Tired Of Patients Not Wanting To Reveal Their Biological Sex This Person Went On A Rant To Explain Why It Can End Tragically
Your life is more important than your feelings getting hurt — that’s the message one healthcare professional is trying to send everyone. According to Imgur user oldfishnewfish, it’s very important to tell the medical staff your biological sex even if the question ‘triggers’ you. Your life depends on giving the right answer.
Oldfishnewfish posted a long and winding rant online that explains exactly how much correct treatment and diagnosis can depend on whether you’re a man or a woman due to simple human biology differences. The detailed scientific explanation went viral. It was viewed over 120,000 times and got more than 4,200 upvotes. (Facebook cover image: sturti)
Image credits: vgajic (not the actual photo)
“If a medical professional asks your sex/gender (however you perceive it being asked is irrelevant) TELL THEM”
The inspiration for oldfishnewfish’s rant struck after they had an aggressive patient who was ‘triggered’ by questions about their biological gender. These questions were necessary to do thorough health issues check-up, and were not intended to make anyone feel threatened or unwanted.
According to the healthcare professional, knowing whether a person is born male or female is necessary. People who get overly defensive or openly aggressive are hurting not only themselves but also those trying to help them.
Most Imgur users supported oldfishnewfish’s viewpoint. Among those commenting were transgender people who highlighted that they, too, believe it’s important to tell doctors your biological sex immediately.
However, revealing their biological sex is very difficult for some people. Especially when the gender they identify with doesn’t match the sex, they were born as. According to Head to Health, “many transgender people hide their gender expression in public for fear of negative reactions, violence or discrimination.” Head to Health also notes that “transgender people experience high rates of physical and non-physical abuse,” which helps explain why far from everyone is happy when faced with questions about their sex.
Oldfishnewfish stated that it’s important to respect patients if their gender doesn’t match their sex: “I need to know if you’re a male or female. I need to know if you’re susceptible to certain diseases or ailments, how your symptoms may be derived from those diseases or ailments, and most importantly, how to treat those diseases or ailments,” oldfishnewfish explained.
Internet users had this to say about oldfishnewfish’s rant
The Journal of the American Medical Association writes that the term ‘sex’ is considered biological and physiological, while ‘gender’ “comprises the social, environmental, cultural, and behavioral factors and choices that influence a person’s self-identity and health.”
Meanwhile, the National Center for Biotechnology Information notes that “men and women are alike in many ways. However, there are important biological and behavioural differences between the two genders. They affect manifestation, epidemiology and pathophysiology of many widespread diseases and the approach to health care.”
Psychology Today argues that “denying men’s and women’s different psychologies is not merely a denial of reality; it has serious health consequences for significant segments of the population.” Here are a few differences between men and women, according to Psychology Today: women are more empathic; men feel sexual jealousy more acutely; men are more aggressive and more adventurous; men are taller; women are better at remembering objects on a map, while men are better at rotating objects in their minds.
Whatever your views on this topic are, just remember the Golden Rule: treat others as you would want to be treated. And keep in mind that medical professionals especially deserve to be treated with respect. They’re trying to save your life, after all.
Good luck with using the biological vs. social argument...a large chunk of these people actually believe bio sex is socially constructed, while gender is innate. These views are so wrapped it's hard to make a rational argument when your opponent is basically denying reality.
I have yet to meet a trans/non-binary person who thinks the way you described. Sure there may be a few, but surely they don't represent all of who you call "these people"
Load More Replies...One example of this problem is planned parenthood. A transwoman can walk in who is biologically male, and if they show up positive on a pregnancy test no one tells them they can't be. this is important because for a male if they do a pregnancy test and it shows up positive it is a sign of testicular cancer. Steven Crowder actually tested this and filmed the whole thing if you dont believe me look it up on youtube. they even allowed him to plan an abortion, when it was very cery clear he was biologically male. what is happening to this world
The scary part is not only the testicular cancer, but the fact that this biological man thinking he might be pregnant is a psychiatric symptom as well. Would they likewise respect a man who would claim he is Napoleon and thus must be treated with utmost respect?
Load More Replies...When it comes to your health, and any associated treatments, I must agree with the spirit of the article/rant and a great many likeminded commentators. Giving inaccurate information (of ANY kind) is dangerous, and only results in delays and the danger of misdiagnosis.
Exactly, and giving the wrong information can result in improper treatment, (which can be dangerous) and can lead to medical malpractice.
Load More Replies...There's a whole group of people (and not so small) who claim, and try to convince others, there is no such thing as biological sex. They claim gender differences are entirely socially constructed, and preach absolute gender fluidity to any side. The worst part is that in some countries these people have access to education systems, of very young ages. And the damage is huge. Instead of calming and supporting a confused kid, they will essentially chemically castrate them. In my view, it's like helping suicidal teenagers commit suicide. They turn a normal adolescent process or dilemma into a life long identity defining irreversible situation. Just to justify their own beliefs to them selves. And with the full support of the media. What can I say... Denying reality is generally not a symptom of great health. But surgically or chemically intervene in order to justify your denial... That's just delusional.
I agree it's awful the trans movement is preying on kids this way, since statistically most trans kids grow out of it once they hit puberty and many turn out to be homosexual. Targeting kids, demanding they be given access to dangerous medication and even surgery, and attacking parents who don't want to do that in order to validate your ideology is sick. Adults can do what they like, but kids, who can't even conceptualize sex, gender and social constructs the way adults do, should not be rushing into something like this.
Load More Replies...Slightly off topic, but it reminds me on how a nurse handled the "race" question when I had my systematic full body health check last year. She just shifted the screen and mouse and politely made me select my own. Hope this serves as a little helping tip for the rest of you who might find yourselves in a similar position as this nurse (or this doctor from the article).
I agree that's a good option, but at the same time it isnt going to solve the issue of people selecting their Gender and not their Sex.
Load More Replies...My favorite was the "this doesn't really happen, this doctor is just trying to make trans people sound crazy" at the very end. *rolls eyes*
One simple solution was mentioned in the comments: during intake, ask born gender, and current gender. Do NOT put it with demographic questions: place it with medical history.
Being in the healthcare profession for over 30 years myself, I call b******t. I have never solely diagnosed someones disease process or clinical picture with regards to their ""biological sex"" The fact that woman present with different symptoms then men has very little to do with their actual anatomy but more with cultural and societal effects. Obviously actual effected anatomy ie prostate, uterine, testicular issues are specific to biological sex, but a good diagnostician will pick this up. Telling your physician as much info about yourself will help them clearly paint a clinical picture, many patients omit information they feel is either too embarrassing or emotional I.e drugs, alcohol, domestic abuse, eating issues, and a multitude of other things way more important then their biological/assigned sex. I know many healthcare profs. would and do agree with me and it is the policy at our hospital to ask the patient their preferred gender/pronouns and we have yet to have any issues.
Thank you fir this!! This is true care. The whole tone of this doctors statement is accusatory and transphobic, trans people are not delusional and once most people feel safe with their "care giver" they tend to trust and give information openly, sick and injured people generally want to be care for. It's doctors that lack compassion like this who general miss the bigger picture in the first place.
Load More Replies...Just be precise about WHAT you ask. Suggestion: Biological sex at birth, for example. SOLVED
Right they should be trained to ask gender assigned at birth, in most cases that is straightforward and hopefully less offensive to the patient.
