Company Loses A Client After Manager Takes Vacation And Doesn’t Check Her Work Email
What is the best way to avoid responsibility for your own fault – whether it be work, school or relationships? That’s right, put all the blame on the other person, and it doesn’t matter that this other one is completely not to blame for your own incompetence. The more furiously you insist and the more offended you look, the more effective this strategy will be in the eyes of other people.
Unfortunately, although we were completely joking, of course, many people use this particular tactic, thereby masking their mistakes or elementary laziness. Most often this happens in the workplace, and then there is what we used to call “office drama”.
One such office drama is featured in a post by user u/hollandaisecrabcake on the AITA Reddit community, which racked up over 29.7K upvotes and nearly 3.1K various comments. And, most interestingly, the tactics of the employee who made the blunder seem to have been quite successful. However, let’s talk about everything in order.
More info: Reddit
The author of the post works in a company where they are a supervisor to nearly 30 other employees
Image credits: faungg’s photos (not the actual image)
So, the author of the post works in a company where they are a supervisor for more than thirty employees. The Original Poster and their husband had planned a trip to the beach for a whole week, but the OP, being very prudent, took care about a week before the start of their vacation to ensure that their absence did not affect the work process in any way.
Image credits: u/hollandaisecrabcake
Before leaving for a vacation, the manager warned every subordinate in advance
First, the OP sent out emails to all colleagues that they would be unavailable for a whole week. Then they prepared special instructions for subordinates who were to take over the work with certain clients in their absence. Moreover, the OP specifically shared all the necessary information with each colleague, so they went to the resort in full confidence that everything would go perfectly.
Image credits: u/hollandaisecrabcake
After returning to the office, the manager found out that one of the clients was literally lost for the company due to their subordinate’s incompetence
Remember that famous Murphy’s law? “Anything that can go wrong will go wrong.” After returning from vacation, the supervisor found a bunch of e-mails from one of their colleagues who urgently needed files for an important client, and who could not find them at all.
Image credits: Nkulileko Masondo (not the actual image)
As a result, it cost the company that very client, and the blundering manager, trying to justify themselves, simply put the blame on the OP, whom they could not get in touch with for a whole week. The OP was indignant and stated that the colleague had a week before their vacation to find these files, or at least ask them where they are, and that they’d warned everyone in advance that they would not be available.
Image credits: u/hollandaisecrabcake
The employee blamed their supervisor for not answering work emails and calls throughout their vacation, despite being warned about this
The subordinate’s reasoning was, as they say, ironclad – as technically that lost client was the OP’s, and the blame, in their opinion, lies largely with the supervisor. Moreover, as the OP admits, nobody around even cared that the manager did not bother to collect the necessary files in advance.
Image credits: NEC Corporation of America’s (not the actual image)
Most people in the comments, however, sided with the author of the post, as they did everything they could in that very situation
In the opinion of most commenters, however, the OP is not at all to blame for this situation, since they had thought through in detail the transfer of information to subordinates in their absence. After all, it is impossible to foresee all possible ways in which a situation will develop. In any case, people in the comments are sure that the OP’s company needs a clearer and more thoughtful system for situations like this.
However, a certain share of the blame still lies with the OP, as a supervisor, some people in the comments are convinced. After all, the manager is there to make sure that the employees are efficient even when the higher-ups are not available for any consultation. Although the lion’s share of the blame in this particular case lies, of course, with the OP’s subordinate.
We are almost sure that you have already made up your mind about who is to blame in this story, and what you yourself would do if you were the Original Poster. So we are now looking forward to your comments, and if you also happened to end up in a similar situation, then your own tale will be most welcome.
The US work / life balance is very strange. It's almost like an absolute law in the U.K. that if someone is on holiday you do not, under any circumstance call them and bother them. It can happen with e.g major heads of businesses, Doctors on call etc but they usually give prior permission or it's in their contract to call them if needed anyway. Your average worker here? Nope, it's really frowned on. Holidays are seen as vital time to relax and recharge and think of anything but work.
In Germany you would likely be able to claim an extra vacation day if someone calls you while you’re off. Just as you get vacation days back if you get sick/injured during vacation because those days then fall under (unlimited) sick leave.
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Anyone- ANYONE at all that is saying this guy is the AH needs a reality check. Preferably to the face, with a chair. Period. I could go on a whole essay about how this type of mindset- where someone has to "prepare" for a vacation and have to coddle their employees before they can take a vacation is absurd. I managed large teams and if they messed up while I was gone, that was on them, they are adults and I treat them as such. If my team knows I'm going in vacation, I know they are adults and ask for the tools they need while I'm gone before I go. PERIOD.
