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There’s no such thing as a ‘perfect’ workplace. However, that’s no excuse for maintaining a toxic environment and letting your employees feel like they’re undervalued and don’t belong there. Every manager should, ideally, strive to motivate and support everyone. And while some bosses manage to genuinely inspire their crew, others focus more on creating the illusion of change than actually committing to changing anything.
Mandatory team-building events without any soul behind them, mental health seminars with no real follow-ups, calling your business a ‘family,’ and expecting women to organize and run all social events—this is just the tip of the iceberg of toxic workplace behaviors, according to the redditors on r/AskWomen.
We’ve collected their very best insights to show that, once you take a closer look, even an ‘ideal’ company might still do a lot of things incredibly wrong. While you’re reading everyone’s posts, think about the very worst practices that you’ve seen at work, Pandas. Share your thoughts and experiences in the comments. Got any specific solutions to people’s work problems? Let them know how you’d approach things.
Meanwhile, read on for Bored Panda’s interview about the early warning signs of burnout and mandatory team-building events with workplace expert Lynn Taylor, the author of ‘Tame Your Terrible Office Tyrant: How to Manage Childish Boss Behavior and Thrive in Your Job.’ Taylor is also the CEO of Behind the Buckle and a blogger at Psychology Today.
We also got in touch with the founders of the Work Wives podcast, Johanna Kate and Sarah May Alexander, for their thoughts about a phenomenon that affects female employees, known as 'office housework,' and how to change the situation. You'll find the insightful duo's thoughts as you scroll down.
This post may include affiliate links.
#1
The mentality that people who choose to have children are more entitled to taking time off on holidays or in the summer.
I don’t have a child, but I am someone’s child. I don’t have to have children of my own for holidays to be important to me.
James016 3 years ago
If anyone in my team books time off and I want to take the same weeks off, my request will be rejected. As someone with a child, I can only take holidays outside of school terms, so I plan quite far in advance and book the weeks of early. I've never been asked to switch dates nor have I asked anyone to swap
Sarah Monk 3 years ago
This isn’t necessarily the person being entitled it is sometimes the ignorant way companies choose to organise their staff
keighterz 3 years ago (edited)
It should be based on the person who gets their request in first. But don’t make me laugh at “child free people are discriminated against.” I’ve literally been denied entrance or asked to leave public places because I had my kid, and no they weren’t being obnoxious or throwing a fit, they were just existing. Edit to add: I’m not invalidating people’s experiences, just saying there seems to be a lot of hate lately on people who chose to have kids. Some of us just have our kids and are quietly going about life.
Angie Chan 3 years ago
Having your kids in public places is not the same as the workplace (in most situations). We are paid for the work we do in the workplace, and some employers feel that it is more acceptable to work a CF person harder/longer because they don't have kids, with no compensation for the effort. It came up for me personally this past year, and it was going to be done without even telling me in advance that I would be working harder than 4 of my peers.
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Tenacious Squirrel 3 years ago
This needs to be higher. You don’t need to “be someone’s child” either. People are people. We’re all entitled to the same rights. There is way too much discrimination against child free people, they need to even it up and start giving everyone rights to the same paid leave that can be used for their needs (e.g. one lot of 9 months out for anything from maternity to mental health to travel to dealing with illness to whatever the person wants to do with it - doesn’t need to be justified). Then people with kids can use it for maternity and others can use it for their needs.
Steve Hawtin 3 years ago
Don't agree with this. Children are a responsibility, not an excuse. Holidays are indeed impprtant to everyone, but that's not why people with children have to have time off in the holidays. Those children are off school and it's the only opportunity to go on holiday. People without children can chose to go whenever they want.
Pizzagirl 91 3 years ago
There's also some pressure from schools and daycare to take your children on holiday sometimes. We are asked to take our toddlers out of daycare for at least 10 consecutive days in summer, and for some days every few months all through the year. We've got 24 paid days off every year, now you do the maths on how much I like to plan my holidays... My stepdaughter is starting school next year, and it's gonna be a blast to fit her times in with our family holidays. Plus, my dad and my sister are both teachers, so I absolutely can't see them on school days. I'd love to be more flexible, but what are we supposed to do?
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penguin 3 years ago
I have absolutely no problem with parents being given preference when it comes to holiday choices. I made a conscious decision not to have children of my own, and if that's one of the "disadvantages", fine. My vacations are cheaper out of season and there are no noisy children or tedious families on the road. And the weather is no longer an issue either, these days it's unpredictable anyway. To be honest I don't think it's fair to criticize parents when they have first choice. Children and parents need time together. If you have a problem with that, how selfish do you have to be?
Izzy Spence 3 years ago
I don’t think this is about holidays being more important to people with kids but about the fact that the kinds will need supplementary childcare during that time if neither parent can take the time off and that can sometimes cost a great deal in certain countries. Never been an issue for me I might add and I would never expect to have rights to a holiday period especially if I didn’t ask for it well in advance. Holiday requests should first be negotiated between employees and then submitted.
DEW 3 years ago
I have always loved Thanksgiving. So I would request Thanksgiving off and would work Christmas Eve and Christmas. Worked at a retirement home as a waitress. It was always sad to see the dining room with people gone with family and I served the ones that were still there and no family.
Maria Veronica 3 years ago
Agree, but not so much, having children maybe is a bad decision, but is a no return one, there is so much over parents´ shoulders, that I think people with no children could be a little bit considerate
Erik Ivan 3 years ago
In a lot of countries (pick basically any EU-country) employees are mandated to take a holliday during summer by law.
Yoga Kitty 3 years ago
I don't know about the others but at least not in Germany...?
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#2
"This is a family"
No it's not..its a business..
UncleRussian 3 years ago
Yup, and stop being offended when I say I'm here for the money, "family" doesn't pay the bills
General Anaesthesia 3 years ago (edited)
Your employer often expects your time and work without pay just like your family, so in that sense...
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LH25 3 years ago
I am in a job where this is actually pretty true. When I was going through my cancer treatments, they didn't deduct all the time off I had to take so I didn't drain my sick leave. They organized meals to send home during it all. They realized that even on days I worked I wasn't as productive. And there are other times when life interfered and they were there for me. One reason we have a LOT of long term employees. 20+ years is not uncommon.
GirlFriday 3 years ago
I work for a great company that stuck with me through cancer, chemo, major surgery and recovery. I absolutely love my job and will go above and beyond during my working hours, but the day they stop paying me is the day I stop showing up.
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Lem Johnson 3 years ago
It's almost always a load of garbage too. What companies mean when they say this is "we'll expect you to go out of your way for us like you would your family but will not compensate you for it because FaMiLy." My employees are my employees. I like, respect and look out for them, but their obligation to me starts at the start of their shift and ends at the end of it. They're not my family, they're people who work for me and that's the relationship we should have. I encourage them to keep work and personal completely separate and absolutely not consider me their friend or family member because I'm not.
Jossh Nine 3 years ago
The company I work for has never used that phrase (even though they are a family owned/operated company). But I've recently had to take a couple of weeks off to take care of my mental health. I've only worked for this company for 8 months, so I had not accumulated any vacation time yet. I have a brief explanation of what was going on in my life and they were extremely understanding, no questions asked. I'd call in each day to let them know I wasn't ready to go back yet, and every couple of days my manager would call me to check in and ask me how I was doing. He wasn't being intrusive, he just genuinely cared about my state of mind and wanted me to get better. I've never had that happen from any manager before, and I've worked a tonne of different jobs. I know they care about me more than the numbers and hours I produce.
Lu 3 years ago
It is a family - it’s dysfunctional and people will treat you without any respect because we’re “close” haha
Christine Ruback 3 years ago
This! Lol 😂- I wouldn’t want anybody at work to talk to me or treat me like my sisters do at times. Even though we three are in our 50’s now, we are still besties some days & BEASTLY, rude and impatient with each other the next! 🤷♀️😂
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Jill Hojnacki 3 years ago
Heh. My company used to have their annual picnic at a famous amusement park (not mouse related). We got tickets for ourselves, spouses/partners, and children. They set up a “picnic area” where we could get something to eat and play games, but most folks just enjoyed the park. New HR decided we weren’t “bonding”, so they nixed the amusement park and held the party in a local park, instead. They provided hot dogs and hamburgers, and beer. Folks had to socialize with each other; there was nothing else to do. They “bonded” all right; so well that the police had to be called to break up the fights. Forced bonding is NEVER a good idea.
#3
Coming to work sick
UncleRussian 3 years ago
Heavily regulated here in Germany. If you're really sick you stay the f*ck at home
The Scout 3 years ago
Unfortunately that applies more in theory than in practice... I am really glad to live in a country that has practically unlimited paid sick leave, but while some workplaces do pressure employees into working sick, a lot more just come in anyway because of a wrong understanding of work ethics... Workplace presenteeism is a seriously underestimated problem. It also is completely counter-productive, as sick people are proven to work badly and cost the company more money in the long run.
Load More Replies... LH25 3 years ago
HATE when people do this. We've had the option to work from home when not feeling great but being able to work. Still not great, if you are sick take a day off! But one woman always came in, claiming her symptoms were just allergies. Until the day she had to call the boss and say she tested positive for strep throat.
Pittsburgh rare 3 years ago
In Spain, you're not paid the three first days you're off work sick. Guess the outcome 🙄
Headless Roach 3 years ago
So you don't want to see and hear me blow my nose every 3 minutes and cough my lungs out every 5? That hurts, people.