Load More Replies...This is some transphobic b******t. As is stated in one of the comments, an easy way to address this doctor's concerns is for him to design his intake forms to respectfully ask patients to indicate their actual gender as well as their gender assigned at birth. Trans people deal with huge amounts of transphobia on a daily basis so of course being faced with a transphobic doctor who hasn't bothered to try and understand their realities is frustrating and might result in them getting upset. The solution is for this doctor to actually get training from a trans advocacy organization rather than assuming that he knows what he's talking about just because he uses people's correct pronouns.
Take it down, BP! Plz sign @Julie! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...I'd agree with this except in the once example they used to make their point. While woman and men do present differently when it comes to heart attacks, male doctors do not treat women with the same amount of diligence they they do a man having a heart attack. If you're a female and think you may be experiencing a heart attack, ask for a female doctor. You'll be more likely to survive. You can look up those stats, it's very eye opening.
So this medical professional wants to ask a trans or gender diverse person their biological sex, fine. I refuse to tell a medical professional that I am trans because I don't know if this medical professional won't share my medical information with another patient. Cause I know several people who have been refused treatment when they have gone to medical professionals.
Take it down, BP! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...I feel sorry for people born with one of the intersex conditions. They seem to always get overlooked, even by self-proclaimed medical professionals (He/she wrote "Yes, as someone who works in the medical field I acknowledge(s) there are only two biological sexes." Someone working in the medical field should know better.) But overall, I agree. When it comes to being medically treated, people should be open about their medical history and about their sex when asked about from a medical professional, even if it's not always easy or simple.
Um, biologically there are only two biological sexes, so what do you mean? Gender is a different thing, anthropologists will say. And a person may feel like they are of a different sex and they way many people view that now, their gender doesn't match their biological sex. But what is wrong with the doctor's statement? Are there more than two biological sexes? Perhaps three for people with both male and female genetalia?
Load More Replies...I work in the healthcare field as well and it is just something the healthcare field needs to work on. For example, we ask if you are including "females of child-bearing potential" in your study which isn't necessary because only someone with ovaries would be capable so you can instead say "individual of child-bearing potential." It won't be perfect but the healthcare community also needs to make an effort to re-evaluate what we can for patient comfort. Some research suggests that transgenderism is related to a birth defect during gestation so when they say they are female they really are. So say "Are you currently or have you ever been an individual of child-bearing potential." You can further explain that it means that you were are currently are able to become pregnant. It is a little extra work but it means a lot. For emergency situations I get the need to get to the point but not that hard to be more accommodating where we can be.
I will just say one thing... lying to a doctor or hiding things from them is the most stupid idea ever. They are trying to help. I am also not comfortable with doctors asking about my sex life or excrements but it doesn't take much to understand it is just their job.
This piece (and the comments, most of which are either 3rd person, at best accounts of what they think they know or is uninformed made-up internet BS by people who have no education or actual experience working with trans individuals) is a good example of taking rare or only 1 experience and turning it into a "real" issue that doesn't exist. I work with a lot of trans people and even do education on LGBTQ healthcare and the overwhelming majority of trans people understand the need to ask sex assigned at birth and respect their healthcare providers. Its when other pieces of information are not asked, such as pronouns and chosen name or respecting ones gender or gender expression. Trans people are also often subjected to invasive questions in medical environments that have nothing to do with the reason they are seeing a doctor. What the person above is talking about is the exception, not the rule. Get to know trans folks and stop making these harmful examples that marginalize good people
If the healthcare provider just have some basic knowledge in how to respectfully phrase things this wouldn't be a problem. Rather than insisting a trans woman is "biologically male" (a term commonly used to disqualify someones gender), or a trans man "biologically female", just ask if they are trans and you'll get a much quicker response and your patient will trust you better. Simple as that. Also biological male and biological female aren't entirely two separate boxes. Some sex differences are based on hormones during pregnancy (e.g. genitalia, unless later altered), some based on hormones during childhood and adolescence (e.g. bone structure), and some are based on hormones the last couple of months (e.g. the amount of hemoglobin in the blood). I'd love to know why there are sex difference in how a heart attack is experienced. Would for instance someone transitioning before puberty experience the male or female symptoms?
Tell BP to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Acknowledging physical differences is okay and necessary. Making judgments about people's character and worth based on physical differences alone is discrimination. We would all do well to know the difference.
THIS IS WRONG: "As someone who works in the medical field I acknowledges that there are only two biological sexes." There are SIX (most common) biological sexes: X, XX, XXY, XY, XYY, XXXY. This person does not know what tf they are talking about, and trying to pass it off as facts.
Those are birth defects not sexes such as turners syndrome I also work in the medical field and you are wrong the two standard genders are xx and xy anything else is a chromosome abnormality.
Load More Replies...hm. I foresee more issues like this popping up. trans is just another thing we all should be patient learning and understand that there are going to be growing pains and questions that we need to answer. in this case it would be easier just to ask the patient sex at birth? bam done. a patient should also feel free to disclose that they are trans. but unfortunately the current state of unknowing, discomfort, and lack of tact is causing people to just not talk about it because they feel like they have to be one or the other, not just transitioning to one or the other. it's frustrating because glancing at the comments all I see are people who are overwhelmed and fed up with trans issues. fair enough, our whole world has so many issues it's hard to focus or care about them all.
There was the case where a person who identified as male told the hospital they were male, so they did not do certain tests for the persons pain and the person has a miscarriage, and then tried suing the hospital for not doing any tests to see if someone who said they were male was pregnant, when the person themselves provided the wrong medical info. Identify how you want, but dont screw around when it comes to medical treatments
People don't seem to understand the difference between sex and gender. Sex is what you are biologically and gender is how identify mentally and emotionally. You would think that people who are going through transitional surgeries would understand this already. I agree with what some other people said that they get so upset because they want attention.
I also heard the story of a trans person giving birth but not getting care because the hospital thought it was an obese man. Doesn't matter if true or not it shows the need to acknowledge birth sex with your doctors. I don't know how upset some trans may be but some of them have some wrong ideas. Talking with a trans woman she thought her genetics changed to female and could not understand that her
Can they ask a patient if they have 2 X chromosomes or and X and a Y? Or is that too difficult for people to understand?
*sigh* it does happen. I try ton be sensitive to transgender/non-binary etc etc but in a medical setting it is very important. When lab techs take blood work it can cause confusion if they are not honest because the blood work will come back with the gender at birth.
Wow! Maybe use a little tact or work on your bedside manner if the question is so life threatening. People are probably getting defensive because you're acting like a prick about it.
If people are too triggered to listen to questions that could save their life then f**k 'em. It's the doctor's fault somehow? Grown a*s adults shouldn't be treated with kid gloves. And the doctor is "a prick" about it because they're sick of people putting up roadblocks that go against their own best interests and that can also put the doc at risk professionally. F**k those people.
Load More Replies...When we are told to respect gender identity and use the proper pronouns, it is because we need to respect the individual. That respect goes both ways. I don't care who or what you are or think you are. If the question is asked, take it as an opportunity to have the conversation rather than a challenge to your identity. You don't want to be referred to as male or female? That's fine. Bear in mind that not every aspect of life is able to function on a non-binary level when it comes to determining proper care and help. The situation should always dictate your attitude. Not the other way around.