Disagree. It is the manager’s responsibility to make sure their staff is adequately prepared for their absence. If those adults aren’t capable of that, then the manager should have dealt with them long before their vacation. The problem isn’t not answering emails, the problem is OP’s management. There’s no way OP can consider themselves blameless. I also manage large teams and the reason I get paid more is I have more responsibility. That means if something goes wrong on my team, I can’t just throw up my hands and say “not my fault!”
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The correct process if you have clients and are going on vacation is to do a handover including providing the person who is covering your work with all relevant files and info. An organised person, which a supervisor should be would have all this on hand. What if there was an accident or personal emergency that kept you out of touch for several days? Your staff should know how to access what they need. You can't blame them for your poor planning.
The OP said she gave them relevant files and everything she thought they'd need. No sure how anyone does better than that since Vulcan mind melds are not a thing.
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This person is NTA for taking time off and being inaccessible. This person is the AH for being a supervisor and yet expecting the subordinate to ASK for files relevant to the supervisor's client. It was the supervisor's job to anticipate that this client might need help and to be sure that the related files were accessible. I feel the supervisor is pushing the blame down instead of apologizing to the subordinate and saying "Ah! I should have anticipated that." I also find it strange that they lost the client. Really? There was NOTHING that could have waited a week? They had a working relationship with a client that imploded because someone was on vacation? How fragile is this relationship with this client? A little strange.
Hmmmm in the works I've had we just leave a minute to our boss and coworkers, telling them who has what, and were is everything they need. Also if they call me while I'm on vacations I'll answer because it must be a really huge emergency, otherwise no one dares to call someone on vacation. That place sounds like it must be a mess.
Sorry..I agree with other posters that, if you are the only one who knows where these files are, that is a bad system to begin with...especially after the recent pandemic situation. What if this key employee dies? Does the business automatically fail? If your business is such a house of cards that pulling on card out causes the whole thing to collapse, your whole future is in jeopardy.
Two things I picked up from this... the manager has THIRTY direct-reports, plus a client load of their own?? That pretty much invalidates the "they're a manager so they're totally responsible" argument. The fault lies with the CEO or higher-up who set up such a ridiculous structure. Even someone who has no work of their own and spends 100% of their time supervising can't effectively manage 30 direct-reports in a manner that they could be 100% responsible for all that they do... that's impossible.
ESH. Your underlings are incompetent and so are you. No, you shouldn't have to respond while on holiday, but if you're the supervisor then it's your responsibility to ensure everyone is prepped for your absence. Develop a more robust system for prepping your next holiday.
Yep. And in this antique office with paper files, going on a vacation without having all their files where they can be found is remiss. I'm old enough to have worked in offices that still had paper files. There was a filing system. Those files should be stored according to the system so others can find them. The idea that someone couldn't find them in their office means they were sloppy and disorganized. An active file for an important client and it wasn't to be found? That would be like me having some key software on a system where no one had access and I hadn't even checked it into source control. I'd be fired because that would be negligent and outside of basic standards for my job.
Load More Replies... First, why aren't company files on a common contract management system? I don't know of anyone that still works with paper documents, even very small businesses. Second, the OP clearly said she gave everyone the relevant files and everything else she thought they'd need. They had 8 days to review, get up to speed and ask her, prior to her vacation, if they had any questions or wanted anything else. It sounds like something unexpected came up, the coworker wasn't helpful and the client used it as an opportunity to change vendors. I can think of very few businesses that can't hold off on something for a week. If this was a company providing something to essential services, where they may need something immediately, then their contract management system is completely outdated for the clients they serve. And that may be exactly why they took the opportunity to leave.
I have a hard time believing this now. Emails but paper files... Why did they need her to find the paper files? Filing cabinets all have the same key if you have 20 cabinets of the same style you have the same key 20 times and what paper file would a client need so badly that they'd fire the company? Everything feel apart because of a piece of paper with old words on it 🫤
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Someone else might have said this, but if the client was that important, this person should have communicated with them about the vacation as well, or should have picked someone specific to handle the client and taken the 8 days to catch them up on the particulars about the contract before going on vacation. The OP seemed to care more about their employees doing the work to prepare for the OP's vacation than to make sure all the clients would be handled properly while they were gone.
Wow, the company's vision is pretty short sighted. You give permissions to selected subordinates to view important documents. If there are extremely important files that none of your subordinates can see, set up a completely separate folder for those files. This is business 101 people!!
YTA. I'm sorry I know a lot of people who don't do client work will say you did your part and the employee should have come to you, but you're responsible for your clients. Before you left you should have gone through your clients and made sure they were covered and proper access was given to whoever was handling that client when you were away. It's nothing complicated. A Google shares drive alone would have solved your problem. In the field I work in I'm legally in a fiduciary relationship with my clients. I still go on vacation but if I let something very important to them drop because I was unavailable I'd be legally responsible for that because it's negligence. If the company doesn't have a protocol in place for this sort of thing when someone is unavailable they need one. Without it you will continue to lose clients because you're not a client forward company.
