO cannot be taken until you have accumulated enough hours. It may take up to 6 weeks to accrue enough hours to take one day off.
Why should we be like everyone else. Thankful we don't use only metric system.
If I give you a paper calendar and tell you to look up June 19, what's the first thing you do: turn to "19" or turn to "June"?
I have switched to YY-MM-DD as it helps organizing photos and documents really well on computers (and computers translate into that format anyway, except for Linux which counts seconds from the time Linux was built). Since I grew up in Europe and moved to the USA, I just cannot bother to remember the "correct" way. Screw it. YMD is an excellent way to date things.
I am half Canadian and half American but live in the US, so I see it written both ways. After filling out 6 pages of my driving logs when I was getting my license, I realized I put the dates in dd/mm/yyyy format. At that point, I was like f*** it, they'll figure it out, because there was no way I was re-doing it lol.
I'm gonna defend the U.S. on this one. If spoken aloud, we would say December 17th, 2022, right? Not 17 December, 2022. Therefore we annotate it 12/17/2022. That's not weird is it?
As a US citizen, yes, I'm ashamed we're still using imperial - along with Liberia and Myanmar (really, they're the only other 2). But if you write dates dd-mm-yyyy, your files won't sort as nicely on your computer sorting by month first is better. Actually, yyyy-mm-dd is best for filenames to properly sort chronologically, but sorting by month then day really isn't "stupid." It's just not as common.
It's stupid, you dont say 13 August 2023, you say August 13th 2023.
I use several date formats, depending on the document or file type. I do recommend that folks use dd/mmm/yy for writing checks and dd/mmm/yyyy for signing contracts.
You (Europe) do it your way, we'll do it ours. We don't follow your rules.
Exactly. If you want to mix and match, don't stop halfway!
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The least precise on the left, the most precise on the right.
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It is super confusing in cross region teams. Also I don't understand calendar with starting day as sunday. What's the origin?
Someone f****d up there. Sabbath, Saturday, should actually be the last day of the week and, hence, Sunday the first. My best guess is that it's a Roman sun worshipping thing to have Sunday as the pinnacle of the week. And when the Roman Empire became Christian probably it seemed easier to keep the Sunday.
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The military, maybe because clear coordination with allied nations is critically important, uses the format 25Dec2023, which can be understood by anyone, whatever their preferred format. Spelling of the months in different languages is a small complication.
Never ever use / because that tells me you are using american notation. dd-mm-yyyy or mm/dd/yyy plz.. or just go ISO yyyymmdd nothing in between.
Oddly my preferred method is year month date because if you do it that way and you're using it in a way that it needs to be sorted it will sort itself properly. No other way will sort and get it right
Bar computers are smart and can work in different orders.
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Let's start with the shortest timescale event, days, and then the next longest timescale event, months, followed by the longest timescale event, years!!!! America: We'll put the middle one first, the first one in the middle and leave the last one, last cus two outa three ain't bad.
It is remarkable that a federal republic clings to "imperial"! Imperial is rooted in the word "empire".
Another big issue for many Americans living in the US is the abhorrent healthcare system. It’s not just a question of opinion, though. The system is very inefficient, incredibly expensive, and markedly worse than in other developed nations. It’s a major issue that ought to be solved.
The Peter G. Peterson Foundation explains how the US spends more on healthcare per person than other wealthy countries around the world. This came to an average of $12,555 per person in 2022, the highest among developed nations. The second-highest spending was recorded in Switzerland, standing at $8,049 per person. Now compare that to the average for OECD countries (excluding the US) which is $6,414 per capita.
Walkable cities
Portland, Oregon, Boston Massachusetts, New York City. There are a few who have it figured out. The rest of the country is living in the dark ages if Mid 20th century car centered life.
Meanwhile, Germany spent $8,011 per person on healthcare in 2022. The Netherlands spent $7,358, Belgium clocked in at $6,600, France stood at $6,517, and Sweden shelled out $6,438 per person. Ireland spent $6,047, slightly below the OECD average. As did the United Kingdom ($5,493 per person) and Italy (merely $4,291 per person).