Um, shouldn't you be able to figure that out from patient history? Isn't there like a cocktail of hormones that have to be taken, or (if they are post op) surgeries in their history that would indicate how to treat them?
This Doctor is just a bigot, the whole thing reeks of anger and transphobia
Load More Replies...This s**t is so confusing to me. Sex is determined by your chromosomes. You can be a woman with X chromosomes or a man with X and Y. Or some people are intersex / hermaphrodites. None of this has anything to do with gender which is entirely made up. Soooo... why do we need “transgender”? If you have Y chromosomes you are a biological male but you can put on a dress and lipstick and get a boob job. If gender is just all made up, why can’t you just be a man who wears dresses and whatever? Isn’t it sexist in the first place to reduce the other gender to superficial s**t like tits and high heels? Like I just don’t understand the point of gender. You can’t change your chromosomes. Just live your life?? I don’t know.
I was really curious about transgenderism a few years ago and I work in medical research so it was pretty easy for me to review some medical studies on the topic. I found one particular theory that hasn't been proven as the cause but is being looked into as a possible explanation and I found it really compelling. The theory suggests that transgenderism takes place during gestation. We all start off as female but as we develop some of us transition into male as hormones release in both the brain and the genitalia. What some researcher believe is that at this stage the hormones will release in one area but not the other. The evidence to support this is that trans male brain structures are closer to biological males than females. So they mentally are male with female genitalia making transgenderism a birth defect during fetal development. This would also imply that biologically you are both male and female. It isn't about gender, it is about sex, and sex is complicated.
Load More Replies...I understand in a theoretical way how this could be an issue. But in a practical way, it's a minority of a minority of a minority: 1. Trans people. 2. Trans people who don't understand medical importance of sex vs gender. 3. Trans people who don't understand medical importance of sex vs gender, who would have no other indication of sex (like state ID, documentation of medicine or often lengthy medical processes needed to transition, or even simply physical appearance depending upon the case) that medical professionals wouldn't catch. Theoretically a problem and one trans people SHOULD know about for their own safety. Practically a much smaller problem than, say, people lying about not using illegal drugs for fear of legal repercussions that could in turn make them very sensitive to drugs, or parents lying and saying their children are current on vaccinations which could cause sickness in their and other children.
So is someone with male genetalia, low testosterone levels and XX chromosomes biologically male or female? And that’s before you even think about gender identity and the psychological impacts of feeling like your gender identity may not match your actual or societally perceived biological sex. Source: https://www.who.int/genomics/gender/en/index1.html (2/3)
please tell BP to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Why doesn't the medical profession ever ask themselves why their patients don't trust them???? Why do you always blame the patient? I've worked with both the queer community and the mental health community and the prejudice, discrimination, and downright abusive treatment by medical professionals is sickening and infuriating. Medical professionals are also not trauma informed. The dentist is very trauma informed. But medical professionals often inflict medical trauma. I could tell you so many horror stories it would make your hair stand on end. Medical professionals should take responsibility for the abysmal way they treat their patients instead of blaming the victims of their callousness and their abuse. And before someone gets their neck out of joint, there are good medical professionals who are full of compassion and care. But that has never been the majority and when you belong to a minority population the number shrinks even further.
Mummynapkin up there being peak stupid today. "Um... a health professional talks about a real problem that can face transgender people, and one both those in the medical field and transgender people themselves should consider... NaH, tHiS jUsT aN aTtEmPt To MaKe TrAnS pEoPlE sOuNd CrAzY"
It can also be an option to ask a patient if they are menstruating or not, as a medic you should also be aware that there are trans people, hermaphrodites and multiple sexes outside of the gender norm that have more issues to this usage of terms than just their feelings. As a medic you should be aware that mental issues also relate to physical ones, everything is connected
Ask their gender. If they choose to lie, treat them as the gender they claim. At some point during the explanation for ovarian cancer, they'll clue in and realise they're being a twat. Or not, at which point their death is their choice, and good riddance.
Sex and gender are two different things. They should ask about sex assigned at birth. Gender has nothing to do with biology so it wouldn't be the right thing to ask in that situation.
Load More Replies...I always thought about it. It's okay if you choose a certain lifestyle . It's your life but why pretend you can change nature? You can't change your genes or chromosomes just by wanting it. Best you accept new things but find a way to make peace with the truth. Fighting against nature can only lead to anguish.
If you go to a doctor for help just be honest about all the questions the doctor asks you, they are usually really professional and have a good reason for asking you specific questions. I really doubt that a doctor wants to offend you, or assume your sex BUT rather they ask before they assume incorrectly, that would be worse wouldn't it???
The people out there who choose, yes choose, to be offended by EVERYTHING are the biggest part of the problem. Get your head out of your a*s and stop your b******t. Medical personnel need to know certain things and do not give a flying f**k and a half who you identify as, just don't be a prick - the world has way too many already.
Dammit, Candice Ravel, I'm really not sure why you and the others get down-voted. People seem to be quite sensitive of the non-sugarcoated truth.
Load More Replies...doctors took an oath and like nine billion years of medical school to help ur asses so dont just immediately get defensive over ur gender. YES, IT IS YOUR GENDER THEY UNDERSTAND THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO CHANGE U THEY R TRYING TO HELP. bum bumss.
I ask people to please not lump everyone who believes in gender ambiguity together, any more than you would want to be lumped together with someone else that has one thing in common with you. There are nuances to all our beliefs. We need to all stop with the "them vs. us" mentality. "Do you believe in x? Yes, no? Oh then you're crazy." is an unintelligent way of conducting oneself within society. Think for a moment, and try to find anyone that agrees with you on everything, or wonder if there is any one belief you hold strongly that someone else you know well may actually disagree with... and yet they are not crazy or fitting a crazy stereotype.
Were you born with XX or XY? Chromosomes and are not up for negotiation, but you should still advocated for your own personal pronoun. Medically, is important to know the difference. Socially, people should be respected for how they want to be addressed. So who cares if the conversation goes, "Sir, your abdominal pain is caused by cysts on your ovaries.". If you don't know that this dude has XX, you're not even looking for ovaries.
Most people do not have that piece of information. How many people get a chromosome test? Even a lot of intersexual people don't know they are intersexual. Doctors are advised not to tell them to avoid psychological problems. They are assigned male or female at birth, based on the parents wishes or doctor's advice, which in most cases means female, because "it's easier to cut off a micropenis than to make it bigger" for example. The kids get surgery before they turn 3, so they don't remember and later receive hormone treatment without being told what it really is.
Load More Replies...heuristics have their pros and cons. Maybe a woman is presenting like a man with a heart attack and gets antacid instead. My old barn owner (cis/her/she/whatever you call it) went to the dr and was told specifically an issue wasn't her heart "I guarantee it". Cue the life flight to the big city hospital 90's miles away, induced coma, etc and she's now on a defibrillator in her chest.
"There are only two biological sexes"? Sorry, but that is incorrect and as a "medical professional" you should be familiar with the term INTERSEXUAL! There are loads of other chromosome combinations, not just XX and XY, but for example XXY!