Pink kitty 3 years ago
I think you might be my boss who has been like that the last week
Load More Replies... GirlFriday 3 years ago
In this day and age, no one should have to go to work sick. Companies need to do better.
William Teach 3 years ago
The GM of my dealership really, really, really wants people to stay home if they're sick. The pressure is to not come to work, and he will send people home. Did it before COVID, and will do it now. We've narced out a few coworkers who were suddenly wearing masks, and he told them to go get tested.
Jane Cortez 3 years ago
That needs to stop, besides Covid, it is inconsiderate and dangerous! Exposing others to germs can also be dangerous for those that are immunosuppressive, have health conditions, eg diabetes, heart conditions, asthma…
Workplace expert Taylor told Bored Panda about the early warning signs of burnout. Here are a few of the main ones:
- “You dread going to work. You might be hitting the snooze button multiple times each morning.
- Your productivity level is decreasing even though you’re working hard. Stress and frustration are impacting your work product.
- You keep daydreaming and wondering about what it would be like to work somewhere else.
- You’re feeling the physical effects of burnout, such as fatigue, low energy, or muscle pain.”
Taylor noted that employees should stay mindful of their mental and physical well-being at work.
“It’s easy to get into a rut or downward spiral otherwise. Work should not be involuntary servitude… it should be meaningful and challenging. Employees are at their best when they feel they’re making a contribution—in an atmosphere that is welcoming and supportive.”
#4
Forced team bonding events.
Greta Kolding 3 years ago
So true. I remember my cheeks hurting from wearing an artificial smile the whole day.
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Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
These just cause people who don't want to be there to be even more bitter and resentful.
General Anaesthesia 3 years ago (edited)
The introverts' nightmare and absolutely useless. "Social studies" that result in this type of advice to employers are frauds, quacks. https://www.forbes.com/sites/lizryan/2016/09/22/the-ugly-truth-about-team-building/
GirlFriday 3 years ago
I love my job and get along well with the people I work with, heck, some of them, I even like, but I spend most of my waking hours with them, I don't want to go to drinks with them when my workday is done.
Amina Trabelsi 3 years ago
These events end up with you speaking only with the colleague(s) you are already spoke to during normal business hours
Roe Rainrunner 3 years ago
And which you already didn't enjoy talking to during normal business hours :D
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Roland Nijveld 3 years ago
I hate this so much. Especially if it's some stupid activity I don't like
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago (edited)
It’s just the suits stroking themselves to feel better about abusing employees by wasting time and MONEY on these pointless pep rallies. Money better spent on raises and bonuses for those employees, FFS. I f*****g hated them, they did nothing but take me away from my desk and put me behind on my work. I usually sat in the back and only halfheartedly participated if I absolutely HAD to. At one place I worked, I wasn’t the only one who hated this, so the suits decided to have the presenter hand out these little “energy stones”, which were just those stones you put in a vase or plant pot, ffs. You HAD to sit through the c**p to get the stone on the way out, so you couldn’t just blow it off or sneak out. Anyone who didn’t show their stone to their manager got it noted in their employee file. Assholes. After I showed my stone to my manager I threw the f*****g thing in the trash. As far back as the eighties I maintained I would rather be paid more than to have to sit through that b******t time and time again.
Bob La Capra 3 years ago (edited)
At one mandatory fun session, the manager was taking pics of everyone's teeth as they walked into the meeting room. I asked why she was doing that...she said she was going to project the pics up on a big screen and we were going to guess who we were looking at. I asked if she was out of her mind and walked away. I wasn't the only one and that part of the meeting was skipped.
Maddy Panda 3 years ago
Literally 1 hour of pure torture among fellas you don't even want to deal with.
Headless Roach 3 years ago
Agent Stonecypher: "Have you ever been to a team seminar, Agent Mulder?" / Mulder: "No. You know, unfortunately around this time of year, I always develop a severe hemorrhoidal condition."
#5
Not paying men and women equally.
October 3 years ago (edited)
If you are ever tempted to think gender inequality is a thing of the past, remember this fact. Even in my 'female friendly' firstworld country (Netherlands) the average hourly wage for women is 13% less than for men, eventhough the women are better educated than the men.
S Mi 3 years ago
That doesn't even take into account the under valuing of 'female dominated industries' on many places, like teaching, child care and support for the vulnerable, which somehow are worth less to our societies...
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Raphael Biock 3 years ago
What about not paying equally for identical output. This should be the only measurement for comparisson.
Jane Cortez 3 years ago
Archaic and simply and excuse to rip people off. Women typically are not as assertive as men, therefore accept more cr*p.
Haywood Jablome 3 years ago
Okay hear me out...i think the "wage gap" is a bait & switch. in America at least, if you could pay a woman less for the same job then why would anyone ever a man? We're capitalists. More to the point, American maternal policies, generally speaking, are trash. They are token at best, and sometimes non-existant. What if the wage-gap is a statistical symptom of exploitative policies and the idea of simply paying someone less is a distraction? Similar to the McDonalds/frivolous lawsuit cover-up
TheKitKatLizard 3 years ago
The wage gap is mostly a thing because even though men and women are paid the same for the same position most of the time, employers are historically against hiring and promoting qualified women to those better paying job positions. Not too long ago, women were demoted or even fired the moment they got married. That, along with being expected to do basically all of the child-raising and a lack of external childcare, has historically kept women out of advancing in the work world. Less access to continuing their studies, less time for work to advance, and less people offering them better positions... that causing a lower hourly wage on average. I think you're head-on here, they put out this false idea of 'women being paid less for the same job' so employers can go 'I don't do that!' while said employers go on to not let women into the better positions, while lowkey giving the lower positions the same work as higher positions...
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Lege Family 3 years ago
If you do your job well then you get paid gor it. Wage gape is a myth do your job and get paid for your job. No one is holding a gun to your head where you work, leave and find a better human to work for.
K Y 3 years ago
You males will do ANYTHING to convince yourselves that the gender wage gap doesn't exist, it's insane.
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#6
Mandatory social events outside of work.
Tenacious Squirrel 3 years ago
That’s true and I fully agree. However there are fields where, if you don’t partake in out-of-hours social stuff it can really affect your job (possibly your reputation). My partner has this to deal with. Thankfully it’s not too often but yeah, if he refused to take part his work would be affected.
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Na Schi 3 years ago
Not as bad, but still annoying af: lunch & learn! I do not intend to participate in another meeting where crappy food is served (if not even "bring your own") during my FREE time during lunch break. Breaks are there for recreational purposes for a reason.
Susan Reid Smith 3 years ago
As an introvert, I need the time to relax and tune out the noise.
Load More Replies... madamjoiedumort 3 years ago
I've always loved the tag "mandatory" attached to after work c**p. If you don't get paid and it doesn't take place on the company property then you don't have to go. I don't understand why people don't understand that.
Lp Johnson 3 years ago
Because people have been "quiet fired" for not towing the company line. It Happens. Full Stop. Do you think the "complaint" came out of thin air, WORLDWIDE?
Load More Replies... Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
Check your terms and conditions of employment. Normally they say they can ask you to work at another location; but in my experience they do not say that they can force you to attend anything that is off-site, out of hours and not part of your job. Say no and deal with it at a tribunal if necessary. What sort of idiot manager wants people at a party if they don't want to be there? Do they really think it will be beneficial to them?
Sarah Monk 3 years ago
Unfortunately nothing outside of my contracted hours can be mandatory, we have quite good employment legislation
Mama Penguin 3 years ago
I hate these with a passion. It's just awkward. It's not at all the same as going out with your actual work friends.
Meanwhile, the workplace expert shared her thoughts about mandatory team-building events that are more about appearances than real change. “In their zeal to build camaraderie, there is a contingent of managers who go through the motions of team-building events without a solid strategy,” the author of ‘Tame Your Terrible Office Tyrant’ said.
“Sometimes, senior leadership feels that it’s the ‘right thing to do’ and may bring in a cookie cutter program, for example—that doesn’t reflect the culture or people in the organization. It’s always best to get input from those you’re trying to motivate before launching a program. When people have a vested interest in the outcome and are part of the solution, you always get a better result,” she explained to Bored Panda.
“Sometimes, motivational programs can seem patronizing if there is a disconnect between the nature of the event, and how management treats its employees. Think about a program that is launched at one of these so-called pep talks and is called, ‘We love our people,’ but a) management has been slow to respond to major employee concerns; b) raises have been nonexistent; or c) there is very little training or support at the company. If not handled correctly, these programs can appear hypocritical, and certainly more detrimental than helpful.”
#7
Telling employees to keep their salary confidential. LOL I am a HR and I am all for compensation transparency because I know corporate only tell us to hide s**t when when they know it's too fishy to disclose.
Hugo Farr 3 years ago
In the USA it is a violation of federal law for employers to tell their employees to not discuss their salary.
JCRocks 3 years ago
We have clear steps for raises and promotions where I work, so there is complete transparency... EXCEPT HR refuses to post salaries when hiring. As a leader on many search committees, it's incredibly frustrating. We have multiple people drop out halfway through the process when they finally ask about salary.
GirlFriday 3 years ago
I think that salary discussions among employees is healthy for growth. When one of my team comes to me and says "why is Beth getting paid more than I am?" it is an opportunity for me to coach Bob on what he needs to do to get to the next level. I have no problem with that at all.
