Someone Explained Why Veganism Is Not Cruelty Free, And It Might Make You Think Twice Before Going Vegan
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There are many reasons why people decide to lead a vegan lifestyle, but according to these meat-eaters, this style of living shouldn’t be adopted because it’s “Cruelty-Free.” They argue that even Cruelty-Free International certified products aren’t entirely innocent if one was to look at the vegan food industry as a whole. The discussion picked up serious heat after some vegans joined it, and it will surely draw you in, as well.
Forced labor, exploitation of workers, hazardous and extreme working conditions, lack of labor rights protecting agricultural workers and extremely low wage are still very common problems in the food supply chains, even the eco-friendly ones. Agriculture is even responsible for 70% of child labor. Since 2012, the amount of kids working in the industry has increased by 10 million, reaching 108 million in total. And what about the Bolivians who can no longer afford their staple grain, quinoa? The dramatic increase in its demand in the Western world made its price triple since 2006.
These were only a few arguments used in the attempt to make people rethink eating vegan. It turns out, however, that many do. According to the findings by faunalytics, 84% of vegetarians/vegans abandon their diet. 34% of lapsed vegetarians/vegans do so in three months or less. Scroll down to read the exchange on this supposedly healthy lifestyle and let us know your thoughts in the comments.
(h/t cheezburger)
Vegan campaigns such as the one below are encouraging people to choose a cruelty free lifestyle
Image source: americanvegan.org (not an actual photo)
However, not everyone agrees that being a vegan means being cruelty free
People instantly started sharing their own opinions
And while some were questioning the logic behind some of the arguments
Others agreed completely
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Like someone said in the comments - it is pretty much impossible to live acruelty-free life. There are always two sides of each story. I don;t get the point of people trying to enforce their way of life/thinking over other people. Mind your own business, plate and life and everyone will be happier.
"Mind your own business, plate and life and everyone will be happier." *louder for the people in the back!*
That's exactly what I came here to say, except I was planning to use 100% more bad words. ;)
Wanda Queen: just to let you know, 100% more of nothing is still nothing. :)
Absolutely - mind your own business and your own lives - which means don't kill animals and take their lives. A cow is alive for herself, not to be a money-making machine or a steak. If you think meat-eating is a choice, then think again. Animals have no choice. It's like saying, I love the feeling of sex, who cares if the other person wants to join in? We don't have to eat meat. A huge proportion of vegetation grown on our planet feeds cattle for America. If we stopped eating meat and ate the vegetation, then we would be healthier, the planet would be healthier and there might be a planet left for our children - but it takes brains to understand that. Let me answer for you 'But bacon..?' and "Lions have teeth' and 'I am literally allergic to all vegetables and everything but doughnuts'.... and "I had a friend who went vegan for a week and died of malnutrition' - yeah, right.
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I hate everyone who eats meat! And all men eat meat, so I hate men! #fuckmenbutnotinasexualway
Mind your own business, plate and life and everyone will be happier....I need that stitched on a pillow
Abbey I had to respond to u because Femmy has so many Down votes that I can’t respond to her, This next part if for Femmy: First of all if you hate everyone who eats meat then hate yourself! I bet you ate bugs when you were a baby! Or ate something like ghat when u were a baby! Well that’s MEAT!!! 2. Not all men eat meat! That’s very rude and you are catorgrazing men as carnivores, well my best friend who is a boy, he will not eat meat! He is a vegetarian! I personally love meat. So hate on me if you want because idc. You also said “#fuckmenbutnotinasexualway” well that is in a sexual way ._. If you hate everyone who eats meat then doesn’t that mean you hate your family? Because I bet $1 mil (a lot of money) that someone in your family, maybe a cousin or something EATS MEAT!!! Now do I need to say more?
Food doesn't magically make it onto your plate I'm afraid. You are a consumer and that means if you stick your head in the ground you are part of the problem whether you admit it or not.
Alusair - I get your sentiment, but if everyone minded their own business there would be no meaningful systematic change in the world. If we all mind our own business, greedy corporations and cultures will destroy our planet and minority cultures will always be oppressed. So, thanks, but I will continue to mind other people's business.
