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This Person Tries To Fact Check Bernie Sanders For Saying No One Can Afford An Apartment On Minimum Wage, Gets Shut Down
Bernie Sanders first made major waves with his 2016 presidential campaign. His message was clear and at that time seemed quite extreme – Sanders declared that it’s unfair how much power billionaires have and rallied behind the idea of taxing them to create a society that’s fairer than it currently is, advocating for free education, and raising minimum wages. Sanders gained traction and his campaign was noted for the supporters’ enthusiasm as well as Sanders rejecting donations from corporations. Unfortunately, that wasn’t enough and the DNC passed on Sanders for Clinton in her unsuccessful general election campaign against Trump.
As the 2020 presidential election is quickly approaching, Sanders is giving it another shot with his 2020 presidential campaign. For Democrats, it’s an obvious race against Trump who’s the obvious Republican candidate. Despite Sanders having a ferocious support group, as of the end of 2019, he seems to be behind Joe Biden in the majority of the polls.
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One person criticized a tweet made by Senator Bernie Sanders back in 2017
Image credits: Gage Skidmore
One exchange between Sanders’ supporters and his critic in 2017 recently gained traction as it naturally became relevant again. One person was against a tweet Sanders made where the Senator declared that minimum wage is not enough to rent even a one-bedroom apartment. They quickly threw together some calculation to disprove Sanders’ point and called it a day.
Image credits: sensanders
They presented an argument trying to disprove Sanders’ argument about minimum wage
And while there were some who approved of the criticism
However, another person, who claimed to respond not out of political motivation but rather being irritated by the critic’s argument, went on to post an in-depth calculation of potential expenses that a minimum wage worker might have and how limited the finances of such a person are.
Another person quickly interfered, offering a more in-depth explanation on why they disagree
According to US labor law, the current minimum wage in the United States is $7.25 per hour. Some states, however, have a different rate than the federal one, with such states like California, New York, and Arizona paying their residents a higher wage. That is, of course, understandable, since the rent in major cities like Los Angeles and New York can be as high as $2,650 for a one-bedroom suite. Even so, it’s definitely apparent why the minimum wage seems like a big problem.
The discussion took place back in 2017 and things seem to be getting slightly better 3 years later. According to Apartament List, “rent growth lags even further behind the growth in average hourly earnings, which have increased by 3.1 percent over the past twelve months”. Despite the positive tendencies, it still poses challenges for those with minimum wage jobs in states that haven’t changed the minimum wage since July 24, 2009.
Image credits: Rental Realities
Here’s how people reacted to the “clap-back”
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DE Ray 5 years ago
As a landlord in the South - if you find an apartment for less than $500/month, it's not worth living in. Most Southern states have very few requirements for landlords in terms of health and safety of tenants (Arkansas, where I live and own rental property literally has NO law regarding residential rental property), so for that price you are just about guaranteed to be in a place which is infested, unsafe or otherwise unhealthy. Average rent for a two bedroom apartment in my area is $650. One bedroom apartments aren't really a thing - I don't have any, and of the landlords I know in this area only two have them, and they both operate as residential hotels (includes a weekly cleaning service, front desk, etc. - not the same as most residential rental).
DE Ray 5 years ago
I should also say, as a landlord, I'm not actually making that much off of what even I think is exorbitant rent rates - only the big companies that are able to self-insure can do that. Property insurance on rentals is extremely expensive. For the units I own, I worked out that my annual insurance bill comes out to $390 per month per unit. It's a bit like the screwed up US healthcare industry - insurance is where all the money is going.
Load More Replies...
DC 5 years ago
This is so damned wrong. I mean, Mr. Sanders is right, with every single word. It is wrong that these conditions are forced on people - and, to add a little more shittyness, in one of the richest countries of this world. I don't even dare to imagine what it would be like without minimum wage legislation ... all this blabla about free entrepeneurship and the like is just dumb and ignorant b******t if you, first of all, have to provide stuff to maintain yourself alive - and I'm not even talking about children or other relatives depending on one person's income.