It's really funny. Yeah sure if you're on vacation you shouldn't work. But there's always exception for anything. Just as you expect the decency of your co worker and employer to not bother you on vacation, you should also give back enough decency that sometimes emergency happened and they can't help it. What answering a couple emails or 10 minutes phone call will ruin your whole 1 week vacation? Mistakes happen, no matter how prepared you are on both side. If you're in a managerial position leaving an emergency only means to contact you is the basic decency you should provide. Just make sure they don't bother you for menial task, tell them if it's urgent and important only. If it can be delayed wait til you're back from vacation. You're their supervisor, if they bother you in your vacation for non emergency stuff you can chew their a*s later.
Are you really that stupid?? If you are working on vacation then you are not taking a vacation. No one should be doing that. You people are so messed up to think people should work on their vacation time. She gave them the info to contact her before going on vacation. So that's on the for not being prepared. Period.
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NTA for not being available on vacation - of course you are NTA for that. But there seems to be a general lack of preparedness for absence, whether planned or emergency. Whether that issue lies with OP or is a wider corporate issue is unclear. Where an organisation/department/team uses electronic and/or physical files, the filing system needs to be standardised in some fashion and in a supervisory position OP has some responsibility for making sure that all staff on their team know where/how to locate any files, as and when they may be needed, and if any of OP's files exceed a subordinate's pay grade that another manager(s) have access.
I understand the need for privacy but the situation was handled badly. Is it so hard to check voicemails and/or emails? You don't have to respond to any of them, but at least keep up with what's going on in the office;if something that was easily fixable via a quick reply, yes YTA. You can't trust that everything will go smoothly without you.
Boundaries exist for a reason. The other person was just lazy and didn't care. Your not to fault in this situation. Their lack of planning is not on you.
NTA, all these commenters heaping blame on OP are unhinged. OP is delegating like they should be, OP is not micromanaging and is holding their employees to a high standard, but one employee failed, 1/32 is pretty decent. My only criticism is that they should be moving into the future and having files uploaded to a server, rather than having paper files that could be hard to find, but that's not necessarily OP's fault
If the results of your management are things don't work it always falls back on the manager period. Managing isn't just delegating but it's delegating well. A good manager trusts but verifies. One should assume anything that goes completely unchecked in the office is likely not going properly. Also communication between the manager and team is the manager's responsibility. It's up to her to make sure she's communicating with her team and confirming that the communication is effective. You can't assume in management. That's not the job.
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Perhaps as a supervisor, a bit more preparation for the subordinates may have been in order but overall, NTA big time. Under previous management in my current company (development), they pretty much dumped all government-related matters to me single-handedly, a low-ranked officer at the time. They even expected me to be on call and standby during my vacation days. I flat out refused and informed them that if they so much as ask me where am I or ask that I make a stop during my vacation/off-days, I would shut my phone off and not even entertain any calls and if the matter escalated further, I'd inform our Labour Union about company practice. They ended up just calling for minor enquiries but even then it felt like I was still working while on vacation. Thank goodness that miserable supervisor I had who couldn't even tell them NO finally resigned this year and new management replaced the old one. It's a much more relaxed place to be now. So, no! NTA for not wanting to "babysit" the company on your vacation days.
NTA at all! I answered work emails on vacay for too many years even after giving everyone on my team more than enough notice. We had a central server where everything was meticulously filed that everyone had access to. This server contained innumerable digital assets: images, logos, working files for projects etc., all organized by year, month, department, asset type and all labeled according to our SOP filing system. And literally every time I went on vacay, I would check emails and find a barrage of requests that someone needed x asset or y logo. Instead of asking any of the 20+ others on my team, they would wait for me to return to send it to them and then blame me for not being responsive, and their deadline was blown. I should add, this was well before we had cloud access to our servers so there was no way I could send it remotely. So, eventually I just stopped answering work emails while away. You're definitely NTA here.
After nearly 20 years with my company, I've learned a few things: 1 - people will ask you to send them something you've sent them multiple times because they are too lazy to find it themselves, and 2 - when you're on vacation, you're ON vacation.
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As a worker who punches a clock, don't call me during a vacation and I will not be monitoring my work e-mail account. As a salaried manager I took a job that allows the company to call me three o'clock in the morning on my vacation. A job in management requires 24 hour responsibility. If you are a manager taking emergency phone calls at three o'clock in the morning you are not doing your job properly.
Managers and bosses are still human. They need time to recharge. This manager did everything any human could possibly do to prevent this and the employee failed to uphold his end. Sorry the manager is not the a*****e.
Why are things set up so no one can access the files needed to serve a client when you’re gone? YTA, there’s 0 way other people should or could know what THEY needed for YOUR client. I hate it when my boss fails at one thing or another and disappears then I’m left holding the bag for angry clients because I wasn’t given the tools necessary to serve them. That’s the job of the manager, NOT ME.