Tell them to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Bored Panda, you took a really important issue and did a very poor job handling it. The lack of clarity this article provides is doing a disservice to the transgender community, and to folks of all genders for that matter. This doctor is seemingly trying to do the right thing by transgender patients, but is not up to date on professional standards. There is an entire international organization that has published standards, which he should read: https://wpath.org/ . Here's the biggest rub in the article: he refuses to describe transgender people in anything but binary sexual language. What the transgender community has been saying for decades is simple: a trans woman is NOT a "male", a trans man (like me) is NOT a "female". Most of us are on hormone therapy. If you treat us medically as cisgender "males" and "females" assigned at birth, you will likely be giving us improper medical care. I do think it is appropriate for medical providers to know your gender and medical history.
Interesting point about being all hopped up on hormones. I wonder if that should affect how people are treated. "The lack of clarity this article provides is doing a disservice to the transgender community," I disagree. The doc is trying to point out that the trans person needs to be honest when asked this question. That's important information.
Load More Replies...If you just want to yell at people, by all means that’s what comment threads are for. But if you are interested in learning more, please: do some research, formulate an educated argument, think. The World Health Organization link above might be a good place to start. (3/3)
I wasn't sure whether I should post, because this topic is an emotional minefield, but I think this is important. I agree that this doctor is doing the right thing by respecting patients' gender identity but asking for their sex at birth, because that is important medical data. However, biological sex is more complicated than genetalia, hormones, or even chromosomal makeup (DNA). It's not uncommon for babies to be born with male genetalia and XX chromosomes, or female genetalia and XYY chromosomes, etc, etc. And after birth, hormone levels controlled by a number of different genes can affect sexual development. (1/3)
Julieanna; This is not about intersex people. Intersex people do not consider themselves transgender and transgender people should not be discussing intersex people As they know little or nothing about the condition. Also, intersex people know about their condition and have absolutely no reservations about revealing this to doctors. Please do not try to justify the difference between women and men by using rare genetic exceptions to prop up idiotic arguments. Except for these exceptions; EVERY Woman alive as XX chromosomes in every cell of her body as men have XY chromosomes in every cell of their bodies. What astounds me is how easy it is been to brainwash people into thinking otherwise. Has never been a time in recorded history where humans fundamentally accept and understand except the difference Between men and women. It is perhaps the first biological fact in our evolution that we did understand.
Load More Replies...Instead of the hateful rant full of outdated and useless terminology like “ biological sex,” how about you educate yourself on best practices for treating transgender patients. Understand that your transgender patient has likely had their identity denied by society and may have even been refused medical care for being transgender. Their hostility may be their defense against abuse. You also cannot simply treat symptoms based on a trans person’s assigned gender (or biological sex as you call it) because any surgery or hormonal therapy may affect what you see as gender-specific symptoms. Also intersex people exist. Even at birth, not everyone can check a box as male or female. For actually scientific reading on the subject, here’s a helpful article from JAMA https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/article-abstract/2697839is
Tell them to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...To those who insist that a person's psycho-social gender and their biological sex are completely separate things: have you ever considered that psycho-social gender can be a result of innate biological sex differences? E.g. There's a cultural idea that males are more aggressive, but this could well have come about, in large part, because of the gender difference that men have, on average, twice the testosterone of women. The psycho-social tendencies of gender difference are mostly products of real differences in biological sex tendencies. Notice too that you often see this outside the human species: in gorillas, chimps (not the bonobos - the other ones), lions, rams, deer, cattle - many other species, the males are significantly more aggressive. Is 'gender just a construct' for those animal species? Notice that when the males are neutered (in zoos or on farms) they'll act way less aggressive? Gender difference is real. Get over it far left.
I think asking "what was your gender at birth" is a much better way to phrase a sensitive question.
Gender refers to the socially constructed ideas of what a man/woman should be and act like. So that would be weird. From what I've seen asking "What sex were you assigned at birth?" might go over better (though that is appropriating intersex terms, but that is another conversation entirely).
Load More Replies...Surprise, the comment section is a bunch of people making ridiculous and inaccurate generalizations of others. "There are people who think blah blah blah something about how they are destroying society" Seriously, shut the hell up telling people what they think. The original "rant" goes into a lot of detail about respecting individuals right to use pronouns and define themselves, they aren't attacking people for that reason. They even say they may be phrasing it wrong and looking to other options to be clear. To bad so many commenters had to go absolutely bonkers over this and go on ridiculous, hateful tirades. Seriously, if you actually believe Steven Crowder doesn't fake and edit footage and use it to make some hateful point, you might as well skydive without a parachute and just pray really hard on the way down.
99 times out of 100, this "medical professional" (who doesn't know the phrase 'case IN point') needs to know, and is right to know. But there are people whose genitalia DOESN'T indicate their true biological, hormonal gender or sex. True hermaphrodites, those with dna differences. Of course, if the patient is aware of these things, I would hope their doctors are aware as well!
I get the point he's making about discussing biological sex, and agree with that on that particular note. However, as someone who works in the medical field, you should realize there is debate about a third gender- intersex- and whether the medical community categorizes that as two genders "combined" or a different one. There are also *degrees* of intersex, it's not all flat-out full-on breasts-with-male-genitalia. You may not have encountered one yet but that doesn't mean it never happens. I feel you on the occasional over-sensitivity when asked "what their sex is", but using the incorrect pronouns (especially if the clipboard form is marked a specific way) can be insulting. If a patient presents as male and you never got a clipboard form, fine... but if you are handed their records and it states a preference then that is on you.
If someone doesn't want to give you the information necessary to treat him/her, just send them away. Easy.
Relax, Doc. If they're not ready to give up their delusions, they're not sick enough, anyhow.
whoa ! I had 13+ ! Blue hair mommas got me again :D
Load More Replies...The comment section is killing me. There has been a lot of medical research taking place to determine what causes transgenderism and one of the prevailing theories that they are continuing to study now is that it is a birth defect that happens in utero. So we all start off as female and then hormones release in the genitalia and brain, causing some of us to transition into males. The theory is that for transgender people the hormone releases in one area but not the other, causing an individual to biologically be both male and female. Neuroscientists have conducted studies using MRIs to investigate difference in the brain between males and females and transgendered people tend to have more similarities in the brain structure with the gender they identify with than the gender they were born as, meaning that biologically they are both. It isn't a sex thing, it isn't a phase, it is a biological medical condition.
F**k 'em! If those kinds of people thing getting addressed in the right way (if any is actually available) is more important then allowing someone to help you you're a dumb piece of c**p that thinks they're better or special and deserve to die! ;-)
What kind of idiot would refuse to tell THEIR DOCTOR what their biological sex is? Regardless what you decide to do with your life or who you are attracted by, your body is what it is. A doctor need to know. Why refuse to give him/her such crucial information?
Holy c**p. I don't have the patience to deal with these wackos anymore. If they are that obstinate when dealing with medical professionals who are trying to help them, then maybe they deserve to unnecessarily suffer a few uncomfortable ailments for being such sh1theads. Society is burning out quick on trying to appease this never satisfied group. I think it's time we just collectively give them the middle finger and move on. Just my two cents.
Don't worry. I'm sure we are not alone. If enough people with our way of thinking understand that there are others like them, who think we should stop tolerating this amount of idiocy, that they are not alone, maybe they would stand against all this s**t.