Fabian Bernard 3 years ago
Ours are publicly pined to the wall of the break room, with annual raises and promotion. Ratio from lower scale to higher one is 7/8
Mitchell 3 years ago
I disagree with all the toxic chatter about this policy. One person may be paid more than another for reasons that aren’t obvious, like they speak Spanish and the company is about to launch a product in Spain. Or they may be working on a secret project. There are typically two outcomes in finding out a colleagues salary that you think is in the same role. 1. You are paid less than them, and so you become resentful and angry. 2. You are paid more than them, and you worry if you’re actually performing better, delivering more. No-one wins with salary transparency. It’s not all about evil corporations trying to screw people. There are valid reasons.
Vesna 3 years ago
It creates resentment between employees and effects the team too. But if it's just poor and not caring management - paying different salaries based on their sex or ability for someone to be more pushy and ask for raises- then it's really sucks.
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Shay Baranowski 3 years ago
Yeah...that's not true about it being against fed law in u.s. but i do agree should be transparent
Kelly Karja 3 years ago
Under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA or the Act), employees have the right to communicate with other employees at their workplace about their wages.
Load More Replies... #8
Gatekeeping knowledge or information in order to make others look incompetent
Na Schi 3 years ago (edited)
In general? Yes agree without doubt! But... in case your manager for example is an incompetent arshole who stabs you in the back at any minimal chance and shows the team accomplishments off as their own... then I find it more than legetime to exactly let the incompetent, uneducated arsehole with their social intelligence of a potato look like the one he is in front of his bosses 😈
blah blah blah 3 years ago
I only do this to people who act like they already know it all. You got this.
GirlFriday 3 years ago
I hate the "I am irreplaceable" attitude. I once had a boss tell me, "If you are irreplaceable in your current position, then you are not promotable either." That is so true.
John Bujold 3 years ago
It's juvenile a*s move regardless of the situation. If someone is incompetent then it should be discussed with management. Clear communication should be the rule and if it's a skill set issue then training and review should be done to bring the person up to par. If it's a personal conflict then that needs to be addressed with HT or management immediately. Making it personal is an a*****e move
Princess Jade 3 years ago
I had a manager who would tell her supervisor that I knew how to do a task, never checking in with me to see if I could, so come the days the supervisor was running and needed to do the thing I didnt know how so not only did I come off as passive aggressive but the supervisor was unable to complete the task in turn making her look incompetent.
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago (edited)
Or to make yourself look indispensable—-then hating it and having a hissy fit when someone new comes up with a better way to do something. Even worse, hogging all the knowledge then taking frequent days or weeks off where they’re incommunicado, and leaving everyone in the lurch of something comes up. Then getting pissed off if, while they were gone, someone else figured out how to do something that they’re gatekeeping. Worked with many of these. Some had been there so long, they were stuck in the past, and kept the department stuck there too. For example, having to redundant and wasteful printed out paper backup on file for stuff that’s stored in the computer anyway—-just like we did back in the nineties before we got used to storing documents electronically.
#9
Keep having mental health related seminars.
Give us a day off.
UncleRussian 3 years ago
If you care about your workers mental health then just pay hire a therapist they can go to
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago
Better yet, quit micromanaging them to death, pay them enough so they’re not always stressing about basic bills and expenses, and let them put in their scheduled 40 hours without requiring them to work a load of overtime—-which is unpaid for salaried employees, and works out to less money per hour!
Load More Replies... Ban-One 3 years ago
Yup. "Too much workload?" "Too less time off?" "Feeling like running on empty?" Yes? Then let's make a meeting about that or even better spend a whole day listening to some expert tellling me how to relax and recharge my batteries. Let's combine that with a team-bonding event. No. That's not how it works....
Henry Shane 3 years ago
No, keep teaching people, there is days off allowed and you will use them wisely if you learn proper self care. Many don't know and these are to help them.
Lem Johnson 3 years ago
They absolutely are not, they're to tick a corporate box.
Load More Replies... Mama Penguin 3 years ago
Give workers more PTO and a raise. Surefire way to boost mental health.
RM Ker 3 years ago (edited)
My sisters caregiver keeps asking for these. Unfortunately she doesnt stop being disabled and her life depends on caregivers showing up for work. Someone else has to fill in. Younger workers are taking full months off in less than 6 months at a new job, oblivious to the chaos of everyone scrambling to cover for them. "Mental health" days shouldnt come at the expense of others.
Michael Largey 3 years ago
If your staff has wide-spread mental health issues, then it's you who needs to go to a seminar or two.
A potential solution can be to establish volunteer committees “where employees formulate programs that boost morale.” Taylor pointed out that “human resources can be of great value here.”
Being aware of what your team needs is essential. There is no cookie-cutter approach to motivation. “Employers should also be sensitive to the needs of employees. A team-building happy hour may not fly for those who don’t drink or have to pick up their kids from day care. Motivational programs should take into consideration sensitivities to cultural, physical, religious, and dietary differences, too,” the workplace expert said.
“The activities should embrace inclusion. Scheduling a team softball game may seem like a great idea, but could inadvertently ostracize those with physical challenges, for instance.”
Taylor told Bored Panda that mandatory team-building events can have positive effects if they’re “highly targeted to employee needs.”
“If workers can learn from the experience, gain a better appreciation of the company’s mission, and get to know their colleagues on a more humanized basis; then it can be a win-win.”
#10
Secret Santa
SheamusFanFrom1987 3 years ago
Secret Santa is actually fun if done right. Create a budget limit and a wishlist based around it, draw lots to see who gets who and absolutely make sure to stick to the wishlist and not get too creative.
Bob La Capra 3 years ago
The only place I worked that did Secret Santa made it optional. Those that opted in had a great time as did those who didn't
Sonja 3 years ago
In my current workplace, the secret santa gifts are paid for by the company. You only have to get them and get the costs refunded. Then the gifts are given to our receptionist who wraps them, making sure that the gifts are appropriate. Even the remote teams participate. You choose something for your secret Santa from any online shop, send it to the company, the receptionist wraps it and sends it to the secret Santa to unpack during our holiday meeting. Everyone who wants to participate has to put a short introduction letter into the raffle so people know what you like if they draw your name. All longtimers talk fondly of the Christmas parties and zhe secret Santa. Even our receptionist who always gets plenty of gifts fom many people. She's our secret angel, the glue of the company. It's my first year, so I'll participating for the first time. I'm actually looking forward to it.
RedCorvette 3 years ago
I like Secret Santa, its the White Elephant I detest a Christmas game where you steal someone else’s white elephant gift.
John Bujold 3 years ago
Secret Santa always impacts someone negativity regardless of the intent. Keep it at home.
Reinaldo Fuentes 3 years ago
Haven't worked in an office environment in years, but when I did, the Secret Santa thing was the worst. Talk about a dynamic that needs to be taken out back and put out of its misery. The few times I did participate, I invariably got the one person in the office I wouldn't spit on if they were of fire and then the next year I had to tell the manically glassy-eyed person pushing the Secret Santa "no thanks" and then they were all "But why? It's fun! It's just ten bucks! No biggie! What's the matter? Why so antisocial...?" 😒
#11
Actually attending an “office” for completely remote-capable work.
We don’t need to be friends with coworkers.
The Scout 3 years ago
While a large portion of my work would be remote-capable, I prefer coming to the office for multiple reasons. My home office gear is actually better than the company's, but I prefer the short communication distances, the personal contact, and having archieves, sample collections and merchandise in reach. Also it helps with the separation of work and leisure - when I have left the office, only a major emergency will prompt me to answer my phone or use my laptop for work purposes.
blah blah blah 3 years ago
Then you'll complain that you have to sit in front of your desk at home for eight hours.
Guido Pisano 3 years ago
We don’t need to be friends with coworkers. And don't even want to be
DC 3 years ago (edited)
THAT. I was told last year that I'd need to come in. Was assigned a task that consisted of correcting an issue with a part of machinery, while the guy who drew all of it was out of work, due to having been repaired. I didn't talk any work related stuff for two weeks straight with anybody actually in the office - but "You gotta be present here as much as possible, it's really important!". Well, yeah - cost MY company money, due to hotel, cost me money due to driving, and at home, shid began piling up five of seven days, with only two to sort it out. It was so much better than wfh'ing ... not.
madamjoiedumort 3 years ago
I was friendly for the sake of getting business done but it ends after work.
Erik Rydbom 3 years ago
I enjoy my coworkers and I also enjoy working from home and being around my dog. Glad I have a career where I can be flexible with my schedule to keep everyone happy, including myself.
#12
Micromanaging. This is one of the worst toxic behaviours, as it destroys motivation and morale quickly. There's no trust within the team, you lose the opportunity to develop yourself and it burns everyone out.
I've just switched roles from working for a micromanager to a more hands off manager, I've contributed more in my new role than I did with my previous work.
Dan Bexell 3 years ago
I considered my immediate bosses' job was to find answers when I needed them, and keep me supplied with what I needed to do my job. Otherwise, just let me do my job.
Praecordia 3 years ago
This is the job of all managers. Micro managing is a person who doesn’t know how to manage but somehow got the role.
Load More Replies... Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago (edited)
It indicates they have no trust in you or any other employee. Sure, some will slack off, but deal with the culprits individually. Don’t punish everybody because of those one or two slackers. If someone is micromanaging me, I get way too self-conscious and actually perform worse than if they just left me TF alone to do my job. Just put the pile of work on my desk and leave me be. If I have a question or concern, I will ask you. Believe me, that pile of work to do will become a pile of work completed by the end of the day if you are NOT breathing down my neck the whole damn time!