All in all, healthcare prices in the US are roughly twice as big as the average. However, this does not mean that Americans get healthcare that is ‘twice as good.’ There’s an issue with how these funds are utilized. For one, there’s a lack of competition between hospitals, which has led to administrative waste and inefficiencies in the entire system.
taking an ambulance without a worry in the world
I'm pretty sure anyone taking an ambulance ride has at least one thing to be worried about
Online bank transfers. Americans get all excited over stuff like Venmo but I can send money to anyone via my online banking app for free.
Cashiers having chairs
Cashiers in the US stand all day? I had no idea. What do the trade unions have to say about this?
“The United States spends over $900 per person on administrative costs—four times more than the average of other wealthy countries and about the same as we spend on preventive or long-term healthcare,” the Foundation notes.
Furthermore, the American healthcare system leads to worse health outcomes (e.g. life expectancy, unmanaged diabetes) than in other wealthy countries.
6 weeks vacation
Okay - it should say "Up to" etc. - the timeframe differs greatly between the regions, thee workplaces, the disablement status, the age, the experience, the time of your employment....
The hugest mindf**k for me is the maternity leave. An entire, paid year?! I get that they can channel more money into that stuff since the US has military needs paid for, but that’s still pretty impressive.
The issue isn’t the US’s military budget, although this is higher than is typical in Europe. The issue is that US government is hamstrung by ‘conservatives’ who are simply misogynists who won’t recognise that maternity leave is hugely beneficial for mother and child, and that supporting mothers results in better long-term economic outcomes.
Go to the grocery store on your bicycle.
Walking from shop to shop in the city centre.
I live in Portland, Oregon and haven't driven a car in almost 20 years. I have a dedicated shopping bike I use one a week and all winter. It's the bike with fenders. I can carry two shopping bags home at a time and that's how I control my spending.
Taking your own shopping bag(s) to the supermarket.
Totally normalized in all European countries as far as I know. Or buy a (firm) shopping bag at the store if you don't have one with you.
All those plastic bags in US stores, so small that it can only hold two cans of milk so you see customers with a dozen plastic bags for their groceries.. unthinkable in Europe.
Not wearing shoes in our homes.
I'm from the Netherlands and most people I know don't mind if you wear shoes in their homes. It's a personal choice, not a cultural thing.
Mayo with french fries.
I’m in the US but have cousins in Holland. They introduced me to to this years ago and it’s pretty awesome.
Coalition governments
YES!!! Seriously I am so sick of a two party system! Democrats and Republicans BOTH suck! How did we get stuck with this BS?
Work Life Balance
Going to Europe and then coming back to Texas and visiting our corporate offices in Dublin, London, Paris.
Yes the European working hours are different. But it seems there’s more of a balance and respect for personal time and medical time or absence. Vs in America working yourself to the bone.
Also the absence of Tipping, and availability of metro and being able to conveniently walk where you need to get to. 1 mile in Europe feels shorter than the 1 mile walk in USA hahaha sidewalk availability and lack of parks to cut through etc.
This is very noticeable. Most Europeans have a far greater respect of the life part of the Work Life balance, and so this is seen reflected in cultural norms and often laws. (For example, try to go shopping in Germany on a Sunday or see the consequences of non-emergency work-related 'phone calls outside standard office hours.)
trains
We have trains. Yeah, this country is backward as f**k but we have goddamned trains.
The right to roam.
It's glorious to be able to hike across private land when you grow up used to signs saying "Trespassers will be shot."
Unlocked phones.
When I lived in the US it was hard for me to get around the idea that I couldn't use the phone that I bought with AT&T with a SIM card from T-Mobile. In Europe I interchange my SIM cards with zero problems. I can even change my provider and keep the same number and of course the same phone.
You can get your phone unlocked if you've finished paying it off
Legally enshrined right to online privacy
I'm curious how this differs from eu legislation. For example, the app store must clearly state how data is collected and how it is used. Sites can be prohibited from collecting data and the use of cookies can be adjusted manually. Apps can be denied access to, for example, the camera, messages or gallery if you want.
Roundabouts. They're like the rotary phones of the road - Americans look at them in utter confusion and wonder where to dial.
Biking, public transportation, walking in the city, basically not living life centered around driving a car.
The United States has an extremely low population density. When you live 25 miles from the nearest Walmart and there's nothing in between except corn and soybean fields, you need a car.