Load More Replies...Patton Oswalt says “You’ve gotta respect everyone’s beliefs." No, you don’t. That’s what gets us in trouble. Look, you have to acknowledge everyone’s beliefs, and then you have to reserve the right to go: "That is f*****g stupid. Are you kidding me?" I acknowledge that you believe that, that’s great, but I’m not going to respect it. I have an uncle that believes he saw Sasquatch. We do not believe him, nor do we respect him!”
yes it has to be something like that ... this post seems so far-fetched
Load More Replies...It's with social issues. Go check photography and art!!
Load More Replies...Buddy, I've got something to tell you. It's to either shut up, or f**k off. You came here because you were bored, had some free time, etc. You don't have to waste your time here if you don't want to. Personally, I think that it's great that Bored Panda releases such posts. There are thousands of pandas out there and it's a great way to raise awareness. Only one panda can tell hundred other people, including doctors they know: "Hey, didja know there is now a new trend, some insane people, who feel offended when you are asking for information in order to help them? Careful with them, friend."
Load More Replies...There wouldn't be a debate in the medical field if it was that simple
Load More Replies...Call yourself what you want, but you are male, or female. I no problem with people who identify differently, but when science is involved, its very black and white. Male or female.
Load More Replies...They could then ask if their sex chromosomes were determined to be XX or XY or something else at birth. Some intersex individuals are genetically male or female but others are not. I believe intersex individuals with Klinefelter's Syndrome, for example are XXY.
Load More Replies...Good luck with using the biological vs. social argument...a large chunk of these people actually believe bio sex is socially constructed, while gender is innate. These views are so wrapped it's hard to make a rational argument when your opponent is basically denying reality.
I have yet to meet a trans/non-binary person who thinks the way you described. Sure there may be a few, but surely they don't represent all of who you call "these people"
Load More Replies...One example of this problem is planned parenthood. A transwoman can walk in who is biologically male, and if they show up positive on a pregnancy test no one tells them they can't be. this is important because for a male if they do a pregnancy test and it shows up positive it is a sign of testicular cancer. Steven Crowder actually tested this and filmed the whole thing if you dont believe me look it up on youtube. they even allowed him to plan an abortion, when it was very cery clear he was biologically male. what is happening to this world
The scary part is not only the testicular cancer, but the fact that this biological man thinking he might be pregnant is a psychiatric symptom as well. Would they likewise respect a man who would claim he is Napoleon and thus must be treated with utmost respect?
Load More Replies...When it comes to your health, and any associated treatments, I must agree with the spirit of the article/rant and a great many likeminded commentators. Giving inaccurate information (of ANY kind) is dangerous, and only results in delays and the danger of misdiagnosis.
Exactly, and giving the wrong information can result in improper treatment, (which can be dangerous) and can lead to medical malpractice.
Load More Replies...There's a whole group of people (and not so small) who claim, and try to convince others, there is no such thing as biological sex. They claim gender differences are entirely socially constructed, and preach absolute gender fluidity to any side. The worst part is that in some countries these people have access to education systems, of very young ages. And the damage is huge. Instead of calming and supporting a confused kid, they will essentially chemically castrate them. In my view, it's like helping suicidal teenagers commit suicide. They turn a normal adolescent process or dilemma into a life long identity defining irreversible situation. Just to justify their own beliefs to them selves. And with the full support of the media. What can I say... Denying reality is generally not a symptom of great health. But surgically or chemically intervene in order to justify your denial... That's just delusional.
I agree it's awful the trans movement is preying on kids this way, since statistically most trans kids grow out of it once they hit puberty and many turn out to be homosexual. Targeting kids, demanding they be given access to dangerous medication and even surgery, and attacking parents who don't want to do that in order to validate your ideology is sick. Adults can do what they like, but kids, who can't even conceptualize sex, gender and social constructs the way adults do, should not be rushing into something like this.
Load More Replies...Slightly off topic, but it reminds me on how a nurse handled the "race" question when I had my systematic full body health check last year. She just shifted the screen and mouse and politely made me select my own. Hope this serves as a little helping tip for the rest of you who might find yourselves in a similar position as this nurse (or this doctor from the article).
I agree that's a good option, but at the same time it isnt going to solve the issue of people selecting their Gender and not their Sex.
Load More Replies...My favorite was the "this doesn't really happen, this doctor is just trying to make trans people sound crazy" at the very end. *rolls eyes*
One simple solution was mentioned in the comments: during intake, ask born gender, and current gender. Do NOT put it with demographic questions: place it with medical history.
Being in the healthcare profession for over 30 years myself, I call b******t. I have never solely diagnosed someones disease process or clinical picture with regards to their ""biological sex"" The fact that woman present with different symptoms then men has very little to do with their actual anatomy but more with cultural and societal effects. Obviously actual effected anatomy ie prostate, uterine, testicular issues are specific to biological sex, but a good diagnostician will pick this up. Telling your physician as much info about yourself will help them clearly paint a clinical picture, many patients omit information they feel is either too embarrassing or emotional I.e drugs, alcohol, domestic abuse, eating issues, and a multitude of other things way more important then their biological/assigned sex. I know many healthcare profs. would and do agree with me and it is the policy at our hospital to ask the patient their preferred gender/pronouns and we have yet to have any issues.
Thank you fir this!! This is true care. The whole tone of this doctors statement is accusatory and transphobic, trans people are not delusional and once most people feel safe with their "care giver" they tend to trust and give information openly, sick and injured people generally want to be care for. It's doctors that lack compassion like this who general miss the bigger picture in the first place.
Load More Replies...Just be precise about WHAT you ask. Suggestion: Biological sex at birth, for example. SOLVED
Right they should be trained to ask gender assigned at birth, in most cases that is straightforward and hopefully less offensive to the patient.
Load More Replies...This is some transphobic b******t. As is stated in one of the comments, an easy way to address this doctor's concerns is for him to design his intake forms to respectfully ask patients to indicate their actual gender as well as their gender assigned at birth. Trans people deal with huge amounts of transphobia on a daily basis so of course being faced with a transphobic doctor who hasn't bothered to try and understand their realities is frustrating and might result in them getting upset. The solution is for this doctor to actually get training from a trans advocacy organization rather than assuming that he knows what he's talking about just because he uses people's correct pronouns.
Take it down, BP! Plz sign @Julie! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...I'd agree with this except in the once example they used to make their point. While woman and men do present differently when it comes to heart attacks, male doctors do not treat women with the same amount of diligence they they do a man having a heart attack. If you're a female and think you may be experiencing a heart attack, ask for a female doctor. You'll be more likely to survive. You can look up those stats, it's very eye opening.
So this medical professional wants to ask a trans or gender diverse person their biological sex, fine. I refuse to tell a medical professional that I am trans because I don't know if this medical professional won't share my medical information with another patient. Cause I know several people who have been refused treatment when they have gone to medical professionals.
Take it down, BP! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...I feel sorry for people born with one of the intersex conditions. They seem to always get overlooked, even by self-proclaimed medical professionals (He/she wrote "Yes, as someone who works in the medical field I acknowledge(s) there are only two biological sexes." Someone working in the medical field should know better.) But overall, I agree. When it comes to being medically treated, people should be open about their medical history and about their sex when asked about from a medical professional, even if it's not always easy or simple.