Caroline 3 years ago
I quit a job once because I had a change of manager and he was a micromanager. I started making mistakes, and the worse he got, the more mistakes I made. So I quit before they got the chance to sack me. One of my colleagues used to ask me every time I spoke to her "how's his majesty treating you?" He made me send him over the emails I was going to send out so he could check it through. One time he told me to add something else to the email, which I did. Then about an hour later when I sent it back for him to review. He told me off about one part of the email, saying it wasn't needed. It was the part he told me to add
Cuppa tea? 3 years ago
My current manager. He's great at coaching, but during work he is checking upon us constantly - I work from home, but he sees on system everything I'm up to - of I'm logged early or late.
Meanwhile, Johanna and Sarah, the founders of the Work Wives podcast, told Bored Panda that mandatory team-building can "absolutely have a positive effect on workplace culture."
"In fact, a team that is unenthusiastic about building their relationships might be in the most need of strengthening them. Effective and successful team building opportunities come down to the leadership that charges them and the effectiveness with which they are run," they said. "Effective teamwork is overwhelmingly influential in workplace productivity and overall job satisfaction, so management teams would do well to do everything in their power to authentically build the dynamics of their teams and strengthen the interprofessional relationships of their employees." The keyword here is 'authentically.'
#13
Asking people to donate their PTO instead of giving someone the time off they need.
General Anaesthesia 3 years ago (edited)
And then praising and proudly "sharing" the donors' "generosity" with the whole world instead of shaming the employers for their feudal policies.
Chucky Cheezburger 3 years ago
And imagine the guilt trip that you get if you can't or just don't WANT to donate...Hoo boy. You'll be called the most heartless bastard of the office...No you guilt trippy CEO...You're the heartless one by not giving enough PTO.
SheamusFanFrom1987 3 years ago
Honestly, despite not having this practice where I come from, I seriously feel that PTO donation is a shitty practice which should not exist. Smh...
John Bujold 3 years ago
I didn't even know this was a thing. Who the hell would give away an benefit that is part of your compensation? It's a scam by a shitty HR or management team
Alex Smith 3 years ago
Where I work we get Earned Time Off and Paid Time Off. You received Earned when you travel for work outside the normal business hours. Sometimes there is just too much at the end of the year and its use or lose - which is unfortunate. But, other coworkers don't travel for work so they only have Paid Time Off. I wish I could donate some of my Paid Time Off to coworkers because I have too much. My company won't pay me for that time and it just gets deleted January 1st. I was told that each employee has a different value so donating time isn't equal. I call BS.
#14
Gossiping and drama. I have no idea why some adults still have this problem.
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago
Because most supposed adults are still stuck in a high school mentality.
Walter Brameld 3 years ago (edited)
I mean, "gossiping and drama" describes like 80% of the content of Bored Panda.
Renegade 3 years ago
Andrew and Ally had sex in his kitchen at his BFF's bachelor party while Allie and the groom to be had sex in the living room. (Based on a true story.)
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Lp Johnson 3 years ago
Because they haven't actually Matured. "Arrested development" is real. Some people are still 15 in their social development.
#15
Not being allowed to sit.
Nikrikri 3 years ago
I think this is an American workplace thing. Never saw that mentality anywhere I've lived or visited in Europe.
Salty_Sasquatch 3 years ago
I think it's ridiculous not allowing cashiers at grocery stores etc to sit. Sitting when not busy helps cashiers not be in pain at standing all day, and I think helps those cashiers be a little friendlier and more willing to help. I sure would be!
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liam newton-harding 3 years ago
Why do American companies feel the need to punish cashiers? Your first 5 minute break is in 4 hours. Do. Not. Sit. At. Any. Time!
featherytoad 3 years ago
I did some temp work at a factory and I was putting something together. It did not require that I stand. So of course I sat my a*s down and then was told that there was no sitting. WTF difference does it make as long as the job is getting done. Just a power trip.
Stacey Rae 3 years ago
In Canada, I returned to work after breaking 4 bones in my foot and with a dr form stating I should sit, I still had management telling me to stand and that it doesn't look good. Had to remind them that we have a union.
New Everywhere 3 years ago
"If you have time to lean, you have time to clean" This was on a sign at the store I worked at in the mall 🤮
Cheesenacho 3 years ago
I worked in a plant where this was the norm. I didn't like it and an 8-hour day for the employees could turn into a 10-hour day due to OT. And the whole time standing unless you were on break/lunch. As a manager, I hated it...It is a seriously old mentality.
Louisa Spoke 3 years ago
I live in Sydney Australia and I wasn’t allowed to sit down in many retail settings. Did it for years.
Johanna explained to Bored Panda why in this day and age, many women are still expected to organize and run events at work. "This is a phenomenon called 'office housework.' Women are often lopped with these tasks because they're assumed to 'just be better at them' than their male counterparts or their refusal to do them is seen as obstructive and argumentative when women should be pleasant and agreeable (another delightful leftover of our society's archaic views on strong women in the workplace)."
The way to change the situation is for an employee to exercise their leadership skills. "Do the task once and then suggest setting up a rotation system that passes the task equally throughout the workplace, or be prepared with a line that points out the inequality, such as 'I'm feeling a little event-organization-saturated. Perhaps William, the new intern, might like the experience?"
She said: "If we want to shift the dynamic of expectation, we have to be willing to assert ourselves as effectively as men do and happily be called 'difficult' for it if need be."
#16
Employees being pressured to donate to charity. I work for a big grocery chain in Florida where we are encouraged to donate out of every paycheck, but our store manager really pushes for 100% participation. If you tell him no he does a 1 time donation in your name so on paper it shows that his whole store donates. I’m all for helping people sir, but I can barely pay my own bills on this wage.
Chucky Cheezburger 3 years ago
Yeah, don't do this. If you want to help, just donate straight to the charity. Want to know why they push so hard for 100%participation? Because when you donate through the corporation, all that money is considered to come ~from the corporation~ and guess who gets the tax write off for that donation? Why, the corporation,of course...same thing happens with donations made at check-out. If you want to donate, it should go from your pocket to the charity...no middle-person.
liam newton-harding 3 years ago
Why are you, a billion dollar company, asking me , an employee...and customers...to donate to charities if your choice?...Oh, right... It's a tax write-off.
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago (edited)
And I reserve the right to choose for myself which charities I will support. Additionally, the example of a grocery store tells me the suits were expecting employees making salaries low enough that THEY should be receiving donations to give up part of their hard earned cash, just to make the company look good. F**k that.
Sarah Monk 3 years ago
Donating should be a personal decision or it is not donating but extortion
Annie 3 years ago
Years ago, various different companies I worked for would practically force or at least strong-arm employees into donating to United Way. Employees would get a pre-printed envelope addressed to United Way in with our paycheck or if we got a bonus check & I always felt like the companies were tracking to see who donated & who didn't. Left a very bitter aftertaste.
RafCo (he/him) 3 years ago
I worked for a place (I don't want to name names, but it rhymes with Comcast). Where they try to pressure the employees to donate to their Political Action Committee. WTF!!!! NO WAY!!! Hey we're a multi-billion dollar corporation, don't you want to donate some of your salary to help us bribe politicians to pass laws that will be favorable to us? (It's Comcast....and I will never find a job again)
RafCo (he/him) 3 years ago
If you haven't heard of Comcast, they own a few smaller companies you may have heard of, NBC, Telemundo, Universal Studios, and Sky Group in the UK.
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Seedy Vine 3 years ago
I work for a charity. I don't donate money to them, but I keep that candy jar full.
Twit Hunch 3 years ago
Proper response: "I prefer to donate my time to the charities I want to support. It makes me feel better, and I know they can always use the help. If you'd like, I can give your name and number to some volunteer coordinators I know." That will usually get them to stop asking you and get away from you as fast and as far as possible. :D
#17
Icebreakers and spirit questions. Don’t force people to reveal personal info about themselves. Just simply say your name and role if you need to do introductions.
Headless Roach 3 years ago
Agree, no need to make someone spill their guts about how they like to sleep naked on a thick layer of sauerkraut
Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
I've taken to responding to "where would you most like to go on holiday?" with "anywhere that doesn't insist on ice-breaking exercises". That and a snarl usually shut them up.
DKS 001 3 years ago
"Hi I'm Di. I'm a practicing wiccan and healer, and am nonbinary asexual. I can type and chew gum at the same time too! Next!" ..... how about no
Scott Rackley 3 years ago
"Yeah, my spirit animal is LetsskiptheBSasaurus. He lived in the Gettothepointocene era, which ended when the meteorite Managerwithtoomuchtime hit the earth.
Load More Replies... Doctor Strange 3 years ago
My usual response is to add "And I speak just enough Italian to order meals and assassinations." If you can do it deadpan enough, no one will ask you to do another ice breaker.
Thatkamloopsguy 3 years ago
I Have worked at the same place for 19 years and no one even knows when my birthday is.
#18
Expecting women to organize and run the mandatory fun/ team bonding events. Does not matter if men at the same level or job would never be expected to “waste” their time putting together these events, women are expected to do it, often on their own time, and we are supposed to like it too….
Poeha 3 years ago
I had to do this once, arrange a day out for the whole group. I just booked one place for the activity, food, drinks, everything. Wooden shoe golf at the farm. Lol. You just had to make the arrangement and those ppl did everything.
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Patricia McKay 3 years ago
I have organised so many work events. I hated it. So glad I no longer have to do that.
John Barber 3 years ago
I worked at a pre school where I was expected to shovel snow off the sidewalks just because I was the only male there so don't tell me it doesn't work both ways.