Elizabeth 5 years ago
Only truly rich people have the audacity to believe that anyone can live off minimum wage. Fortunately most people make more than minimum wage, but sometimes that more is just barely more. I wish we could force anyone who believes this BS to live that way for 3 months... oh buddy would they change their minds FAST!
Freya the Wanderer 5 years ago
But what happens when you bewail the plight of the working class? The stooges of the 1% begin farting about "socialism" (whole they themselves benefit from socialist institutions) and $20 tacos. They've never experienced month left over at the end of the money. They've never had to explain to hungry kids why the fridge is empty. They've never agonized over which bill to pay and which to be late on. It's easy to criticize those who struggle when you've never been in their shoes.
Sean Harrison 5 years ago
Can confirm, I work full-time for Amazon here in Seattle and I live in a van because I can't afford an apartment. A 250sq ft micro-apartment starts in the low $1000 range. A studio is easily $1200-$1500, and forget about being able to afford a 1BR apartment (can be around $1800-$2000). And the wait-list for low-income housing is about 5-7 years now.
Veronica Sjöberg 5 years ago
This is SO crazy sad i started to cry! I knew it was bad but not so bad. And you have to pay for health care too? What if you get sick? And if you have kids? And thats for a full time job?
Veronica Sjöberg 5 years ago
When i was still a student at university i earned at least (converted) 13 dollars/hr. And free education (but in most cases you have to take a loan anyway to afford living costs, but not as much if you work part time too. And the loans are at the lowest rates and regulated by the government) And sure, we have about 30%-35% in taxes BUT if you are a student/low income you get wellfare for your rent and all citizens gets almost free healthcare (about 10-20 dollars/visit depending if you see a doctor or a nurse and if you have to pay more than 95 dollars-ish a year it's free after that. And all healthcare for children under 18 is 100% free. And if you're pregnant all check ups are free aswell) And that was when I was still a student! Now I'm at lower median wage as a social worker (still considered underpaid) but never ever that bad even compared to my student loans.
Load More Replies...
Effseven Six 5 years ago
Minimum wage is a joke. However, one could live in California if they made minimum wage, as long as they were renting a room, are single, have no children or pets, and eat once a day. I live in California and have done this. It sucked really bad. Now I'm married and live with my mother in law because mine and my husbands just under 100k gross income can't afford a place to live where our kids are safe and the schools are decent. ( number 1 on our list). After the kids get out of school, were moving out of state.
Renee Gauthier 5 years ago
I'm in a tourist town in Florida & work a professional job, but it's in education so not great. My daughter & her husband & 2 kids live with me because neither of us can afford a place on our own, even though we own the house. My 2-year-old grandaughter rooms with her parents because we only have 3 bedrooms. It's insane.
Load More Replies...
Isabella 5 years ago
Are all American citizens morons, or just the bigger part of them? There is a person who wants to help them get civilized life conditions most Europeans do have - and yet most people diss him or belittle his ideas. WHY?!
A Water Bottle 5 years ago (edited)
Most Americans aren’t morons, you just only see the stupid ones in the news. In the news I get at home there are lots of European morons in it.
Load More Replies...
Carol Emory 5 years ago (edited)
Because all the people in King County WA that were living out of their cars because of Amazon paying 7.25 hr just couldn't bring themselves to share rent or get a place of their own. SHM...puh-leez. Rent when I was in King County about 23 years ago ran around $500 for a 1 bedroom. Until they booted everyone out, flipped the building and started charging $1200 for the same apartment. Many of the apartment buildings that were in Washington that were low income, sliding scale or HUD housing have rapidly disappeared making way for more expensive housing. It is out of control everywhere. And it is either remedied by regulating the c**p out of housing (which will never happen because it means the government takes a cut on taxes) or they raise minimum wage. That simple.