It is double your fault....1 for not giving your employee file they need and 2 because they are your employee
Semi 💩 hole. If you're the key account holder, you'd already know / guess what client needed, so handover was not ideal (ever heard of file sharing?). On the other hand, the company process is also flawed because responsibility should be delegated to same level (manager or above), rather than downwards. Likewise, key information should be company owned so the higher ups can have full access. Seems ridiculous that only OP has sole access to files if the title is anything short of CEO.
Why were you the only one having the said file? Shouldn't your company or at least your team have an access file for all necessary info for all your client?
Y'all mfs talking about the manager and their employees, when really the only one to blame here is the client... like how dare he/she request something 🙄😵
There is a couple of issues here. They're supervising 30 people. I'm not sure how their doing a good of that. If was determined decades ago, the best # to supervise is 7 - 15. Anything more is hard to manage. The files, unless for some reason have to be confidential should be accessible. Even then a person should of been assigned as the point person for the supervisor while gone. They should know how to access any information needed. The supervisor's manager should also be informed of all this information & be the escalation path if the point person cannot address any issues. Not sure what this company is but it certainly has an organizational management issue.
She was on vacation. That means she not subject to working while on vacation. If they want her to answer her phone and answer emails while on vacation they can pay her salary and vacation pay while she on vacation. Otherwise someone else can take care of work related issues while she's unavailable on vacation. Pretty simple she's either working or on vacation but not both!!
You're the manager the buck stops with you. You should hire and/or train better sorry.
She's a d the company are the AH here. Why wasn't there another supervisor monitoring these accounts while she was gone? Why were these workers left on their own in the first place?
You know what? Everyone saying YTA needs to go f*ck themselves. An employee is entitled to have a vacation, FREE FROM WORK, and this one did so with plenty of forewarning and planning. Eat sh*t unprepared morons.
Managers and Small Business owners are constantly faced with this situation. Many have no ability to vacation. If they are lucky enough to get away, there is often constant worry over what could happen in their absence.
8 days advance notice is not much. And you are still the manager. I would have made it very clear not to disturb, unless very very important. And by txt only, so you can check yourself and decide if and when you decide to react. Loosing a client for what may have been a 3 line text reply, is not worth this hassle you have now. I do understand that time off work means just that, it's important.
Clearly, neither the OP nor the subordinate knew that this client would request this file. You can't ask for something you don't know you'll need. If they had a proper content management system and project managers, this wouldn't even be an issue. Also, there had to be more going on here than the OP is admitting. Which is easier, waiting a week to get a file or finding a new team and getting them up to speed? Things must have been messy, unorganized and generally going south long before this incident.
When you are on vacation and can’t enjoy your approved time off then shame on that company!!! I feel for this person unless this person is a direct supervisor and has not trained employees properly or has not delegated in the past.
You should have left the resort's number to reach you in case of emergency.
This company didn't lose a client because the manager took the week off. They lost the client because the manager was disorganized. All files should be organized and accessible to anyone who may have to do work on them. Not just in case of a vacation but an accident, illness, or any other emergency. The fact that people searched but couldn't find the files indicates she needs to do a better job. She put the burden on them by saying "come get what you need from me" rather than what it should be: "Here are all my files and here's how to find what you need."
Every business should have a business continuity plan in the event an employee cannot be reached for any reason. The CEO of the company is responsible for not having had one created or implemented.
Everyone deserves a vacation without being constantly bothered by work. People deserve their personal time. This type of mindset is endemic to America. Most other countries know how to treat their employees like people not their personal property.
The one taking the vacation is the one responsible for giving others all materials needed to get their job done in their absence. I can't help but wonder why the files weren't already in the client's hands before the OP left.
This one is basically impossible to judge, since responsibility here is kind of on two people, plus also whole company is not innocent either. On one side person going on vacation is responsible to make sure everyone and everything is prepared for the leave. On the other hand people taking over are also responsible to make sure they got any information they or stuff needed. Not just hope to get lucky and not need anything. Though considering there weren't only two people here, I wonder why that person couldn't ask anyone else or another supervisor. Places I worked at usually had someone you could turn to, in case something came up and you couldn't find something or didn't know something. Because moments like these will happen. There are edge case scenarios you simply can't prepare for. Though I also can be reached during vacation, there are few people whim I trust that they will only call me as last resort if situation is dire and to those I would pick up the phone.Rest can ask those.
If you are a supervisor with over 30 people reporting to you, there has to be a way to contact you even on vacation. It is really not that difficult. You make it clear when leaving that you will not be responding to anyone except a person you assign as a contact. You make it clear that They are the only person you’ll respond to. If that had been done, the person needing the files could’ve gone to that person for them to contact you. That interaction would have taken about five minutes or less of your vacation time.