Maria Veronica 3 years ago (edited)
Exactly! I mean, I like it, and I believe I do a wonderful job, but it´s really weird that it´s taken for granted
Henry Shane 3 years ago
When do woman do this, where is this a thing, in 20 years only had one woman lead a team building I was a part of.
Agent 8433599 3 years ago (edited)
Im glad that this isn't an issue at your place of work, that's wonderful, but at other places women are expected to set up parties and fun raisers and stuff like that because it is seen as "their place" which is totally stupid, but it's the mindset of some people.
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Mama Penguin 3 years ago
Booze, karaoke, and sing passive aggressive songs about management. Does that work for you, Jim?
K Y 3 years ago
"Just say no to your employer, what could go wrong?" -men
Load More Replies... #19
The pressure to work when sick just because you WFH ("because that's what everyone else does" - and everyone thinks like this).
John Bujold 3 years ago
If you work from home and your sick it's the same as if you where at work. Call the boss tell them your sick and you're taking the day, shut the phone and the computer off and take care of yourself
Alex Smith 3 years ago
I agree. I work from home and when I am sick I just want to go to bed. Just because I am home doesn't mean I want to work. I want to rest.
Rostit . 3 years ago
If I'm sick I take PTO. If I feel like going hiking on a Wednesday I take PTO. If I feel like sitting on my fat a*s and playing video games I take PTO.
Roland Nijveld 3 years ago
Still stupid tho it would cost you your PTO. We have infinite sick days here at 70% salary. Next to the atleast 4 weeks of PTO
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Cuppa tea? 3 years ago
I do WFH, was out on sick leave as I lost my voice, which is kinda important in call centre. But another colleague was working with broken leg.
Sarah Monk 3 years ago
Never done this, never been asked, never heard of transferring time off!
#20
This is education-specific, but admin giving praise and compliments to teachers who come in early and stay late, and work on the weekends. They call it "dedication" but honestly it's working way beyond contract hours for no pay. I used to do this every week and my life improved so much when I finally stopped. I love my students but I shouldn't be considered less dedicated because I won't work for free.
Eric S. 3 years ago
Here's what I learned works everywhere: you are valued based on what you're paid. Sell yourself off as the bargain basement special, don't be surprised if you're taken for granted. The trick is to not put any attitude into the not putting in extra hours; don't say "I'm not getting paid to do this". Just don't do it, and if there's no other way (for instance you're left holding the bag last teacher in and a parent is late, you can't dump the child off in the street) make sure you file for overtime.
Praecordia 3 years ago
Teachers are usually salary so there is no overtime. My friend complains about this as well, she teaches at a Christian private school and is even expected to attend church every Sunday.
Load More Replies... Michael Largey 3 years ago
As a high school teacher, I arrived early and usually was the last teacher to leave the building. It was not a matter of selflessness or dedication. Outwitting a hundred and fifty adolescents on a daily basis requires time and preparation.
Den Ver 3 years ago
That typically means 2,350 hours/year . . . no overtime pay . . . Thank you for your service.
Load More Replies... Pittsburgh rare 3 years ago
For some reason people tend to think that teachers should work around the clock because it's "vocational" F**k that. After years of teaching, l only do what l'm paid for
patricia patricia 3 years ago
It doesn't matter how vocational your job is, or how much you love it, you still have a life. Work to live, don't live to work. This idea about devoting a lot of time to work to show dedication is one of the biggest lies of capitalism.
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Walter Brameld 3 years ago (edited)
"I am exactly as dedicated as you pay me to be. If you want more dedication, I need more money. You want overtime dedication, give me overtime pay."
Maggie Fulton 3 years ago
My mom was a grade school teacher, and I saw how hard she worked. You couldn’t pay me enough to do this.
David Phillips 3 years ago
In Mexico schools call it "wearing the T-shirt", but it's still toxic.
Mike Tayse 3 years ago
if you show up to work every day and have a good work ethic, you will be punished.
#21
Bosses not listening to the ones below them out of ego
Snorkeldorf 3 years ago (edited)
This is a really good one. They don't do our job, they don't know how long things take. They usually are clueless as to what skills we possess that are greatly beneficial to the role we are in. Yet we are not consulted when it comes to processes or hiring new employees.
𝖊𝖆 3 years ago
Felt this one. Was asked 45 minutes before my shift ended the other night (10 hour shift) by my boss’ boss to do something that would ‘only take 10 minutes’. Due to seniority felt like I had to say yes. An HOUR later I was still only 1/3 done, said boss’ boss was still logged in so explained it was more complex and that I was clocking out for the day. Asked if I could ensure it’s completed the next day. So ended up logging in almost an hour earlier the next day, and it took about 3 hours in the end to complete. Then it was noticed that I hadn’t got any of my other work done… wonder why -_-
Load More Replies... Jon Steensen 3 years ago
recepy for catastrophy. While a boss is supposed to have a finger on the pulse regarding a lot of issues, he cannot be an expert on everything. The smart bosses knows this, and hence they understand that they are a part of a team and that somebody may have some knowledge that they lack, and hence is better qualified to set the direction for the company in that field. In the company the saying goes that the decitions are taken where the competences are, e.g. the employees are given the power in their specific field, so e.g. the dections regarding the electronics is taken in the electronics department and the engineer is taking the decitions regarding the mechanics etc. while the manager is only working with the taske of binding the departments togheter and make sure that the team functions.
#22
Work wives and Work husbands. it’s fine to have friends at work, but “coupling” of people who work together seems inappropriate on a lot of levels.
Chucky Cheezburger 3 years ago
Where I work, we're partnered up with another mechanic to work out of a truck at work sites and facilities. Five days a week, 8 hours a day (except for sick and vacation time) you work shoulder to shoulder with the same person. That's about as close to a "work spouse" as I think you can get. My work partner of 10 years passed away a year ago in December and it hit harder than I thought it would. I was kinda like losing a spouse in a weird way. So this can be a thing in certain jobs and situations.
Praecordia 3 years ago
I don’t think that a work wife/husband means what a wife/husband mean outside of work. There’s never anything sexual, it’s usually someone you work well with at work.
Hobby Hopper 3 years ago
A relationship doesn't have to be physical to be unfaithful. There is such a thing as an emotional affair. I would never use the terms wife or husband about a coworker unless they literally were my spouse. I just don't like the implications of those words.
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Remi 3 years ago
At current job I found a 'work spouse' for the time in life. My partner doesn't mind in the slightest. But maybe I don't fully understand what this term implies? For me this colleague is someone I talk to every working day, we joke around and always have each other's back. It doesn't rob my life partner of anything. Should it or will it? What are the risks that I don't see?
keighterz 3 years ago
It becomes a problem when other coworkers really feed into it and make inappropriate comments. If coworkers are actually “shipping” the two people. I had to seriously step back from a workplace friendship because I realized coworkers were spreading rumors and wanted us to get together. Really sucked because he was a cool guy but we both had partners and neither of us wanted to look like cheaters, even though we literally only talked at work.
Load More Replies... RafCo (he/him) 3 years ago
This is never a formal relationship sponsored by the company. It's usually a tongue and cheek thing that is said about a male and female coworker who work very closely together. My wife used to say that about a woman I worked very closely with. We were both managers at the same company, and we were also good friends, and had worked together for over a decade across other companies. But she was friends with my wife, and I with her husband as well. I wouldn't have used the term, but my wife thought it was good fun. There is a guy I had a similar relationship with, and my wife referred to him as my work husband. Interestingly, all three of us met at the same company about 13 years ago.
zovjraar me 3 years ago
idk... for me it's more about knowing how the co-worker works. if someone can tell me "do the thing" and i know what they mean, i would call that person my work spouse. when you work with someone long enough, you get to know how they think. it's not about attraction or even liking the person.
#23
The whole department getting yelled at for one persons wrong doing. Address the person. Fix the problem. Don’t yell at all of us!
LilliVB 3 years ago (edited)
Don't yell, period. If someone does anything wrong there are other more civil and effective ways to let them know why a mistake needs to be fixed and avoided. Yelling doesn't solve anything (EDIT typo)
Remi 3 years ago
Yup, agree. Plus, it doesn't motivate anyone. Ever. Why is it still a norm?
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Cory Tollman 3 years ago
The amount of things my department (pharmacy) ends up doing because one nurse or one physician messed up something is ridiculous. It often comes down to legal going with the "did you do everything possible to make sure this error didn't happen"? YES! We supposedly hired people who who know how to do their dang jobs!
Seedy Vine 3 years ago (edited)
I worked for a passport office where the manager would holler, "WHICH ONE OF YOU MADE THIS MISTAKE?!" several times per day. Everyone got about 15 minutes of training. To do passports correctly. And we were scolded for asking questions. What a nightmare! I had to quit before I slapped someone.
Randy Sanders 3 years ago
Yell at me and all bets are off. I WILL go tell you to go f**k yourself, out loud. I don't care who you are. It's about having a little respect for one another.
John Barber 3 years ago
Any boss who yells at me better be prepared for an a*s kicking. I am NOT in the army anymore b***h.
Kise Miarse 3 years ago
Even if they're addressing it civilly - go directly to the person. Unless it's a system/department wide issue, the whole crew doesn't need to be constantly hearing about every little potential issue or error. It's very demoralizing and feels like you're always "in trouble" even if none of it relates directly to you.
Connie Brown 3 years ago
Please!!! I was a new hire with absolutely no training. (The person who was supposed to train me resented me because I was taking the favorite part of her job.) The boss came into the room and screamed at me because I did something incorrectly. I quit exactly three weeks after my start date. It was stupid of me to stay that long.