Mandatory recycling
E-government, being able to do 99% of the things needed online.
This one is also not true. It depends on the country. Some countries in Europe are still very, very bureaucratic
More people are day drinking in Europe than I have ever seen in America.
Please come visit us on the West Coast. Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, and LA know how to day drink.
Inter country travel. I don't even live on the main European land mass. I live on a European island. But I can fly to most European countries in under four hours. And it's not a million euro to do so.
Having your washing machine in your kitchen.
European houses are small, often no room to incorporate separate laundry room.
Paying to use a toilet.
"The Committee to End Pay Toilets in America, or CEPTIA, was a 1970s grass-roots political organization which was one of the main forces behind the elimination of pay toilets in many American cities and states." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Committee_to_End_Pay_Toilets_in_America
Well, in some countries, having a monarchy (UK, Denmark + the Faroe Islands, Norway, Sweden, the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Spain, Leichtenstein, Monaco, technically also Andorra and Vatican City) or even a quasi-monarchy (Romania, Serbia, where the monarchies have a sort-of-official role while still being a Republic).
Also, having a religion tax (which you can opt out of if you formally leave the Church or other religious organisation if there's an option for it to go to a non-Christian one), in Austria, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Iceland, Italy, Spain (as a choice of where your tax goes, doesn't change the overall amount) and some cantons of Switzerland. And having a particular state or established Church (England, Scotland, Denmark, Faroe Islands, Iceland) or national/"people's" Church (Sweden, Norway).
Electric kettles.
Again, I’ve seen a lot of electric kettles in the Us, I even have one
being able to tilt open your windows
in usa your windows only open like doors, i couldnt imagibe living in a house lacking such basic features as tilting open the top of the window
Not really an unknown concept but letting cats go outside and roam around. It's just the norm in the UK.
A majority of veterinarians in the UK now recommend keeping cats indoors. Also,the UK does not have coyotes...who would just as soon kill your cat than look at it.
I am european and this is getting quiet boring. There's nothing new in this articles and our american friens pretty much know what their country is lacking. No need to check if they still remember it... You know it is called bullying to constantly put someone down?! Can we please have more posts that show the good and beautiful sides of america? I know there is a lot to cover.
Agreed, I’m European too and it’s always the same weekly ‘Americans do it wrong’ post. That’s probably enough now.
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is it Monthly? I thought it was biweekly but I am known to be wrong quite often.
Load More Replies... Reposting the same hatred again, Bored Panda? How many times are you going to recycle the b******t?
OK, the US has major shortcomings. But why is there never a featured post that bashes Russia? Or China?
honeslty bashing Russia is being done just fine. Just not here. I've shat in cleaner outhouses than all of Russia.
Load More Replies... Kettles, trains, cars yup all there. Just another repeat of the usual Xenophobic b******t. I'm going to start reporting these threads because frankly they are just stupid. We know we have issues here. Its not news, no one is teaching us anything we don't already have thorough self awareness of. Politely put, European countries are also highly dysfunctional in their own ways. worry about whats in your own borders. I mean Victor Orban is far from a progressive, future forward leader. Macron and Schultz and their back channel Putin relationship. S**t, Merkel was basically the main supporter of Putin from the 90s. Thanks Mutti! Y'all are ready to s**t on the USA for our problems yet you all have let Russia chip pieces of your countries away and do nothing about it. Transnistria, Kaliningrad, S Ossetia, etc. Get your own house in order or help us. Jonas Grinevičius, Pushing xenophobic content is not your best look. bring back cat pics.
They don't have that in all Europe right now, either. Muslims are terrified for their kids in Scandinavia.
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This is like the thirtieth post bashing America. I'm wondering if a hardcore USA hater is writing these. We KNOW our country is terrible. But maybe once in awhile highlight some good things? Even Russia has at least one good thing (pretty buildings).
our country is not terrible. Yes it has issues but it is not terrible
Load More Replies... Oh great. Another America sucks article. Haven't had one of these in almost 3 days. Gaps in bathroom stalls? Really?