Yeah, the manager should have left the files available to the employee. But, like many posters said what if the supervisor had an accident or died. Then, what would they have done. The a*s wiping in the work place is hilarious. Take some responsibility.
Why didn't the employee go to the OP's superior to access the file? It doesn't sound like the OP is at the top of the food chain here...but I admit I can't say that positively. I'm not sure what business this is, but in many scenarios there are very good reasons for not making files accessible to everyone in the department via a shared drive as some people suggested. If the subordinate who was handling the account couldn't access the file and the OP's superior couldn't access it, the company is not using best practices by any stretch of the imagination. That leaves IT, who may need a request from the OP to unlock the file to anyone else. If so, and they followed that protocol, they may be the only ones with their s**t together. If the policy isn't written for a superior to obtain the release of their subordinates files, that's another thing wrong here. I have to wonder if the subordinate actually made the effort, or even thought to speak with the OP's superior.
I don't check my emails over the weekend. I don't answer my phone for work or work anytime I am not on the clock. And don't even think about contacting me if I'm on vacation.. You're not the a*****e in this situation..
If a person is on vacation, then they are on vacation. A person is not meant to be at the neck an call of the company 24 hours a day. 365 days a year. So My conclusion. F**k the company. And f**k employees who think it’s the OPs fault. F**k them. Lazy useless f*****s.
OP, you're NTA and it's sad you even have to ask, after getting ONLY ONE measly week off. The employee messed up and since it sounds like you're their boss, they are the one who should be in trouble, not you. This predatory corporate system ends only when we all stand up for ourselves, one at a time, in every aspect of our lives.
We don't know if they only get a week. We know that they took a week. I never use my whole vacation time at once. She might have a few weeks.
Load More Replies... The US work / life balance is very strange. It's almost like an absolute law in the U.K. that if someone is on holiday you do not, under any circumstance call them and bother them. It can happen with e.g major heads of businesses, Doctors on call etc but they usually give prior permission or it's in their contract to call them if needed anyway. Your average worker here? Nope, it's really frowned on. Holidays are seen as vital time to relax and recharge and think of anything but work.
In Germany you would likely be able to claim an extra vacation day if someone calls you while you’re off. Just as you get vacation days back if you get sick/injured during vacation because those days then fall under (unlimited) sick leave.
Load More Replies... Anyone- ANYONE at all that is saying this guy is the AH needs a reality check. Preferably to the face, with a chair. Period. I could go on a whole essay about how this type of mindset- where someone has to "prepare" for a vacation and have to coddle their employees before they can take a vacation is absurd. I managed large teams and if they messed up while I was gone, that was on them, they are adults and I treat them as such. If my team knows I'm going in vacation, I know they are adults and ask for the tools they need while I'm gone before I go. PERIOD.
Disagree. It is the manager’s responsibility to make sure their staff is adequately prepared for their absence. If those adults aren’t capable of that, then the manager should have dealt with them long before their vacation. The problem isn’t not answering emails, the problem is OP’s management. There’s no way OP can consider themselves blameless. I also manage large teams and the reason I get paid more is I have more responsibility. That means if something goes wrong on my team, I can’t just throw up my hands and say “not my fault!”
Load More Replies... The correct process if you have clients and are going on vacation is to do a handover including providing the person who is covering your work with all relevant files and info. An organised person, which a supervisor should be would have all this on hand. What if there was an accident or personal emergency that kept you out of touch for several days? Your staff should know how to access what they need. You can't blame them for your poor planning.
The OP said she gave them relevant files and everything she thought they'd need. No sure how anyone does better than that since Vulcan mind melds are not a thing.
Load More Replies... This person is NTA for taking time off and being inaccessible. This person is the AH for being a supervisor and yet expecting the subordinate to ASK for files relevant to the supervisor's client. It was the supervisor's job to anticipate that this client might need help and to be sure that the related files were accessible. I feel the supervisor is pushing the blame down instead of apologizing to the subordinate and saying "Ah! I should have anticipated that." I also find it strange that they lost the client. Really? There was NOTHING that could have waited a week? They had a working relationship with a client that imploded because someone was on vacation? How fragile is this relationship with this client? A little strange.
Hmmmm in the works I've had we just leave a minute to our boss and coworkers, telling them who has what, and were is everything they need. Also if they call me while I'm on vacations I'll answer because it must be a really huge emergency, otherwise no one dares to call someone on vacation. That place sounds like it must be a mess.
Sorry..I agree with other posters that, if you are the only one who knows where these files are, that is a bad system to begin with...especially after the recent pandemic situation. What if this key employee dies? Does the business automatically fail? If your business is such a house of cards that pulling on card out causes the whole thing to collapse, your whole future is in jeopardy.