#24
Forcing people to stay until a certain time even if their workload is complete because you HAVE to be there.
We only get so much time in this world, I hate having to be somewhere only for the reason of having to be there.
That and giving more work if you complete your work early.
Linda C 3 years ago
Except I can't afford a reduction in my pay, so I stay.
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Sally Close 3 years ago
I spent 16 years working for 2 different large insurance companies in Australia. Have noticed that the people that take forever or are incredibly lazy get away with it. Whereas if you work your butt off and do a great job you get rewarded with the lazy f*****s work! Hated it
Jon Steensen 3 years ago
It is ok to give more work to an efficient worker who spends less time solving the task he was given .... provided that the extra workload and number of task that he can solve in the same amount of time is reflected in his paycheck, so he benefits from his above avarage performance. But when being effective only resolves in more work and no extra benefit, it is highly demotivational, and all that you as a business owner achieve by doing that is a bright worker that will only put in the bare minimum and play solitare the rest of the time (or do something else that he likes, but which is not productive for you).
AW 3 years ago
this is the give an take of salaried vs hourly. if you're salaried, you can go home when your work is done, but you run the chance of having to work late if your workload is higher. with hourly work, once your hours are up, you go home, if you stay longer you get overtime, but if there's no work for you and you go home early, you don't get paid
Remi 3 years ago
This is such a weird concept! I had meeting after hour where I had to participate in case any questions might arise that concern my work. Well, nothing did. I just spent 3h sitting at the useless call with my camera on (for some reason this was also a must) not able to do anything else
#25
I once had to put in $75 toward a sick person’s gift So high gifting that’s mandated
Mark Bayliss 3 years ago
When they say "had to" does it mean felt obliged or pressured or does it mean they had no choice and forced to? There is no way I would donate that amount of money and it must be illegal to make it mandatory surely??
Dee 3 years ago
By mandatory they mean someone walking up and being like "hey we all want to buy Jane a gift and are collecting $75 from each person" - not mandated by the employer, so therefore not illegal. But, made to feel obligatory/ mandatory by social customs.
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Baseball is Life 3 years ago
Wow! That must have been quite a gift, that's a lot of money to donate towards a gift
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago
The gifts and the birthday cakes, ffs. Nickel and diming employees not making huge salaries is all it is. Let the f*****g high salaries suits pay for it all. Of course they won’t, but they should.
GirlFriday 3 years ago
NOPE, NOPE, NOPE, NOPE. Gifts are optional and there is never a set expectation of money. It is, "Hey, we are getting the boss a birthday gift if you would like to contribute, here is my Venmo." Then the gift that is purchased is done so based on the amount collected, or the organizer buys a gift in THEIR budget and gets whatever reimbursement they get.
kaycee14 3 years ago
In American corporate culture you're only supposed to "gift down." Meaning you get (small) gifts for people who report to you, not for your bosses.
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Yoga Kitty 3 years ago
Donating towards a gift with a high value, in case this was a serious question.
Load More Replies... Sarah Monk 3 years ago
Not if I don’t know the person and my donation is private and my choice of amount
Amber Seanez 3 years ago
I certainly hope you make six figures if $75 is mandatory. I get paid $8 an hour and often don't make $75 in a shift
#26
Not being given the tools to train new people properly. It’s crazy that you’re expected to continue with your regular, heavy workload while trying to train. I always feeling like I’m failing the person I’m training.
Elio 3 years ago (edited)
Mood. I was helping train a new person last year and we only had one day a week we worked together but her supervisor was lazy af about training people. So she was only learning new things when I was there, which sucked because my primary job is not to train people. The supervisor firmly kisses the manager's a$$ though so that's why the problems he causes don't get addressed.
𝖊𝖆 3 years ago (edited)
I got asked to train the person who got the promotion I went for. Politely declined. Got asked again. This time it wasn’t so polite. Basically said if I wasn’t good enough for the job, how can I be good enough to the train the person who is apparently better than I am for that job? Got asked again… this time I said i’m actually a bit upset now and said if you ask me again I will quit. Now i’m worried they’re going to ask me again! I would love to quit but you know, bills. Edit: I am generally the person that does training in the office, am normally happy to do it and have qualifications. But I draw the line at training someone who got the promotion, to do the job I am not apparently not able to do, but know enough about to train the better person how to do it …
Load More Replies... RM Ker 3 years ago
How about training people from the kindness of your heart because your boss has no idea how to do your job and you feel bad for the new guy, only to have them later stab you in the back when you decide to take off the training wheels and expect them to do their own jobs because you need to do yours.
Scott Rackley 3 years ago
I feel this. In my job I've trained quite a few apprentices (my job requires a 4 year apprenticeship), and I have to fight to get them the tools they need.
Kathryn Baylis 3 years ago
Your company actually trains new hires? Hell, most companies hardly tell you how to do anything anymore. I’ve even had managers tell me if I need to know how to do anything, just ask them. Well ffs, I’m new here, I don’t know what I need to know how to do. It’s YOUR job to tell me what I need to know to do my job!
Jon Steensen 3 years ago
This problem comes in a lot of variation, but what it always boils down to is administrations expecting you to do extra tasks without setting aside the resources (money, time etc.) to complete it. A good habit when asked to do such things, is to say: "yes I can do that, but which one of task A,B or C that I am currently working on are you willing to put on hold, so I can dedicate my resources to this new task? It is way to easy for management to overlook/forget the cost of their proposals, so shining a spotlight on the consequences of doing what they suggest and negociating from there, is the way to avoid the stress/burnout that often result from just saying YES, and have things burn down due to overload.
Remi 3 years ago
I had training only once when starting a new job. Well, at least so far. Usually they couldn't find a replacement for too long, no one at the company knows well what and how exactly was done at that position, just please go and do something starting now. Training is awesome! I hope more companies have it and do it systematically, with an adequate compensation for the time spent by more experienced employee on the new one
Mandy Delaforce (PC Girl) 3 years ago
Training? What's that? I've always been thrown in the deep end with barely even a hand over.
Cecelia Lankutis 3 years ago
our company aquired several companies all at once and the only training was "throw people off a cliff to see where they land". Anyone who had come up through the organization into management was pushed into retirement. We now have upper management's inlaws who got jobs because of connections, not because they knew what they were doing. There's also the challenge of now having to train through chat, not in person. Technical stuff needs one on one explanation. Too much gets lost in chat. It's obvious upper management doesn't understand what it takes to do our jobs. We can't ponder the meaning of the universe and our own self-important philosophies over chat the way upper management does. We need specific directions.
#27
When things go wrong, focusing on blame rather than solutions. In my experience, most people, even lazy ones, want to do a good job and when they fail it's due to poor systems or unclear expectations.
Of course there can be a "bad fit" but truly malicious bad actors are extremely rare.
Headless Roach 3 years ago
As in "The secret to success is knowing who to blame for your failures."?
Remi 3 years ago
I have when blaming and all the negativity starts right when the problem arises. I mean we are in the middle of the crisis, can we solve it first and then analyze who should have done what differently? In my case it also includes people letting their emotions go at work place. We are all frustrated, does it help anyone to hear one person publicly moan and yell and suffer? I don't think so.
RafCo (he/him) 3 years ago
Yes, this behavior has caused me to leave companies quickly. I worked at a place where my manager would make a mistake. He would get called out by his boss, and his response would be to blame me for his mistake. After the second time I left. On the flip side, I worked for a high volume trading firm. Somebody made a mistake that actually cost the company a LOT of money. Nobody was fired. We had a post-mortem to try and understand what happened and why, but the focus of the meeting was purely on how to prevent it from happening again. Lunch was provided for the meeting, and absolutely NOBODY used the word "fault". I would highly recommend that place.
Shay Baranowski 3 years ago
in my experience a bad manager will cause division between their dept heads. i think they do this so they are so busy blaming each other they don't notice how bad the manager is..
Shelby Moonheart 3 years ago
I didn't do a process correctly and was explaining to a manager, who said, "I don't care whose fault caused the issue, what are the solutions we can do?" Great person. It's the way it should be, focus on solutions not blame.
Aiden Brough 3 years ago
This works the other way as well. If there is a fault, instead of everyone running for the hills or trying to avoid blame, accept it and learn from it. The problem is most are unwilling to do this are likely to simply repeat the same mistakes over and over again.
#28
Moms getting priority with vacation. At my job I have been there over 20 years so I get 5 weeks vacation. At the first of every quarter we are supposed to request any vacation we want for the upcoming quarter. I always request on the first day. Inevitably my boss will come to me and tell me I need to change my days because Becky wants to take her kids somewhere on those days. Usually a week or so before I was supposed to take off. Last year I lost 4 vacation days.
Maggie Fulton 3 years ago
Do you have an HR department? Or is Becky in charge of that? Not fair at all.
Jane Cortez 3 years ago
How is anyone’s time less valuable because Becky chose to ‘breed?’ This is an HR issue and, discrimination.
𝖊𝖆 3 years ago
Worst excuse is “but it’s their birthday!”. If it’s your kids birthday, it’s the same every year, you know that in advance. Why would you not book it in advance and try and take it off last minute??
Cory Tollman 3 years ago
I used to work with a guy whose birthday was on Valentines Day. He didn't give a c**p either way for years and then the last few years I worked with him he'd try to get the day off at the last minute because his girlfriend expected to do something. That guy could plan his way out of a wet paper bag.