Um, biologically there are only two biological sexes, so what do you mean? Gender is a different thing, anthropologists will say. And a person may feel like they are of a different sex and they way many people view that now, their gender doesn't match their biological sex. But what is wrong with the doctor's statement? Are there more than two biological sexes? Perhaps three for people with both male and female genetalia?
Load More Replies...I work in the healthcare field as well and it is just something the healthcare field needs to work on. For example, we ask if you are including "females of child-bearing potential" in your study which isn't necessary because only someone with ovaries would be capable so you can instead say "individual of child-bearing potential." It won't be perfect but the healthcare community also needs to make an effort to re-evaluate what we can for patient comfort. Some research suggests that transgenderism is related to a birth defect during gestation so when they say they are female they really are. So say "Are you currently or have you ever been an individual of child-bearing potential." You can further explain that it means that you were are currently are able to become pregnant. It is a little extra work but it means a lot. For emergency situations I get the need to get to the point but not that hard to be more accommodating where we can be.
I will just say one thing... lying to a doctor or hiding things from them is the most stupid idea ever. They are trying to help. I am also not comfortable with doctors asking about my sex life or excrements but it doesn't take much to understand it is just their job.
This piece (and the comments, most of which are either 3rd person, at best accounts of what they think they know or is uninformed made-up internet BS by people who have no education or actual experience working with trans individuals) is a good example of taking rare or only 1 experience and turning it into a "real" issue that doesn't exist. I work with a lot of trans people and even do education on LGBTQ healthcare and the overwhelming majority of trans people understand the need to ask sex assigned at birth and respect their healthcare providers. Its when other pieces of information are not asked, such as pronouns and chosen name or respecting ones gender or gender expression. Trans people are also often subjected to invasive questions in medical environments that have nothing to do with the reason they are seeing a doctor. What the person above is talking about is the exception, not the rule. Get to know trans folks and stop making these harmful examples that marginalize good people
If the healthcare provider just have some basic knowledge in how to respectfully phrase things this wouldn't be a problem. Rather than insisting a trans woman is "biologically male" (a term commonly used to disqualify someones gender), or a trans man "biologically female", just ask if they are trans and you'll get a much quicker response and your patient will trust you better. Simple as that. Also biological male and biological female aren't entirely two separate boxes. Some sex differences are based on hormones during pregnancy (e.g. genitalia, unless later altered), some based on hormones during childhood and adolescence (e.g. bone structure), and some are based on hormones the last couple of months (e.g. the amount of hemoglobin in the blood). I'd love to know why there are sex difference in how a heart attack is experienced. Would for instance someone transitioning before puberty experience the male or female symptoms?
Tell BP to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Acknowledging physical differences is okay and necessary. Making judgments about people's character and worth based on physical differences alone is discrimination. We would all do well to know the difference.
THIS IS WRONG: "As someone who works in the medical field I acknowledges that there are only two biological sexes." There are SIX (most common) biological sexes: X, XX, XXY, XY, XYY, XXXY. This person does not know what tf they are talking about, and trying to pass it off as facts.
Those are birth defects not sexes such as turners syndrome I also work in the medical field and you are wrong the two standard genders are xx and xy anything else is a chromosome abnormality.
Load More Replies...hm. I foresee more issues like this popping up. trans is just another thing we all should be patient learning and understand that there are going to be growing pains and questions that we need to answer. in this case it would be easier just to ask the patient sex at birth? bam done. a patient should also feel free to disclose that they are trans. but unfortunately the current state of unknowing, discomfort, and lack of tact is causing people to just not talk about it because they feel like they have to be one or the other, not just transitioning to one or the other. it's frustrating because glancing at the comments all I see are people who are overwhelmed and fed up with trans issues. fair enough, our whole world has so many issues it's hard to focus or care about them all.
There was the case where a person who identified as male told the hospital they were male, so they did not do certain tests for the persons pain and the person has a miscarriage, and then tried suing the hospital for not doing any tests to see if someone who said they were male was pregnant, when the person themselves provided the wrong medical info. Identify how you want, but dont screw around when it comes to medical treatments
People don't seem to understand the difference between sex and gender. Sex is what you are biologically and gender is how identify mentally and emotionally. You would think that people who are going through transitional surgeries would understand this already. I agree with what some other people said that they get so upset because they want attention.
I also heard the story of a trans person giving birth but not getting care because the hospital thought it was an obese man. Doesn't matter if true or not it shows the need to acknowledge birth sex with your doctors. I don't know how upset some trans may be but some of them have some wrong ideas. Talking with a trans woman she thought her genetics changed to female and could not understand that her
Can they ask a patient if they have 2 X chromosomes or and X and a Y? Or is that too difficult for people to understand?
*sigh* it does happen. I try ton be sensitive to transgender/non-binary etc etc but in a medical setting it is very important. When lab techs take blood work it can cause confusion if they are not honest because the blood work will come back with the gender at birth.
Wow! Maybe use a little tact or work on your bedside manner if the question is so life threatening. People are probably getting defensive because you're acting like a prick about it.
If people are too triggered to listen to questions that could save their life then f**k 'em. It's the doctor's fault somehow? Grown a*s adults shouldn't be treated with kid gloves. And the doctor is "a prick" about it because they're sick of people putting up roadblocks that go against their own best interests and that can also put the doc at risk professionally. F**k those people.
Load More Replies...When we are told to respect gender identity and use the proper pronouns, it is because we need to respect the individual. That respect goes both ways. I don't care who or what you are or think you are. If the question is asked, take it as an opportunity to have the conversation rather than a challenge to your identity. You don't want to be referred to as male or female? That's fine. Bear in mind that not every aspect of life is able to function on a non-binary level when it comes to determining proper care and help. The situation should always dictate your attitude. Not the other way around.
Um, shouldn't you be able to figure that out from patient history? Isn't there like a cocktail of hormones that have to be taken, or (if they are post op) surgeries in their history that would indicate how to treat them?
This Doctor is just a bigot, the whole thing reeks of anger and transphobia
Load More Replies...This s**t is so confusing to me. Sex is determined by your chromosomes. You can be a woman with X chromosomes or a man with X and Y. Or some people are intersex / hermaphrodites. None of this has anything to do with gender which is entirely made up. Soooo... why do we need “transgender”? If you have Y chromosomes you are a biological male but you can put on a dress and lipstick and get a boob job. If gender is just all made up, why can’t you just be a man who wears dresses and whatever? Isn’t it sexist in the first place to reduce the other gender to superficial s**t like tits and high heels? Like I just don’t understand the point of gender. You can’t change your chromosomes. Just live your life?? I don’t know.
I was really curious about transgenderism a few years ago and I work in medical research so it was pretty easy for me to review some medical studies on the topic. I found one particular theory that hasn't been proven as the cause but is being looked into as a possible explanation and I found it really compelling. The theory suggests that transgenderism takes place during gestation. We all start off as female but as we develop some of us transition into male as hormones release in both the brain and the genitalia. What some researcher believe is that at this stage the hormones will release in one area but not the other. The evidence to support this is that trans male brain structures are closer to biological males than females. So they mentally are male with female genitalia making transgenderism a birth defect during fetal development. This would also imply that biologically you are both male and female. It isn't about gender, it is about sex, and sex is complicated.