I am really glad, that (and maybe only alive because) there where people who didn't only mind their own buisnesses and lives when it was time to step up against slaveholders, women discrimination, rascism, rapists, childabusers companies like united fruit and monsanto ruining lives and landslides in SA etc. I really hope, people will realize, that the "lifestyle" of the rich countries is just outsourcing these problems to other countries, that dont have a stable enough government to prevent mayor companies from exploiting their citizens and environment from the cruelty we seem to have mostly overcome for decades if not centuries in the so called "developed" world.
I guess you never saw those videos where animals suffer day by day a horrible life and a horrible death. Yes you can be cruelty free, and that non sense about people be exploit, my goodness every company exploit people in many countries, is the SYSTEM that needs to change, so no more silly excuses be vegan is the way to go.
Best quote I've read in a long time! You win the internet today!
Came here to say this very thing. I don't mind if you're vegan. Eating plant based diet is very healthy. But for a lot of vegans, it's not about any of this. It's only about some false sense of superiority and blasting it daily from their mouth holes. To be fair, the real committed vegans that I know aren't like this. They recognize that while their diet doesn't kill animals, there is still cruelty in the industries that produced clothes they wear, their electronics etc and they try to help in those areas. They are very live and let live people.
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"Mind your own business, plate and life" she instructs everyone in general. What a dumb cunt.
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oh sweetie, stop yer BS. Meat Eaters FORCE their way down EVERYONE'S throat DAILY - have been brainwashing people forever about meat and dairy. And BTW, toots, eating meat/dairy is not only cruel to the billions of animals tortured and killed every year but it is WAYYYYYY worse for the environment, world hunger, and health than veganism is
Oh sweetie, do attempt to at least imitate a reasonable manner when discussing this kind of thing.
Omnivore here. I don’t care what you eat. Just STOP BABBLING ABOUT IT. Seriously, STFU.
Nothing is cruelty free. This is not a paradise, this is real world. While I don't judge people eating meat (I also eat it though not often),. I do judge massive production of meat, slaughter houses where animals are brought up in cages just to be killed, horrible chicken slaughter factories where animals are kept in abnormally cruel conditions etc. Farms are ok, hunting, if done well, is ok, animals kept in any sane and normal conditions, even if they are going to be used as food is, well, let's say ok. Keeping animals slummed up in tiny dirty cages and then chopping their heads off on some moving machine is not and never ok. Torturing any animal for food is not and never ok. We are meat eaters but we don't need to have concentration camps for chickens, pigs and cows. It could be humane.
I completely agree. It's even worse when one considers that we produce more meat than we actually eat.
It very well might be that more than 60% or even up to 80% meat and other animal parts is wasted, not used for food at all. We don't even need fur anymore, there are such great fake furs, humanity does not need real one at all. As for vegans, nothing extreme is ever good, moderation in all.
Nicola my grandparents slaughtered the pigs they raised by themselves, but they never let children watch, cause they'd be too young to understand and the very image of life and death is not a pleasant one. my grandparents weren't very rich at the time so raising their own cattle was a way of having some meat for food. you don't always have the luxury of choice what to eat
Honestly still rather use real fur instead of toxic fake fur. Actually all the parts are in general used. Be it for animal food, cosmetics, etc. They don't just cut off the steak and throw the rest away. On the food. A lot of the animal feed is the soy used for veggies tofu and other soy product. The animals only again get's the leftovers that humans can't digest - cheap feed, bad for the animals, "good" for the humans. Also the corn/grain used for animal feed is not of human consumption quality, again mostly byproducts.
I keep thinking were we would end up if suddenly all meat factories would close down. would we be able to catch that much of wild animal on our own, and if we would, would we be able to utilise every part of the animal to eat on our own? I'm talking not just the breast or thigh parts, but also ribs, cartilages and even bones? this is just an observation, people who eat meat decide to pick out the best parts and often throw out the *non-edible* parts which in fact were always eaten in the past, because meat was not an everyday product like it is now
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Meat means killing a sentient being who doesn't want to die. Would you let your children watch slaughterhouse footage? would you watch it? but it's fine picking an apple... that's because it isn't natural for us to kill. Cats have no problem watching a mouse die.
YES exactly what I think. I'm trying to stop eating meat because of the way it is produced, not because I believe that we shouldnt eat them at all.