Load More Replies... Michael Largey 3 years ago
Becky's situation comes from the fact that someone already did f her.
Load More Replies... Taibhse Sealgair 3 years ago
This. "Sorry, boss, but my vacation was submitted, approved, and has already been paid for. Unless I'm reimbursed for it well ahead of time, I'm obligated to take it."
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#29
This is different but a very outgoing likeable employee not having to follow the rules because she is popular with everyone in the office.
UKGrandad 3 years ago
Do you get the feeling that there's a back story to this one?
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Hobby Hopper 3 years ago
I had the displeasure of working for a call center because the company I worked for before had to make cutbacks and lay off a bunch of people, including me, and I had to find a job fast. The call center had strict rules about what you could and could not say on the phone, which basically hamstrung us as sales people. They also strictly dictated how you managed your time (only 5 minutes per hour for bathroom breaks, etc.). For the employees that were top sellers and consistently made sales over quota, none of this mattered. You'd see them wandering around the room socializing with smug arrogant looks on their faces, and management would just turn a blind eye to it. Their calls were worse. They would not only ignore policies about what you could say, they'd misrepresent the product, basically lie through their teeth and say whatever it took to make a sale. Again, nobody called them on it. If anything ever blew up, they' just point to *official* policy and blame the employee.
GirlFriday 3 years ago
I don't know about this one. I work for a very large company and when employees reach a certain level, they are given a leeway to work from home more often, adjust their schedules, etc. It isn't that they aren't "following the rules" they have earned privileges for exemplary work.
michelle 3 years ago
i hate this, work starts on the dot 08:00 but my co worker thinks just because she is the likeable person in the office she can come 08;30 to work and everyday is a different excuse, i mean just get earlier up for fu** sake, and its been going on like this for two years now.
XenoMurph 3 years ago
Haha, this is me. From school through to every job I've ever had. It's great. I also work hard though. Silly rules are silly if my work is already done.
Agent 8433599 3 years ago
You might not realize it, but doing this is rude, disrespectful and causes stress to other people.
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#30
Mandatory potlucks
GirlFriday 3 years ago
NOPE, NOPE, NOPE. I REFUSE to participate in pitch-ins at my job especially when there are cross-department pitch-ins. I don't know these people and as the song goes, "You can't eat at everybody's house." I am not risking getting a cat-hair cookie or roach-infested potato salad because someone thinks it "promotes unity" in the workplace.
Stephen Wild 3 years ago
I know of one workplace that stopped doing this after everyone got a serious case of food poisoning from a potluck supper...
Vesna 3 years ago
People also tend to bring such mix of food, and when you eat a bunch of different c**p - you can feel sick just after that. I am a picky eater, so when I used to do potlucks, I'll just eat my own food - lol.
Load More Replies... SheamusFanFrom1987 3 years ago
We have these, though the more expensive food is almost always bought by the Head of Department and Managers. The rest of us mostly just bring something home-cooked or little tidbits/snacks/finger food. It's actually fun if you limit your expectations.
Yoga Kitty 3 years ago
Everybody brings some food (home cooked or bought) and you share the meal with each other.
Load More Replies... Yoga Kitty 3 years ago
Yes, we often have breakfast together the last working day before Christmas shutdown.
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#31
Non-confrontation that leads to drama. If you got a problem with how I do things, tell me straightaway. Don’t bother tattling with another coworker cause it’s not going to fix things, if anything I’ll think you’re intending on ruining my reputation instead
Praecordia 3 years ago (edited)
This is just people who have no balls to say anything to anyones face which is 95% of people lately. It’s as if your trained not to be confrontational because it’s deemed as bad. I’ve never handled an issue quicker without confronting it.
Roddfergg 3 years ago
Because these days you will be hauled into HR for making it a "hostile work environment". People these days cannot take criticism, no matter how it is framed.
Load More Replies... RM Ker 3 years ago
Its not about confrontation. They are trying to make you look bad to make themselves look better. Our team had a secratary who hated me for being honest and good at my job, and literally waited for any reason to start bashing me behind my back, especially to my boss. Narcissists are everywhere.
#32
Commenting on other people's food choices.
Littlemiss 3 years ago
Had a boss omfg good look at you food, I'd be embarrassed to be seen eating that! Can you afford a real meal? That's so bad for you, you're setting a bad example. You should lose weight, no wonder you don't eating that c**p. The list goes on
Mama Penguin 3 years ago
Can you afford a real meal? How out of touch was your boss? Maybe pay your employees more so they can afford more. What a d**k. I'm sorry you went through that.
Load More Replies... GlitterQueen541 3 years ago
Just let me eat my bagel without telling me how many calories are in it!!! Yes, this comes from a personal workplace experience that I'm still salty bout.
patricia patricia 3 years ago
Some foods should not be taken to work, because the smell is terrible and other people may not like it. However, I hate people giving their opinion about other people's food, like saying something is unhealthy or it has too much salt, sugar, etc. If nobody asks for your opinion, just keep it to yourself.
#33
Toxic positivity. In a previous job I had, it felt like saying things with the proper positivity accoutrements was more important than getting information across or speaking directly. So if we needed to bring up an issue, it had to be sandwiched in between compliments, exclamation points, smiley faces, “no worries if not!”s, etc. to the point where the actual message itself was watered down if not lost entirely. Management gave so much lip service to direct communication (we had a whole seminar on it - despite needing that time to get our real work done) but any time I tried to speak directly I’d get a DM saying I need to reword my message, or asking if I’m okay.
liam newton-harding 3 years ago
Hey, you are looking good today, not everyone could pull that off...Per my last email, where the fu@k is the report our department needed two weeks ago?...It always impresses me how little effort you put into your work.
Taibhse Sealgair 3 years ago
Don't know why, but this reminds me of the old "job references that sound like compliments but are actually insults." "You'd be really lucky to get John to work for you!" "The quality of John's work is just mind-blowing!" "No else in our office puts the same amount time, energy, and effort into their jobs as John puts into his!"
Load More Replies... Remi 3 years ago
Such a pain! I prefer direct communications and direct doesn't mean rude! It's also quite frustrating when my department is obliged to be obliging while others don't have such requirement from their bosses. So being super super hyped and polite for everything while others communicate ad they wish makes me scream inside so many times, my inner voice is chronically hoarse
Jon Steensen 3 years ago
This is especially bad when it gets converted to disillutional posters, whereby the HR thinks that their job is done. It would be nice if all the problems disapeared if you just reminded people to have a positive mindset, but your mentality is often not enough when the resources are lacking, or people do not know how to solve a task. So if you want to deal with a particular problem, you must accept the fact that a proper solution may cost you a bit more than 5 minutes and some paper.
Praecordia 3 years ago
Tip toes with words. This seems to be the norm now especially for corporate or work from home places.
#34
Colleagues who are suppose to train you, don't train you. So you are forced to learn the job yourself. Then that colleague criticizes how you are doing everything wrong. So you ask them for more training so they can show you how to do it right - but they say they are too busy. That colleague treats you like you've been working there for 25 years and assumes you know all this stuff, ignores the fact you are new. They overwhelm you with information, make you feel like a total idiot because you don't know this stuff, and the colleague expects you to know all their 25 plus years of knowledge in a week!
kath morgan 3 years ago
They are probably upset that they are orienting you on top of their workload, and effectively acting as supervisor for you without the pay raise. They shouldn’t be taking it out on you though.
Darren White 3 years ago
This just happened to me, started a job 2 weeks ago and one of the guys who was supposed to be showing me the ropes, was making all the excuses under the sun not to show me or shooting off to speak on his phone! The production manager asked why I wasn't pulling my weight, hardly surprising when the guy's who are supposed to be training me won't.
Surfing Panda 3 years ago
Colleagues training you... by just reading their notes to you or just telling you everything once. "These papers should be put in copy to Mark. His basket is the one that's says Bob. Bob left us 5 years ago but we know his replacer is Mark."
RM Ker 3 years ago
Colleague or boss? Theres a big difference. Its not your coworkers job to train you. I trained all our new people out of compassion to have them expect me to keep doing their jobs for them because they couldnt figure it out or simply didnt want to do it and then complain about me to my boss for not "helping" them. Then my boss would give me sh** for not being helpful to get me to keep doing her job for her while giving me absolutely no power to address any of the many problems that she didnt. One day I realized she had transferred almost everybody elses work to me while they were all working like 3 days a week and made more money than me. So no, its not your "colleagues" job to do anything for you.
Heather Talma 3 years ago
I was once "trained" by someone whose idea of training was to just do everything at their normal breakneck pace in front of me.
Andrea Wylie 3 years ago
I have to train my co workers because my immediate supervisorS don't know how to do my job. and then they go on and on about how EASY my job is. I've trained about six people this year, 2 have survived training.
Jacob B. 3 years ago
Happened to me. But it was obvious the person training me wanted a promotion and saw me as a threat. Once she convinced the manager I was damaged goods and things looked bad, I got another job within a week and a half....on my first day, was told my skills dictated that I shouldn't have a manager and will report instead directly to the VP. First day and promoted. Someone trying to step on me to get promoted forced me to leave and get promoted.
#35
not announcing someone is leaving until the last minute.
Shelby Moonheart 3 years ago
Especially when the new person has a role with some responsibility.
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Edward Monks 3 years ago
I recently moved roles, i did not want anyone to know i was leaving my department. Surely its up to the person if they want it known or not?