Load More Replies...I understand in a theoretical way how this could be an issue. But in a practical way, it's a minority of a minority of a minority: 1. Trans people. 2. Trans people who don't understand medical importance of sex vs gender. 3. Trans people who don't understand medical importance of sex vs gender, who would have no other indication of sex (like state ID, documentation of medicine or often lengthy medical processes needed to transition, or even simply physical appearance depending upon the case) that medical professionals wouldn't catch. Theoretically a problem and one trans people SHOULD know about for their own safety. Practically a much smaller problem than, say, people lying about not using illegal drugs for fear of legal repercussions that could in turn make them very sensitive to drugs, or parents lying and saying their children are current on vaccinations which could cause sickness in their and other children.
So is someone with male genetalia, low testosterone levels and XX chromosomes biologically male or female? And that’s before you even think about gender identity and the psychological impacts of feeling like your gender identity may not match your actual or societally perceived biological sex. Source: https://www.who.int/genomics/gender/en/index1.html (2/3)
please tell BP to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Why doesn't the medical profession ever ask themselves why their patients don't trust them???? Why do you always blame the patient? I've worked with both the queer community and the mental health community and the prejudice, discrimination, and downright abusive treatment by medical professionals is sickening and infuriating. Medical professionals are also not trauma informed. The dentist is very trauma informed. But medical professionals often inflict medical trauma. I could tell you so many horror stories it would make your hair stand on end. Medical professionals should take responsibility for the abysmal way they treat their patients instead of blaming the victims of their callousness and their abuse. And before someone gets their neck out of joint, there are good medical professionals who are full of compassion and care. But that has never been the majority and when you belong to a minority population the number shrinks even further.
Mummynapkin up there being peak stupid today. "Um... a health professional talks about a real problem that can face transgender people, and one both those in the medical field and transgender people themselves should consider... NaH, tHiS jUsT aN aTtEmPt To MaKe TrAnS pEoPlE sOuNd CrAzY"
It can also be an option to ask a patient if they are menstruating or not, as a medic you should also be aware that there are trans people, hermaphrodites and multiple sexes outside of the gender norm that have more issues to this usage of terms than just their feelings. As a medic you should be aware that mental issues also relate to physical ones, everything is connected
Ask their gender. If they choose to lie, treat them as the gender they claim. At some point during the explanation for ovarian cancer, they'll clue in and realise they're being a twat. Or not, at which point their death is their choice, and good riddance.
Sex and gender are two different things. They should ask about sex assigned at birth. Gender has nothing to do with biology so it wouldn't be the right thing to ask in that situation.
Load More Replies...I always thought about it. It's okay if you choose a certain lifestyle . It's your life but why pretend you can change nature? You can't change your genes or chromosomes just by wanting it. Best you accept new things but find a way to make peace with the truth. Fighting against nature can only lead to anguish.
If you go to a doctor for help just be honest about all the questions the doctor asks you, they are usually really professional and have a good reason for asking you specific questions. I really doubt that a doctor wants to offend you, or assume your sex BUT rather they ask before they assume incorrectly, that would be worse wouldn't it???
The people out there who choose, yes choose, to be offended by EVERYTHING are the biggest part of the problem. Get your head out of your a*s and stop your b******t. Medical personnel need to know certain things and do not give a flying f**k and a half who you identify as, just don't be a prick - the world has way too many already.
Dammit, Candice Ravel, I'm really not sure why you and the others get down-voted. People seem to be quite sensitive of the non-sugarcoated truth.
Load More Replies...doctors took an oath and like nine billion years of medical school to help ur asses so dont just immediately get defensive over ur gender. YES, IT IS YOUR GENDER THEY UNDERSTAND THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO CHANGE U THEY R TRYING TO HELP. bum bumss.
I ask people to please not lump everyone who believes in gender ambiguity together, any more than you would want to be lumped together with someone else that has one thing in common with you. There are nuances to all our beliefs. We need to all stop with the "them vs. us" mentality. "Do you believe in x? Yes, no? Oh then you're crazy." is an unintelligent way of conducting oneself within society. Think for a moment, and try to find anyone that agrees with you on everything, or wonder if there is any one belief you hold strongly that someone else you know well may actually disagree with... and yet they are not crazy or fitting a crazy stereotype.
Were you born with XX or XY? Chromosomes and are not up for negotiation, but you should still advocated for your own personal pronoun. Medically, is important to know the difference. Socially, people should be respected for how they want to be addressed. So who cares if the conversation goes, "Sir, your abdominal pain is caused by cysts on your ovaries.". If you don't know that this dude has XX, you're not even looking for ovaries.
Most people do not have that piece of information. How many people get a chromosome test? Even a lot of intersexual people don't know they are intersexual. Doctors are advised not to tell them to avoid psychological problems. They are assigned male or female at birth, based on the parents wishes or doctor's advice, which in most cases means female, because "it's easier to cut off a micropenis than to make it bigger" for example. The kids get surgery before they turn 3, so they don't remember and later receive hormone treatment without being told what it really is.
Load More Replies...heuristics have their pros and cons. Maybe a woman is presenting like a man with a heart attack and gets antacid instead. My old barn owner (cis/her/she/whatever you call it) went to the dr and was told specifically an issue wasn't her heart "I guarantee it". Cue the life flight to the big city hospital 90's miles away, induced coma, etc and she's now on a defibrillator in her chest.
"There are only two biological sexes"? Sorry, but that is incorrect and as a "medical professional" you should be familiar with the term INTERSEXUAL! There are loads of other chromosome combinations, not just XX and XY, but for example XXY!
Tell them to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...Bored Panda, you took a really important issue and did a very poor job handling it. The lack of clarity this article provides is doing a disservice to the transgender community, and to folks of all genders for that matter. This doctor is seemingly trying to do the right thing by transgender patients, but is not up to date on professional standards. There is an entire international organization that has published standards, which he should read: https://wpath.org/ . Here's the biggest rub in the article: he refuses to describe transgender people in anything but binary sexual language. What the transgender community has been saying for decades is simple: a trans woman is NOT a "male", a trans man (like me) is NOT a "female". Most of us are on hormone therapy. If you treat us medically as cisgender "males" and "females" assigned at birth, you will likely be giving us improper medical care. I do think it is appropriate for medical providers to know your gender and medical history.
Interesting point about being all hopped up on hormones. I wonder if that should affect how people are treated. "The lack of clarity this article provides is doing a disservice to the transgender community," I disagree. The doc is trying to point out that the trans person needs to be honest when asked this question. That's important information.
Load More Replies...If you just want to yell at people, by all means that’s what comment threads are for. But if you are interested in learning more, please: do some research, formulate an educated argument, think. The World Health Organization link above might be a good place to start. (3/3)
I wasn't sure whether I should post, because this topic is an emotional minefield, but I think this is important. I agree that this doctor is doing the right thing by respecting patients' gender identity but asking for their sex at birth, because that is important medical data. However, biological sex is more complicated than genetalia, hormones, or even chromosomal makeup (DNA). It's not uncommon for babies to be born with male genetalia and XX chromosomes, or female genetalia and XYY chromosomes, etc, etc. And after birth, hormone levels controlled by a number of different genes can affect sexual development. (1/3)
Julieanna; This is not about intersex people. Intersex people do not consider themselves transgender and transgender people should not be discussing intersex people As they know little or nothing about the condition. Also, intersex people know about their condition and have absolutely no reservations about revealing this to doctors. Please do not try to justify the difference between women and men by using rare genetic exceptions to prop up idiotic arguments. Except for these exceptions; EVERY Woman alive as XX chromosomes in every cell of her body as men have XY chromosomes in every cell of their bodies. What astounds me is how easy it is been to brainwash people into thinking otherwise. Has never been a time in recorded history where humans fundamentally accept and understand except the difference Between men and women. It is perhaps the first biological fact in our evolution that we did understand.