Well for a website supposedly dedicated to showing such things as beautiful pictures, cute cartoons and loveable animals, BP sure has made a hard turn into bullying and vitriol, and starting arguments amongst normally nice people. I've seen a lot of the original people who came for the fun. completely leave the site, never to be heard from again. I think that's a shame.
I see a double standard in all these ever present US bashing posts. Any of us could be banned at a moments notice for a comment that other people or the BP censors don't like, but BP itself is engaging in bullying by belittling the US constantly. I think by now even countries other than the US are getting sick of it.
Just what I needed… yet another article on European civilization vs American barbarism. And yet I’m the fool for reading it and getting bothered by things with which I often agree…
So many of these are myths or outright not realizing the US is larger than their tiny country. When you live 80 miles from your job, you need a car. Our cities are walkable and have good public transportation. Which is great if you live and work in the city. But not everyone does.
American with family in Europe. UK and EU alike. The world is not as different as this post wants people to believe. Some of the most walkable cities I've seen are in the US, and some of them are in Europe. Violence is not exclusive ot the US. Poverty, either. Could the US do better? Yes. However, that doesn't mean there's no wrongs elsewhere, so please, just find a real topic or re-post kitten and puppy pictures.
I think a notable accomplishment has been made here. The first time in history a comparison between Europe and America, and not one mention of the metric system versus the imperial system! 😂
I guess it has been a week or two since the boring, beaten to death topic of xenophobic Europeans pointing out the glaringly obvious issues with the USA that they have nothing to do with... P**s off BP with the nonsense.
Can we just stop treating Europe like it's one country? It isn't! All of these vary a lot from country to country. For instance, I'm Greek, and probably half of those (maybe more) are not the norm in Greece. Things are not even the same in each US state, and they all belong in the same country.
I agree that these articles dissing the US are bullying and divisive. I teach international students and one of the first things I talk to them about is being respectful of other people's countries and cultures. I would feel awful if I came here every week to read hate about my country.
And every country has its issues, but .... I've been downvoted nearly to oblivion for simply saying that fact, so I apologize in advance. It's basiaclly BP's "thing" now to make sure everyone worships Europe, even Russia, and never mention anything unifying other than "Europe vs US".
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And the other way around. It's much easier to start your business and earn money with lots of opportunities, and less bureaucracy.
Okay here we go 😛 1). Don't rinse the fries before baking them, that's a big no no... 2) You cook them a first time around 140 Celsius, not for long they shouldn't get color yet. Then dry them a little with household paper and let them cool down completely 3) when you're ready for dinner you cook them again around 180 Celsius 😉🤗 and indeed .. no veggie oil 😅
One thing I got from this is that millions of Americans know nothing about parts of the US that they've never seen, and are as willing as Europeans to make invalid generalizations about the US
It's extremely obvious that many Europeans think they know things about Americans, but they are clearly clueless.
They forgot to add PATERNITY leave! In other words, the father can take off work to take cafe of a baby instead. In Sweden, we also have sick days for kids. Basically a parent can stay at home to take care of a small child and be covered for 80% of their salary-
Place I worked at had paternity leave. Six weeks, but better than nothing. Obviously wasn't a minimum wage place.
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I am european and this is getting quiet boring. There's nothing new in this articles and our american friens pretty much know what their country is lacking. No need to check if they still remember it... You know it is called bullying to constantly put someone down?! Can we please have more posts that show the good and beautiful sides of america? I know there is a lot to cover.
Agreed, I’m European too and it’s always the same weekly ‘Americans do it wrong’ post. That’s probably enough now.
Load More Replies... is it Monthly? I thought it was biweekly but I am known to be wrong quite often.
Load More Replies... Reposting the same hatred again, Bored Panda? How many times are you going to recycle the b******t?
OK, the US has major shortcomings. But why is there never a featured post that bashes Russia? Or China?
honeslty bashing Russia is being done just fine. Just not here. I've shat in cleaner outhouses than all of Russia.