Kise Miarse 3 years ago
Haha at my last job, the manager announced I was leaving a few days after I'd already left! She had a legitimate reason for forgetting, but it was still pretty funny. 😄
El MasChingon 3 years ago
who cares, this isn't important you aren't friends you are co workers
Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
We've been through a phase where they gleefully announce new joiners, and I contact them a few days later, only to get no response, then find out they left the next day.
Load More Replies... #36
Making jokes asking if they are going to a date or an interview or wtv.
Hobby Hopper 3 years ago
Not job related, but a younger and more naive me was hanging out with a platonic friend. The comedian at the show we were at asked us if we were *together*, and I (being very literal and not understanding the connotations and actually thinking the comedian was a bit of an idiot, since we were clearly sitting at the same small table and knew each other) loudly announced to everyone that we *were* together. It took about a microsecond for my friend to correct me. Of course, the comedian just fed off of that, but mercifully backed off when he saw the stunned and confused look on my face. I still feel the embarrassment of that one.
#37
Staying after your working hours when it's not an emergency. It makes it seem normal and makes people that leave on time look bad.
And on that note: staying until later because your team decided to have an extra long lunch hour or decided to take a 30 to 45 mins break to sing happy birthday, eat cake and chat (what happens frequently when you have a lot of people working there).
Then either you look bad because you just spent 10 mins chatting or you look bad because you didn't stay late to compensate. F annoying.
Seedy Vine 3 years ago (edited)
At my office there was a lady who stayed late and got hit by a car the moment she walked outside.
Praecordia 3 years ago
Or making people feel guilty for leaving after a 14hr day by saying your not leaving yet are you? Yes Im f*****g leaving, I refuse to be here for 15 hrs! If someone opens and has literally been there all day and is leaving, don’t try to make them feel bad about putting in a 14 hour day when people who are closing showed up at 5.
What do you think ?
XenoMurph 3 years ago
Some of these seem to be written by someone who refuses to have any joy at work, and just doesn't like other humans. A friendly work environment is a good thing. A bit sad to sit at your desk doing only your mandated work, snarling at everyone and resentful at people enjoying having friends.
patricia patricia 3 years ago
I think people here complain about mandatory stuff. If you enjoy making friends at work, it's great. I prefer to have as little to do with my workmates as possible. I will help people, talk to them during coffee break and have a laugh, but don't ask me to go to company Christmas dinners or weekend activities because I won't go. I value my private time too much, and my work is just a job.
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Steve Barnett 3 years ago (edited)
I’m on the autistic spectrum (aspergers) and I get overwhelmed by the constant inane chatter about nothing, people discussing Xmas every day from November onwards, people that know that I don’t enjoy Xmas, but that doesn’t stop them reminding me every day for 2 months, then there’s the weather, also some people specifically talk about one thing only; one bloke I knew only talked about money. Seriously, it was always ‘I got a great deal here or there’ etc. I like serenity, peace and quiet. I'm not saying that we should all shut up at work, I'm just saying that some people just don't know that we're not all extroverts who like to be the centre of attention.
XenoMurph 3 years ago
Many people are also socially awkward and struggle to talk about anything other than that one thing that somehow they developed a habit of talking about. I talk about things I learned in the most recent science podcast I listened to. That's annoying to most people too I suppose.
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Patti Vance 3 years ago
seems that most of these applied to when i was working. finally had enough when i had a severe infection following surgery on my ankle. dr told me to keep elevated and gave massive doses of antibiotics. work said if i could elevate at home i could do so at work. so returned with my leg on my desk & puss and gunk oozing out. even my colleagues were appalled & protested my return. finally had enough and resigned. they didn't mind the resignation but were very upset that HR informed me they had neglected to tell me that i could take early retirement due to resulting disability. they told coworkers i was fired but that backfired when i had to attend mandatory health insurance meetings for continued coverage for current and retired employees. gotta love karma
Joyce Blodgett 2 years ago (edited)
One thing that occurred within the ICU I worked in was my ceasing to observe the silly holidays of "Christmas," "NY," etc., all but Thanksgiving. I used to be THE decorator for all holidays, often going in on a day off to make the unit look very festive, but it was for free (supplying everything on my own dime, too). Once I decided to stop all of that for personal reasons, it threw the entire unit into a tizzy. Suddenly, there were no more "holiday" decorations, no more tons of holiday foods (again, always at my personal expense), nothing. For the last 7 years of working before retiring, I was harangued, though I never condemned anyone else for their wanting to do things, but I wasn't about to decorate for things I no longer believed in, nor would I pay for all that. Nasty nurses got super angry at me because I "ruined THEIR holiday spirit."
wowbagger 3 years ago
That's because they're preparing students to be "good" employees
Load More Replies... Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
The worst thing is when people make assumptions that you think or know what they do. I've had a few over the years: "You've probably all done..." - I hadn't. Explain it for those who haven't, don't assume they have. "The usual drill will apply". This was for fumigating carpets, and one had to avoid the area for 15 minutes. Not knowing the usual drill could have caused health issues. "Most of you know who I am". This was on a presentation that was being videoed and shown to other teams, who wouldn't have known who he was. Much better to begin "For those of you who don't know, I am..." The most annoying though has to be HR documents concerning redundancy, when they issue an FAQ (which is in itself daft, since no questions have been asked at the time they announce it). What's the first question that comes to one's mind? Will it be me? How will it be decided? When will it happen? What will I get? No, in HR's mind, the most important question is "How does this fit in with our strategy?"
madamjoiedumort 3 years ago
There shouldn't even be social events. You're there to work it's not highschool
Paul Rabit 3 years ago
Technically you’re supposed to be in high school to learn, so by your logic there shouldn’t be social events there either…
Load More Replies... XenoMurph 3 years ago
Some of these seem to be written by someone who refuses to have any joy at work, and just doesn't like other humans. A friendly work environment is a good thing. A bit sad to sit at your desk doing only your mandated work, snarling at everyone and resentful at people enjoying having friends.
patricia patricia 3 years ago
I think people here complain about mandatory stuff. If you enjoy making friends at work, it's great. I prefer to have as little to do with my workmates as possible. I will help people, talk to them during coffee break and have a laugh, but don't ask me to go to company Christmas dinners or weekend activities because I won't go. I value my private time too much, and my work is just a job.
Load More Replies... Steve Barnett 3 years ago (edited)
I’m on the autistic spectrum (aspergers) and I get overwhelmed by the constant inane chatter about nothing, people discussing Xmas every day from November onwards, people that know that I don’t enjoy Xmas, but that doesn’t stop them reminding me every day for 2 months, then there’s the weather, also some people specifically talk about one thing only; one bloke I knew only talked about money. Seriously, it was always ‘I got a great deal here or there’ etc. I like serenity, peace and quiet. I'm not saying that we should all shut up at work, I'm just saying that some people just don't know that we're not all extroverts who like to be the centre of attention.
XenoMurph 3 years ago
Many people are also socially awkward and struggle to talk about anything other than that one thing that somehow they developed a habit of talking about. I talk about things I learned in the most recent science podcast I listened to. That's annoying to most people too I suppose.
Load More Replies... Patti Vance 3 years ago
seems that most of these applied to when i was working. finally had enough when i had a severe infection following surgery on my ankle. dr told me to keep elevated and gave massive doses of antibiotics. work said if i could elevate at home i could do so at work. so returned with my leg on my desk & puss and gunk oozing out. even my colleagues were appalled & protested my return. finally had enough and resigned. they didn't mind the resignation but were very upset that HR informed me they had neglected to tell me that i could take early retirement due to resulting disability. they told coworkers i was fired but that backfired when i had to attend mandatory health insurance meetings for continued coverage for current and retired employees. gotta love karma
Joyce Blodgett 2 years ago (edited)
One thing that occurred within the ICU I worked in was my ceasing to observe the silly holidays of "Christmas," "NY," etc., all but Thanksgiving. I used to be THE decorator for all holidays, often going in on a day off to make the unit look very festive, but it was for free (supplying everything on my own dime, too). Once I decided to stop all of that for personal reasons, it threw the entire unit into a tizzy. Suddenly, there were no more "holiday" decorations, no more tons of holiday foods (again, always at my personal expense), nothing. For the last 7 years of working before retiring, I was harangued, though I never condemned anyone else for their wanting to do things, but I wasn't about to decorate for things I no longer believed in, nor would I pay for all that. Nasty nurses got super angry at me because I "ruined THEIR holiday spirit."
wowbagger 3 years ago
That's because they're preparing students to be "good" employees
Load More Replies... Apatheist Account2 3 years ago
The worst thing is when people make assumptions that you think or know what they do. I've had a few over the years: "You've probably all done..." - I hadn't. Explain it for those who haven't, don't assume they have. "The usual drill will apply". This was for fumigating carpets, and one had to avoid the area for 15 minutes. Not knowing the usual drill could have caused health issues. "Most of you know who I am". This was on a presentation that was being videoed and shown to other teams, who wouldn't have known who he was. Much better to begin "For those of you who don't know, I am..." The most annoying though has to be HR documents concerning redundancy, when they issue an FAQ (which is in itself daft, since no questions have been asked at the time they announce it). What's the first question that comes to one's mind? Will it be me? How will it be decided? When will it happen? What will I get? No, in HR's mind, the most important question is "How does this fit in with our strategy?"
madamjoiedumort 3 years ago
There shouldn't even be social events. You're there to work it's not highschool
Paul Rabit 3 years ago
Technically you’re supposed to be in high school to learn, so by your logic there shouldn’t be social events there either…
Load More Replies...
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