Load More Replies...Instead of the hateful rant full of outdated and useless terminology like “ biological sex,” how about you educate yourself on best practices for treating transgender patients. Understand that your transgender patient has likely had their identity denied by society and may have even been refused medical care for being transgender. Their hostility may be their defense against abuse. You also cannot simply treat symptoms based on a trans person’s assigned gender (or biological sex as you call it) because any surgery or hormonal therapy may affect what you see as gender-specific symptoms. Also intersex people exist. Even at birth, not everyone can check a box as male or female. For actually scientific reading on the subject, here’s a helpful article from JAMA https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/article-abstract/2697839is
Tell them to take it down! https://www.change.org/p/bored-panda-boredpanda-com-skip-transphobia-keep-it-cute
Load More Replies...To those who insist that a person's psycho-social gender and their biological sex are completely separate things: have you ever considered that psycho-social gender can be a result of innate biological sex differences? E.g. There's a cultural idea that males are more aggressive, but this could well have come about, in large part, because of the gender difference that men have, on average, twice the testosterone of women. The psycho-social tendencies of gender difference are mostly products of real differences in biological sex tendencies. Notice too that you often see this outside the human species: in gorillas, chimps (not the bonobos - the other ones), lions, rams, deer, cattle - many other species, the males are significantly more aggressive. Is 'gender just a construct' for those animal species? Notice that when the males are neutered (in zoos or on farms) they'll act way less aggressive? Gender difference is real. Get over it far left.
I think asking "what was your gender at birth" is a much better way to phrase a sensitive question.
Gender refers to the socially constructed ideas of what a man/woman should be and act like. So that would be weird. From what I've seen asking "What sex were you assigned at birth?" might go over better (though that is appropriating intersex terms, but that is another conversation entirely).
Load More Replies...Surprise, the comment section is a bunch of people making ridiculous and inaccurate generalizations of others. "There are people who think blah blah blah something about how they are destroying society" Seriously, shut the hell up telling people what they think. The original "rant" goes into a lot of detail about respecting individuals right to use pronouns and define themselves, they aren't attacking people for that reason. They even say they may be phrasing it wrong and looking to other options to be clear. To bad so many commenters had to go absolutely bonkers over this and go on ridiculous, hateful tirades. Seriously, if you actually believe Steven Crowder doesn't fake and edit footage and use it to make some hateful point, you might as well skydive without a parachute and just pray really hard on the way down.
99 times out of 100, this "medical professional" (who doesn't know the phrase 'case IN point') needs to know, and is right to know. But there are people whose genitalia DOESN'T indicate their true biological, hormonal gender or sex. True hermaphrodites, those with dna differences. Of course, if the patient is aware of these things, I would hope their doctors are aware as well!
I get the point he's making about discussing biological sex, and agree with that on that particular note. However, as someone who works in the medical field, you should realize there is debate about a third gender- intersex- and whether the medical community categorizes that as two genders "combined" or a different one. There are also *degrees* of intersex, it's not all flat-out full-on breasts-with-male-genitalia. You may not have encountered one yet but that doesn't mean it never happens. I feel you on the occasional over-sensitivity when asked "what their sex is", but using the incorrect pronouns (especially if the clipboard form is marked a specific way) can be insulting. If a patient presents as male and you never got a clipboard form, fine... but if you are handed their records and it states a preference then that is on you.
If someone doesn't want to give you the information necessary to treat him/her, just send them away. Easy.
Relax, Doc. If they're not ready to give up their delusions, they're not sick enough, anyhow.
whoa ! I had 13+ ! Blue hair mommas got me again :D
Load More Replies...The comment section is killing me. There has been a lot of medical research taking place to determine what causes transgenderism and one of the prevailing theories that they are continuing to study now is that it is a birth defect that happens in utero. So we all start off as female and then hormones release in the genitalia and brain, causing some of us to transition into males. The theory is that for transgender people the hormone releases in one area but not the other, causing an individual to biologically be both male and female. Neuroscientists have conducted studies using MRIs to investigate difference in the brain between males and females and transgendered people tend to have more similarities in the brain structure with the gender they identify with than the gender they were born as, meaning that biologically they are both. It isn't a sex thing, it isn't a phase, it is a biological medical condition.
F**k 'em! If those kinds of people thing getting addressed in the right way (if any is actually available) is more important then allowing someone to help you you're a dumb piece of c**p that thinks they're better or special and deserve to die! ;-)
What kind of idiot would refuse to tell THEIR DOCTOR what their biological sex is? Regardless what you decide to do with your life or who you are attracted by, your body is what it is. A doctor need to know. Why refuse to give him/her such crucial information?
Holy c**p. I don't have the patience to deal with these wackos anymore. If they are that obstinate when dealing with medical professionals who are trying to help them, then maybe they deserve to unnecessarily suffer a few uncomfortable ailments for being such sh1theads. Society is burning out quick on trying to appease this never satisfied group. I think it's time we just collectively give them the middle finger and move on. Just my two cents.
Don't worry. I'm sure we are not alone. If enough people with our way of thinking understand that there are others like them, who think we should stop tolerating this amount of idiocy, that they are not alone, maybe they would stand against all this s**t.
Load More Replies...Patton Oswalt says “You’ve gotta respect everyone’s beliefs." No, you don’t. That’s what gets us in trouble. Look, you have to acknowledge everyone’s beliefs, and then you have to reserve the right to go: "That is f*****g stupid. Are you kidding me?" I acknowledge that you believe that, that’s great, but I’m not going to respect it. I have an uncle that believes he saw Sasquatch. We do not believe him, nor do we respect him!”
yes it has to be something like that ... this post seems so far-fetched
Load More Replies...It's with social issues. Go check photography and art!!
Load More Replies...Buddy, I've got something to tell you. It's to either shut up, or f**k off. You came here because you were bored, had some free time, etc. You don't have to waste your time here if you don't want to. Personally, I think that it's great that Bored Panda releases such posts. There are thousands of pandas out there and it's a great way to raise awareness. Only one panda can tell hundred other people, including doctors they know: "Hey, didja know there is now a new trend, some insane people, who feel offended when you are asking for information in order to help them? Careful with them, friend."
Load More Replies...There wouldn't be a debate in the medical field if it was that simple
Load More Replies...Call yourself what you want, but you are male, or female. I no problem with people who identify differently, but when science is involved, its very black and white. Male or female.
Load More Replies...They could then ask if their sex chromosomes were determined to be XX or XY or something else at birth. Some intersex individuals are genetically male or female but others are not. I believe intersex individuals with Klinefelter's Syndrome, for example are XXY.
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