Renee Gauthier 5 years ago
Yeah, you can MAYBE rent a room for $500 a month in my small town, if it's maybe in a rundown trailer. We live in a tourist city, and employers here are desperate for employees to work as servers, hotel staff, etc., all low-paying jobs, but no one can afford to live here & work those jobs. Pay them more? Hahaha
El Dee 5 years ago
The first problem is that many people seek to blame the poorest workers and disabled people too for being poor or disabled. A kind of 'Just World' viewpoint or is it 'Victim Blaming'? The second problem is that with horrifyingly low wages, having to pay for health care, no workers rights and other stuff that goes on that I can't even remember - the US whilst being rich as a country, has people who are in such dire poverty they seem to be right on the brink of destitution, death from lack of access to health care and can be thrown out of a job on a whim - this is the kind of thing I'd expect in a third world country that was developing from extreme poverty and hadn't YET instituted all the rights and protections you'd expect in a first world superpower. Add to this having to pay huge fees to educate yourself out of poverty and you are ensuring that the poor are kept poor - sounds very much like a class system to me. You'd be better off moving to Cuba!
Gabby M 5 years ago
Not mentioned is First, last and security deposit (in my area of NY anyway). The time needed to secure these funds could be FOREVER in some cases. My hometown is a popular tourist area, I have lived here my whole life, I couldn't afford to rent a dive apartment studio or otherwise. Also what happens for those pesky unbudgeted expenses life throws at you, like unforeseen health issues or hell even holidays ie: birthdays, Christmas....if you celebrate. Just Sayin. FYI I'm not for or against Mr. Sanders...I'm thoroughly disgusted with all american politics in general.
Bláthnaid O’Loughlin 5 years ago (edited)
In Ireland it’s really bad as well. I saw an apartment on daft.ie for €750 a month. It was one of the cheapest ones. You know shop windows where the whole front is a pane of glass and a door? It was that, with a couch and a bed, and a small walled off toilet in the corner. There was nowhere to shower, wash clothes, or cook food, and the monthly rent has probably gone up since I last saw it. Something has to be done about this. Edit: I should have mentioned that this is in Dublin, which is one of the most expensive parts of the country.
deanna woods 5 years ago
I live in Texas in a small town and I live in low income housing. I am a pizza delivery driver and my work is pretty much part time and if it weren't for low income housing, I would still be living with my parents. My income includes minimum wage plus tips and driving money and on that I could not afford a more expensive apartment. While some believe it is this way because I am not applying myself, I have a bachelor's degree and have applied for better paying jobs and they won't hire me so I have to settle for the job I can get. Some people don't realize that a lot of us are working hard just to take care of ourselves and want to blame us for our financial situation. If we would pay a living wage none of this would be an issue.
Becca Gizmo the Squirrel 5 years ago
And then add on kids and then you have to get a two bedroom apartment. If you have a boy and a girl you have to get 3 bedrooms. I don't know if this is a law or not (Alabama) but I had a friend a while back and she had to get separate bedrooms for the girls and boys. They wouldn't let her get a 2 bedroom. I'm going to look it up now.
Becca Gizmo the Squirrel 5 years ago
Apparently they can share a room. Maybe it was just that apartment complex that didn't allow it. Or maybe they just wanted her to rent the 3 bedroom because it was more expensive.
Load More Replies...
St. John 5 years ago
Car is not a bare need. Humans have legs. They can also have a bicycle, and also use public transport, that is created for... huh... why do I even try... muricans...
St. John 5 years ago
The problem is when you want to live fancy, while working minimum wage jobs.
Load More Replies...
Ron 5 years ago
OK, let's use VT as an example, since that's where Bernie is from (and where I live). Minimum wage in VT is currently $10.78 per hour. After taxes, for a 40 hour work week, that comes to roughly $1550 per month. There are plenty of towns in VT where 1-bedroom goes for about $700 per month (source: rentdata.org). So, paying 45% of your take home income toward rent is NOT easy, but it IS DOABLE. Does it suck? Sure. Should it be better? Sure. But don't exaggerate the problem - it only gives critics reason to ignore you all together.