Thank you, Biljana. Here in the States we just recalled 207 MILLION eggs poisoned with salmonella. This amount of waste—just thrown-out animal food—breaks my heart, because animals make the ultimate sacrifice to feed us and we repay them with filthy, torturous conditions. It does not have to be this way.
QuietAnt - the conditions of chicken factories are really poor. The animals are kept in very small, very filthy cages that potentially breed disease like salmonella. Even people who don't care about the emotional wellbeing of chickens used for egg-laying should care about the unsanitary conditions of their food source.
But the eggs aren't fertilized, so how are we hurting them? I'm actually curious.
Because they got salmonella - you do realize the problem with salmonella right? It kills people, and can't be feed to other animals as it means it spreads.
Yea, we should be looking at ways to clean up meat and dairy production, because lets face it. We will always end up exploiting animals to some extent, and as human beings we cant even not take advantage of each other, so most people will not ever be convinced to go vegan. But, a lot of what goes on in the meat/dairy, and just agriculture in general, is unnecessarily wasteful, cruel and bad for the environment.
I actually prefer hunting over industrial slaughter. At least with hunting they have a chance to get away and they're not in a cage unable to escape.
The examples given are stupid. Being vegan doesn't require anyone to eat quinoa. Being vegan is employing those "exploited" migrants. Being vegan doesn't require anyone not to buy local. Etc, etc. "All we can do is reduce harm" is the entire point. No, I'm not vegan, but you people are fucking morons.
I would like this comment twice if i could
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As long you keep an animal for food there will be always cruelty. You could have slaves in more human conditions but still will be a suffering for them. You got it now. Well so no more excuses GO VEGAN, for your sake and the animals sake, and the creation's sake.
I'm a little disappointed in this article. Veganism does not equate to 100% cruelty free, nor does it stand for being perfect. Before I get any further into this, I think it needs to be addressed that me being vegan doesn't make me better than anybody else, and stating that I am vegan is not a personal attack towards someome that isn't. That being said, this whole idea of "there will never be a cruelty free way to live so might as well not eat vegan" is ridiculous and albeit lazy. Not every vegan you meet is a quinoa, whole foods loving, preachy vegan (that is only in it for the aesthetic). That is a gross stereotype and is only a small percent, so please don't brush off real issues. The mest and dairy industries are the number one source of greenhouse gases, the number one motive behind deforestation. All the grain we are producing to breed (inseminate) more livestock to keep the cattle alive could feed most of the world. To reiterate, I said meat and dairy industries, not small farms which is a different argument. Veganism = doing the best you can to protect not only fellow inhabitants of the earth but our earth itself. It is not a fairytale ideology. People are self destructive creatures and it's important to weigh out the pros and cons of all the choices available to you.
Thank you for this comment Sarah Sharpe, I couldn't have put it better myself.
I think that the worst thing that happened to humans was basing their diet on product that not local, that needs chemicals to go to you, that exploit the land, the people and the enviorenment you don't see and don't understand. I don't say that eating e.g. few exotic fruit a month is a crime, but if everyone just generally focused on local products, including meat, we would not have the problems with carbon, with plastic, with unjustice expoitment. Why? Because you would care that in your area children wouldn't work on farm. You would care that farm are killing forests because you want to go for a weekend somewhere. You would care that animals would be treated respectfully, because you don't want mass production nearby your home. As simple as that. :(
Yes this is well said! 👏👏👏
No, no, and no. Most of the facts you quote are wrong. Read or watch "Sacred Cow" for a complete rebuttal to most of what you said.
nope 1.5 Billion Cows, here are currently seven billion people alive. do u math ya pleb. and most vegan do act like their better than u, the very judgy. The world's farmers produce enough food to feed 1.5x the global population. That's enough to feed 10 billion (we are at 7.6 billion currently. also thousand of trees are getting planted now and land is protected better (land with forest area) since the fire in australia
actually i see you insulting her here. honeslty you call her pleb, but you obviously never put your nose into online data sites. cattle industry is a plague for environment. You can plant whatever you want, it'll still be the same
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I keep thinking that veganism is another fad.. vegans tend to be self-proclaimed know-it-alls who think they're better than everybody else and that their choice not to eat animal products is morally the best. people who can't eat animal proteins because of health reasons are not that prominent and don't cause that much ruckus.