Load More Replies... Kettles, trains, cars yup all there. Just another repeat of the usual Xenophobic b******t. I'm going to start reporting these threads because frankly they are just stupid. We know we have issues here. Its not news, no one is teaching us anything we don't already have thorough self awareness of. Politely put, European countries are also highly dysfunctional in their own ways. worry about whats in your own borders. I mean Victor Orban is far from a progressive, future forward leader. Macron and Schultz and their back channel Putin relationship. S**t, Merkel was basically the main supporter of Putin from the 90s. Thanks Mutti! Y'all are ready to s**t on the USA for our problems yet you all have let Russia chip pieces of your countries away and do nothing about it. Transnistria, Kaliningrad, S Ossetia, etc. Get your own house in order or help us. Jonas Grinevičius, Pushing xenophobic content is not your best look. bring back cat pics.
They don't have that in all Europe right now, either. Muslims are terrified for their kids in Scandinavia.
Load More Replies... This is like the thirtieth post bashing America. I'm wondering if a hardcore USA hater is writing these. We KNOW our country is terrible. But maybe once in awhile highlight some good things? Even Russia has at least one good thing (pretty buildings).
our country is not terrible. Yes it has issues but it is not terrible
Load More Replies... Oh great. Another America sucks article. Haven't had one of these in almost 3 days. Gaps in bathroom stalls? Really?
Well for a website supposedly dedicated to showing such things as beautiful pictures, cute cartoons and loveable animals, BP sure has made a hard turn into bullying and vitriol, and starting arguments amongst normally nice people. I've seen a lot of the original people who came for the fun. completely leave the site, never to be heard from again. I think that's a shame.
I see a double standard in all these ever present US bashing posts. Any of us could be banned at a moments notice for a comment that other people or the BP censors don't like, but BP itself is engaging in bullying by belittling the US constantly. I think by now even countries other than the US are getting sick of it.
Just what I needed… yet another article on European civilization vs American barbarism. And yet I’m the fool for reading it and getting bothered by things with which I often agree…
So many of these are myths or outright not realizing the US is larger than their tiny country. When you live 80 miles from your job, you need a car. Our cities are walkable and have good public transportation. Which is great if you live and work in the city. But not everyone does.
American with family in Europe. UK and EU alike. The world is not as different as this post wants people to believe. Some of the most walkable cities I've seen are in the US, and some of them are in Europe. Violence is not exclusive ot the US. Poverty, either. Could the US do better? Yes. However, that doesn't mean there's no wrongs elsewhere, so please, just find a real topic or re-post kitten and puppy pictures.
I think a notable accomplishment has been made here. The first time in history a comparison between Europe and America, and not one mention of the metric system versus the imperial system! 😂
I guess it has been a week or two since the boring, beaten to death topic of xenophobic Europeans pointing out the glaringly obvious issues with the USA that they have nothing to do with... P**s off BP with the nonsense.
Can we just stop treating Europe like it's one country? It isn't! All of these vary a lot from country to country. For instance, I'm Greek, and probably half of those (maybe more) are not the norm in Greece. Things are not even the same in each US state, and they all belong in the same country.
I agree that these articles dissing the US are bullying and divisive. I teach international students and one of the first things I talk to them about is being respectful of other people's countries and cultures. I would feel awful if I came here every week to read hate about my country.
And every country has its issues, but .... I've been downvoted nearly to oblivion for simply saying that fact, so I apologize in advance. It's basiaclly BP's "thing" now to make sure everyone worships Europe, even Russia, and never mention anything unifying other than "Europe vs US".
Load More Replies... And the other way around. It's much easier to start your business and earn money with lots of opportunities, and less bureaucracy.
Okay here we go 😛 1). Don't rinse the fries before baking them, that's a big no no... 2) You cook them a first time around 140 Celsius, not for long they shouldn't get color yet. Then dry them a little with household paper and let them cool down completely 3) when you're ready for dinner you cook them again around 180 Celsius 😉🤗 and indeed .. no veggie oil 😅
One thing I got from this is that millions of Americans know nothing about parts of the US that they've never seen, and are as willing as Europeans to make invalid generalizations about the US
It's extremely obvious that many Europeans think they know things about Americans, but they are clearly clueless.
They forgot to add PATERNITY leave! In other words, the father can take off work to take cafe of a baby instead. In Sweden, we also have sick days for kids. Basically a parent can stay at home to take care of a small child and be covered for 80% of their salary-
Place I worked at had paternity leave. Six weeks, but better than nothing. Obviously wasn't a minimum wage place.
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