Bláthnaid O’Loughlin 5 years ago
The employers know that they can get away with paying minimum wage. They won’t stop just because you take a training course, because they know they can make a big profit off underpaying their employees. We need to make it harder for them to do this, otherwise they won’t stop.
Load More Replies...
Andy Acceber 5 years ago
Wow, you have a lot of feelings here. Quick fact check. It's 100% legal to have a 30min unpaid lunch break in an 8-hr day. It's what most hourly workers get. Most people work five days a week, so working 30.5 days per month isn't accurate. It leaves out weekends. Assuming no one ever takes an unpaid day off except for weekends, the math would be: weeks in a year * (work days in a week * hrs worked per day) / months in year or 52*(5*7.5)/12 averaging 162.5 hours/month. Multipled by minimum wage, that's $1,178/mo before taxes. I'd say the op's estimate was really close.
Load More Replies... 
Stephanie 5 years ago
As a nursing assistant I made minimum wage until I couldn't afford that wage anymore, (and I had to be certified by the State to earn that wage!). You are correct that minimum wage is the starting wage, once upon a time. Nowadays it seems that's what fast food and retail make. Honest hardworking people should make enough to live on. Places like the UK have different min wage based on age which seems fair to me.
Load More Replies...
DE Ray 5 years ago
As a landlord in the South - if you find an apartment for less than $500/month, it's not worth living in. Most Southern states have very few requirements for landlords in terms of health and safety of tenants (Arkansas, where I live and own rental property literally has NO law regarding residential rental property), so for that price you are just about guaranteed to be in a place which is infested, unsafe or otherwise unhealthy. Average rent for a two bedroom apartment in my area is $650. One bedroom apartments aren't really a thing - I don't have any, and of the landlords I know in this area only two have them, and they both operate as residential hotels (includes a weekly cleaning service, front desk, etc. - not the same as most residential rental).
DE Ray 5 years ago
I should also say, as a landlord, I'm not actually making that much off of what even I think is exorbitant rent rates - only the big companies that are able to self-insure can do that. Property insurance on rentals is extremely expensive. For the units I own, I worked out that my annual insurance bill comes out to $390 per month per unit. It's a bit like the screwed up US healthcare industry - insurance is where all the money is going.
Load More Replies... DC 5 years ago
This is so damned wrong. I mean, Mr. Sanders is right, with every single word. It is wrong that these conditions are forced on people - and, to add a little more shittyness, in one of the richest countries of this world. I don't even dare to imagine what it would be like without minimum wage legislation ... all this blabla about free entrepeneurship and the like is just dumb and ignorant b******t if you, first of all, have to provide stuff to maintain yourself alive - and I'm not even talking about children or other relatives depending on one person's income.
Elizabeth 5 years ago
Only truly rich people have the audacity to believe that anyone can live off minimum wage. Fortunately most people make more than minimum wage, but sometimes that more is just barely more. I wish we could force anyone who believes this BS to live that way for 3 months... oh buddy would they change their minds FAST!
Freya the Wanderer 5 years ago
But what happens when you bewail the plight of the working class? The stooges of the 1% begin farting about "socialism" (whole they themselves benefit from socialist institutions) and $20 tacos. They've never experienced month left over at the end of the money. They've never had to explain to hungry kids why the fridge is empty. They've never agonized over which bill to pay and which to be late on. It's easy to criticize those who struggle when you've never been in their shoes.
Sean Harrison 5 years ago
Can confirm, I work full-time for Amazon here in Seattle and I live in a van because I can't afford an apartment. A 250sq ft micro-apartment starts in the low $1000 range. A studio is easily $1200-$1500, and forget about being able to afford a 1BR apartment (can be around $1800-$2000). And the wait-list for low-income housing is about 5-7 years now.
Veronica Sjöberg 5 years ago
This is SO crazy sad i started to cry! I knew it was bad but not so bad. And you have to pay for health care too? What if you get sick? And if you have kids? And thats for a full time job?