Two things I picked up from this... the manager has THIRTY direct-reports, plus a client load of their own?? That pretty much invalidates the "they're a manager so they're totally responsible" argument. The fault lies with the CEO or higher-up who set up such a ridiculous structure. Even someone who has no work of their own and spends 100% of their time supervising can't effectively manage 30 direct-reports in a manner that they could be 100% responsible for all that they do... that's impossible.
ESH. Your underlings are incompetent and so are you. No, you shouldn't have to respond while on holiday, but if you're the supervisor then it's your responsibility to ensure everyone is prepped for your absence. Develop a more robust system for prepping your next holiday.
Yep. And in this antique office with paper files, going on a vacation without having all their files where they can be found is remiss. I'm old enough to have worked in offices that still had paper files. There was a filing system. Those files should be stored according to the system so others can find them. The idea that someone couldn't find them in their office means they were sloppy and disorganized. An active file for an important client and it wasn't to be found? That would be like me having some key software on a system where no one had access and I hadn't even checked it into source control. I'd be fired because that would be negligent and outside of basic standards for my job.
Load More Replies... First, why aren't company files on a common contract management system? I don't know of anyone that still works with paper documents, even very small businesses. Second, the OP clearly said she gave everyone the relevant files and everything else she thought they'd need. They had 8 days to review, get up to speed and ask her, prior to her vacation, if they had any questions or wanted anything else. It sounds like something unexpected came up, the coworker wasn't helpful and the client used it as an opportunity to change vendors. I can think of very few businesses that can't hold off on something for a week. If this was a company providing something to essential services, where they may need something immediately, then their contract management system is completely outdated for the clients they serve. And that may be exactly why they took the opportunity to leave.
I have a hard time believing this now. Emails but paper files... Why did they need her to find the paper files? Filing cabinets all have the same key if you have 20 cabinets of the same style you have the same key 20 times and what paper file would a client need so badly that they'd fire the company? Everything feel apart because of a piece of paper with old words on it 🫤
Load More Replies... Someone else might have said this, but if the client was that important, this person should have communicated with them about the vacation as well, or should have picked someone specific to handle the client and taken the 8 days to catch them up on the particulars about the contract before going on vacation. The OP seemed to care more about their employees doing the work to prepare for the OP's vacation than to make sure all the clients would be handled properly while they were gone.
Wow, the company's vision is pretty short sighted. You give permissions to selected subordinates to view important documents. If there are extremely important files that none of your subordinates can see, set up a completely separate folder for those files. This is business 101 people!!
YTA. I'm sorry I know a lot of people who don't do client work will say you did your part and the employee should have come to you, but you're responsible for your clients. Before you left you should have gone through your clients and made sure they were covered and proper access was given to whoever was handling that client when you were away. It's nothing complicated. A Google shares drive alone would have solved your problem. In the field I work in I'm legally in a fiduciary relationship with my clients. I still go on vacation but if I let something very important to them drop because I was unavailable I'd be legally responsible for that because it's negligence. If the company doesn't have a protocol in place for this sort of thing when someone is unavailable they need one. Without it you will continue to lose clients because you're not a client forward company.
It's really funny. Yeah sure if you're on vacation you shouldn't work. But there's always exception for anything. Just as you expect the decency of your co worker and employer to not bother you on vacation, you should also give back enough decency that sometimes emergency happened and they can't help it. What answering a couple emails or 10 minutes phone call will ruin your whole 1 week vacation? Mistakes happen, no matter how prepared you are on both side. If you're in a managerial position leaving an emergency only means to contact you is the basic decency you should provide. Just make sure they don't bother you for menial task, tell them if it's urgent and important only. If it can be delayed wait til you're back from vacation. You're their supervisor, if they bother you in your vacation for non emergency stuff you can chew their a*s later.
Are you really that stupid?? If you are working on vacation then you are not taking a vacation. No one should be doing that. You people are so messed up to think people should work on their vacation time. She gave them the info to contact her before going on vacation. So that's on the for not being prepared. Period.
Load More Replies... NTA for not being available on vacation - of course you are NTA for that. But there seems to be a general lack of preparedness for absence, whether planned or emergency. Whether that issue lies with OP or is a wider corporate issue is unclear. Where an organisation/department/team uses electronic and/or physical files, the filing system needs to be standardised in some fashion and in a supervisory position OP has some responsibility for making sure that all staff on their team know where/how to locate any files, as and when they may be needed, and if any of OP's files exceed a subordinate's pay grade that another manager(s) have access.
I understand the need for privacy but the situation was handled badly. Is it so hard to check voicemails and/or emails? You don't have to respond to any of them, but at least keep up with what's going on in the office;if something that was easily fixable via a quick reply, yes YTA. You can't trust that everything will go smoothly without you.
Boundaries exist for a reason. The other person was just lazy and didn't care. Your not to fault in this situation. Their lack of planning is not on you.