Veronica Sjöberg 5 years ago
When i was still a student at university i earned at least (converted) 13 dollars/hr. And free education (but in most cases you have to take a loan anyway to afford living costs, but not as much if you work part time too. And the loans are at the lowest rates and regulated by the government) And sure, we have about 30%-35% in taxes BUT if you are a student/low income you get wellfare for your rent and all citizens gets almost free healthcare (about 10-20 dollars/visit depending if you see a doctor or a nurse and if you have to pay more than 95 dollars-ish a year it's free after that. And all healthcare for children under 18 is 100% free. And if you're pregnant all check ups are free aswell) And that was when I was still a student! Now I'm at lower median wage as a social worker (still considered underpaid) but never ever that bad even compared to my student loans.
Load More Replies... Effseven Six 5 years ago
Minimum wage is a joke. However, one could live in California if they made minimum wage, as long as they were renting a room, are single, have no children or pets, and eat once a day. I live in California and have done this. It sucked really bad. Now I'm married and live with my mother in law because mine and my husbands just under 100k gross income can't afford a place to live where our kids are safe and the schools are decent. ( number 1 on our list). After the kids get out of school, were moving out of state.
Renee Gauthier 5 years ago
I'm in a tourist town in Florida & work a professional job, but it's in education so not great. My daughter & her husband & 2 kids live with me because neither of us can afford a place on our own, even though we own the house. My 2-year-old grandaughter rooms with her parents because we only have 3 bedrooms. It's insane.
Load More Replies... Isabella 5 years ago
Are all American citizens morons, or just the bigger part of them? There is a person who wants to help them get civilized life conditions most Europeans do have - and yet most people diss him or belittle his ideas. WHY?!
A Water Bottle 5 years ago (edited)
Most Americans aren’t morons, you just only see the stupid ones in the news. In the news I get at home there are lots of European morons in it.
Load More Replies... Carol Emory 5 years ago (edited)
Because all the people in King County WA that were living out of their cars because of Amazon paying 7.25 hr just couldn't bring themselves to share rent or get a place of their own. SHM...puh-leez. Rent when I was in King County about 23 years ago ran around $500 for a 1 bedroom. Until they booted everyone out, flipped the building and started charging $1200 for the same apartment. Many of the apartment buildings that were in Washington that were low income, sliding scale or HUD housing have rapidly disappeared making way for more expensive housing. It is out of control everywhere. And it is either remedied by regulating the c**p out of housing (which will never happen because it means the government takes a cut on taxes) or they raise minimum wage. That simple.
Renee Gauthier 5 years ago
Yeah, you can MAYBE rent a room for $500 a month in my small town, if it's maybe in a rundown trailer. We live in a tourist city, and employers here are desperate for employees to work as servers, hotel staff, etc., all low-paying jobs, but no one can afford to live here & work those jobs. Pay them more? Hahaha
El Dee 5 years ago
The first problem is that many people seek to blame the poorest workers and disabled people too for being poor or disabled. A kind of 'Just World' viewpoint or is it 'Victim Blaming'? The second problem is that with horrifyingly low wages, having to pay for health care, no workers rights and other stuff that goes on that I can't even remember - the US whilst being rich as a country, has people who are in such dire poverty they seem to be right on the brink of destitution, death from lack of access to health care and can be thrown out of a job on a whim - this is the kind of thing I'd expect in a third world country that was developing from extreme poverty and hadn't YET instituted all the rights and protections you'd expect in a first world superpower. Add to this having to pay huge fees to educate yourself out of poverty and you are ensuring that the poor are kept poor - sounds very much like a class system to me. You'd be better off moving to Cuba!
Gabby M 5 years ago
Not mentioned is First, last and security deposit (in my area of NY anyway). The time needed to secure these funds could be FOREVER in some cases. My hometown is a popular tourist area, I have lived here my whole life, I couldn't afford to rent a dive apartment studio or otherwise. Also what happens for those pesky unbudgeted expenses life throws at you, like unforeseen health issues or hell even holidays ie: birthdays, Christmas....if you celebrate. Just Sayin. FYI I'm not for or against Mr. Sanders...I'm thoroughly disgusted with all american politics in general.
Bláthnaid O’Loughlin 5 years ago (edited)
In Ireland it’s really bad as well. I saw an apartment on daft.ie for €750 a month. It was one of the cheapest ones. You know shop windows where the whole front is a pane of glass and a door? It was that, with a couch and a bed, and a small walled off toilet in the corner. There was nowhere to shower, wash clothes, or cook food, and the monthly rent has probably gone up since I last saw it. Something has to be done about this. Edit: I should have mentioned that this is in Dublin, which is one of the most expensive parts of the country.
deanna woods 5 years ago
I live in Texas in a small town and I live in low income housing. I am a pizza delivery driver and my work is pretty much part time and if it weren't for low income housing, I would still be living with my parents. My income includes minimum wage plus tips and driving money and on that I could not afford a more expensive apartment. While some believe it is this way because I am not applying myself, I have a bachelor's degree and have applied for better paying jobs and they won't hire me so I have to settle for the job I can get. Some people don't realize that a lot of us are working hard just to take care of ourselves and want to blame us for our financial situation. If we would pay a living wage none of this would be an issue.
Becca Gizmo the Squirrel 5 years ago
And then add on kids and then you have to get a two bedroom apartment. If you have a boy and a girl you have to get 3 bedrooms. I don't know if this is a law or not (Alabama) but I had a friend a while back and she had to get separate bedrooms for the girls and boys. They wouldn't let her get a 2 bedroom. I'm going to look it up now.
Becca Gizmo the Squirrel 5 years ago
Apparently they can share a room. Maybe it was just that apartment complex that didn't allow it. Or maybe they just wanted her to rent the 3 bedroom because it was more expensive.
Load More Replies... St. John 5 years ago
Car is not a bare need. Humans have legs. They can also have a bicycle, and also use public transport, that is created for... huh... why do I even try... muricans...
St. John 5 years ago
The problem is when you want to live fancy, while working minimum wage jobs.
Load More Replies... Ron 5 years ago
OK, let's use VT as an example, since that's where Bernie is from (and where I live). Minimum wage in VT is currently $10.78 per hour. After taxes, for a 40 hour work week, that comes to roughly $1550 per month. There are plenty of towns in VT where 1-bedroom goes for about $700 per month (source: rentdata.org). So, paying 45% of your take home income toward rent is NOT easy, but it IS DOABLE. Does it suck? Sure. Should it be better? Sure. But don't exaggerate the problem - it only gives critics reason to ignore you all together.
Bláthnaid O’Loughlin 5 years ago
The employers know that they can get away with paying minimum wage. They won’t stop just because you take a training course, because they know they can make a big profit off underpaying their employees. We need to make it harder for them to do this, otherwise they won’t stop.
Load More Replies... Andy Acceber 5 years ago
Wow, you have a lot of feelings here. Quick fact check. It's 100% legal to have a 30min unpaid lunch break in an 8-hr day. It's what most hourly workers get. Most people work five days a week, so working 30.5 days per month isn't accurate. It leaves out weekends. Assuming no one ever takes an unpaid day off except for weekends, the math would be: weeks in a year * (work days in a week * hrs worked per day) / months in year or 52*(5*7.5)/12 averaging 162.5 hours/month. Multipled by minimum wage, that's $1,178/mo before taxes. I'd say the op's estimate was really close.
Load More Replies... Stephanie 5 years ago
As a nursing assistant I made minimum wage until I couldn't afford that wage anymore, (and I had to be certified by the State to earn that wage!). You are correct that minimum wage is the starting wage, once upon a time. Nowadays it seems that's what fast food and retail make. Honest hardworking people should make enough to live on. Places like the UK have different min wage based on age which seems fair to me.
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