NTA, all these commenters heaping blame on OP are unhinged. OP is delegating like they should be, OP is not micromanaging and is holding their employees to a high standard, but one employee failed, 1/32 is pretty decent. My only criticism is that they should be moving into the future and having files uploaded to a server, rather than having paper files that could be hard to find, but that's not necessarily OP's fault
If the results of your management are things don't work it always falls back on the manager period. Managing isn't just delegating but it's delegating well. A good manager trusts but verifies. One should assume anything that goes completely unchecked in the office is likely not going properly. Also communication between the manager and team is the manager's responsibility. It's up to her to make sure she's communicating with her team and confirming that the communication is effective. You can't assume in management. That's not the job.
Load More Replies... Perhaps as a supervisor, a bit more preparation for the subordinates may have been in order but overall, NTA big time. Under previous management in my current company (development), they pretty much dumped all government-related matters to me single-handedly, a low-ranked officer at the time. They even expected me to be on call and standby during my vacation days. I flat out refused and informed them that if they so much as ask me where am I or ask that I make a stop during my vacation/off-days, I would shut my phone off and not even entertain any calls and if the matter escalated further, I'd inform our Labour Union about company practice. They ended up just calling for minor enquiries but even then it felt like I was still working while on vacation. Thank goodness that miserable supervisor I had who couldn't even tell them NO finally resigned this year and new management replaced the old one. It's a much more relaxed place to be now. So, no! NTA for not wanting to "babysit" the company on your vacation days.
NTA at all! I answered work emails on vacay for too many years even after giving everyone on my team more than enough notice. We had a central server where everything was meticulously filed that everyone had access to. This server contained innumerable digital assets: images, logos, working files for projects etc., all organized by year, month, department, asset type and all labeled according to our SOP filing system. And literally every time I went on vacay, I would check emails and find a barrage of requests that someone needed x asset or y logo. Instead of asking any of the 20+ others on my team, they would wait for me to return to send it to them and then blame me for not being responsive, and their deadline was blown. I should add, this was well before we had cloud access to our servers so there was no way I could send it remotely. So, eventually I just stopped answering work emails while away. You're definitely NTA here.
After nearly 20 years with my company, I've learned a few things: 1 - people will ask you to send them something you've sent them multiple times because they are too lazy to find it themselves, and 2 - when you're on vacation, you're ON vacation.
Load More Replies... As a worker who punches a clock, don't call me during a vacation and I will not be monitoring my work e-mail account. As a salaried manager I took a job that allows the company to call me three o'clock in the morning on my vacation. A job in management requires 24 hour responsibility. If you are a manager taking emergency phone calls at three o'clock in the morning you are not doing your job properly.
Managers and bosses are still human. They need time to recharge. This manager did everything any human could possibly do to prevent this and the employee failed to uphold his end. Sorry the manager is not the a*****e.
Why are things set up so no one can access the files needed to serve a client when you’re gone? YTA, there’s 0 way other people should or could know what THEY needed for YOUR client. I hate it when my boss fails at one thing or another and disappears then I’m left holding the bag for angry clients because I wasn’t given the tools necessary to serve them. That’s the job of the manager, NOT ME.
It is double your fault....1 for not giving your employee file they need and 2 because they are your employee
Semi 💩 hole. If you're the key account holder, you'd already know / guess what client needed, so handover was not ideal (ever heard of file sharing?). On the other hand, the company process is also flawed because responsibility should be delegated to same level (manager or above), rather than downwards. Likewise, key information should be company owned so the higher ups can have full access. Seems ridiculous that only OP has sole access to files if the title is anything short of CEO.
Why were you the only one having the said file? Shouldn't your company or at least your team have an access file for all necessary info for all your client?
Y'all mfs talking about the manager and their employees, when really the only one to blame here is the client... like how dare he/she request something 🙄😵
There is a couple of issues here. They're supervising 30 people. I'm not sure how their doing a good of that. If was determined decades ago, the best # to supervise is 7 - 15. Anything more is hard to manage. The files, unless for some reason have to be confidential should be accessible. Even then a person should of been assigned as the point person for the supervisor while gone. They should know how to access any information needed. The supervisor's manager should also be informed of all this information & be the escalation path if the point person cannot address any issues. Not sure what this company is but it certainly has an organizational management issue.
She was on vacation. That means she not subject to working while on vacation. If they want her to answer her phone and answer emails while on vacation they can pay her salary and vacation pay while she on vacation. Otherwise someone else can take care of work related issues while she's unavailable on vacation. Pretty simple she's either working or on vacation but not both!!
You're the manager the buck stops with you. You should hire and/or train better sorry.
She's a d the company are the AH here. Why wasn't there another supervisor monitoring these accounts while she was gone? Why were these workers left on their own in the first place?
You know what? Everyone saying YTA needs to go f*ck themselves. An employee is entitled to have a vacation, FREE FROM WORK, and this one did so with plenty of forewarning and planning. Eat sh*t unprepared morons.
Managers and Small Business owners are constantly faced with this situation. Many have no ability to vacation. If they are lucky enough to get away, there is often constant worry over what could happen in their absence.
8 days advance notice is not much. And you are still the manager. I would have made it very clear not to disturb, unless very very important. And by txt only, so you can check yourself and decide if and when you decide to react. Loosing a client for what may have been a 3 line text reply, is not worth this hassle you have now. I do understand that time off work means just that, it's important.
Clearly, neither the OP nor the subordinate knew that this client would request this file. You can't ask for something you don't know you'll need. If they had a proper content management system and project managers, this wouldn't even be an issue. Also, there had to be more going on here than the OP is admitting. Which is easier, waiting a week to get a file or finding a new team and getting them up to speed? Things must have been messy, unorganized and generally going south long before this incident.
When you are on vacation and can’t enjoy your approved time off then shame on that company!!! I feel for this person unless this person is a direct supervisor and has not trained employees properly or has not delegated in the past.
You should have left the resort's number to reach you in case of emergency.
This company didn't lose a client because the manager took the week off. They lost the client because the manager was disorganized. All files should be organized and accessible to anyone who may have to do work on them. Not just in case of a vacation but an accident, illness, or any other emergency. The fact that people searched but couldn't find the files indicates she needs to do a better job. She put the burden on them by saying "come get what you need from me" rather than what it should be: "Here are all my files and here's how to find what you need."
Every business should have a business continuity plan in the event an employee cannot be reached for any reason. The CEO of the company is responsible for not having had one created or implemented.
Everyone deserves a vacation without being constantly bothered by work. People deserve their personal time. This type of mindset is endemic to America. Most other countries know how to treat their employees like people not their personal property.
The one taking the vacation is the one responsible for giving others all materials needed to get their job done in their absence. I can't help but wonder why the files weren't already in the client's hands before the OP left.
This one is basically impossible to judge, since responsibility here is kind of on two people, plus also whole company is not innocent either. On one side person going on vacation is responsible to make sure everyone and everything is prepared for the leave. On the other hand people taking over are also responsible to make sure they got any information they or stuff needed. Not just hope to get lucky and not need anything. Though considering there weren't only two people here, I wonder why that person couldn't ask anyone else or another supervisor. Places I worked at usually had someone you could turn to, in case something came up and you couldn't find something or didn't know something. Because moments like these will happen. There are edge case scenarios you simply can't prepare for. Though I also can be reached during vacation, there are few people whim I trust that they will only call me as last resort if situation is dire and to those I would pick up the phone.Rest can ask those.
If you are a supervisor with over 30 people reporting to you, there has to be a way to contact you even on vacation. It is really not that difficult. You make it clear when leaving that you will not be responding to anyone except a person you assign as a contact. You make it clear that They are the only person you’ll respond to. If that had been done, the person needing the files could’ve gone to that person for them to contact you. That interaction would have taken about five minutes or less of your vacation time.
Yeah, the manager should have left the files available to the employee. But, like many posters said what if the supervisor had an accident or died. Then, what would they have done. The a*s wiping in the work place is hilarious. Take some responsibility.
Why didn't the employee go to the OP's superior to access the file? It doesn't sound like the OP is at the top of the food chain here...but I admit I can't say that positively. I'm not sure what business this is, but in many scenarios there are very good reasons for not making files accessible to everyone in the department via a shared drive as some people suggested. If the subordinate who was handling the account couldn't access the file and the OP's superior couldn't access it, the company is not using best practices by any stretch of the imagination. That leaves IT, who may need a request from the OP to unlock the file to anyone else. If so, and they followed that protocol, they may be the only ones with their s**t together. If the policy isn't written for a superior to obtain the release of their subordinates files, that's another thing wrong here. I have to wonder if the subordinate actually made the effort, or even thought to speak with the OP's superior.
I don't check my emails over the weekend. I don't answer my phone for work or work anytime I am not on the clock. And don't even think about contacting me if I'm on vacation.. You're not the a*****e in this situation..
If a person is on vacation, then they are on vacation. A person is not meant to be at the neck an call of the company 24 hours a day. 365 days a year. So My conclusion. F**k the company. And f**k employees who think it’s the OPs fault. F**k them. Lazy useless f*****s.
OP, you're NTA and it's sad you even have to ask, after getting ONLY ONE measly week off. The employee messed up and since it sounds like you're their boss, they are the one who should be in trouble, not you. This predatory corporate system ends only when we all stand up for ourselves, one at a time, in every aspect of our lives.
We don't know if they only get a week. We know that they took a week. I never use my whole vacation time at once. She might have a few weeks.
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