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Veganism is 100 % cruelty free, i mean a vegan world would be 100% free for animals, we have to achieve that goal, we have to go toward perfection, as long we do this we will be ok. As long we are cruel on animals we will always be cruel with each other, it's all part of the same, violence attracts violence.
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Since you never say anything else and you apparently DO feel free to pile your crap on everyone around you, I’d say you’re being just a tad disingenuous. I would not be able to survive as a vegan. I would literally die. So take your self righteous twaddle and pound sand.
I feel like you didn't read a thing I just said, but I'll take your comment as is. Have a beautiful day.
You seem incredibly aggressive and defensive.... maybe it's something you ate? Love from a meat eater. :P
I'm not a vegan, but this is the most idiotic argument I've seen against veganism. That's like someone saying: "No one should be racist!" And someone else arguing: "It's impossible to eradicate racism because there's no such thing as a cruelty free world and some cultures and religions support systematic racism and here are some cherry-picked examples in which bigotry has benefitted certain cultures!" Solving problems (such as saving the planet and animals) is difficult, but arguing against people trying to help solve the problem is just counterproductive.
Thanks for that, at last someone using logic!
Cristi no
Well, the unlogic thing would be to follow up this logic with the conclusion "So it's totally ok to be racist, I see"
No, because not being racist IS a cruelty free racial policy, whereas veganism is not a cruelty free diet, as we've all been discussing to death.
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But still you cannot erase racism so what's yout fucking point? You just make reversed racism.
Veganism is a step in the right direction. That doesn't mean the direction is paved with gold. Eating quinoa is not fundamentally endorsing child labor - the fact that child labor is used has nothing to do with the environmental impact of the diet itself, it's a separate injustice to correct. However, eating meat fundamentally requires more land and resource to produce, and fundamentally produces more waste (methane, most of all), however there could just as well be children working the farms, particularly in Brazil's notorious meat industry which is taking down the rainforest faster than any paper mill. If you want 100% in control of the cruelty in your diet, have your own farm where you grow all of your food your own way. If you're going to be a vegan, it just means you have a LOT less work to do on the farm, and a LOT less space needed for it.
That runs both ways. Both meat and veg production can be done in sustainable ways. Grazing animals are not inherently bad for the environment. In fact, large herds of grazing animals are a critical part of grassland ecosystems. My family raises beef in reasonable quantities on pristine land in Colorado. The cows share a beautiful valley with a large herd of wild elk, and lots of other wild animals. We have been able to reintroduce native grass species. I would say that holistic grazing practices like we are using are better for the environment than any sort of plant production could be, because we do not need to displace any of the animals or insects that would eat vegetable crops. Of course, it is a relatively small-scale operation, but you should not write of livestock production as inherently bad for the environment.
In addition, there are not only "rich" grasslands but also areas where corn and wheat simply cannot grow (Heath etc). Believe me, sheep are wonderful fluffy delicious greenkeepers.
if your parents live in the countryside, i believe they own cats, dogs, or even horses. Do they eat them also??
Tell me, Max, I guess you still ... KILL ... all those cattle you raise. So how would they see your argument?
Also think about animals like goats that can eat almost anything and that live in almost desert areas.
Yes is so silly blaming exploitation on veganism, is the system that has to change not veganism. For almost every product in the supermarket, people is exploit. The system has to change. Excuses, excuses to keep a cruel life-style.
I think the point here was not to say veganism is bad. but rather to put those sanctimonious vegans that look down on everyone who doesn't think like them back in their place. Nothing wrong with being a vegan. i'm not my self ( i do try to buy free range meat and eggs when ever i can, even if i have to pay a little more) but i can respect their choices. It's when they act all "holier than thou" that you start having issues. It's when you get the "being vegan is the perfect way to live". The point of the article is essentially get off your high horse. Veganism is not perfect so stop acting like it is.
To me, i think the most beneficial thing is to not force either ideology down everyone's throats. Instead we should be looking to clean up the whole agriculture industry to be more sustainable and eco-friendly. There will be more progress if we arent so divided. While i do believe not consuming meat is healthiest, we are still omnivores and eating huge quantities of meat and dairy is what gives you major health problems.
i agree that veganism is serious and shouldn't be taken lightly, or you could face serious health problems. But it's pretty easy to paliate the loss of meat. I just came out from my dietetician 3 days ago, and she confirmed to me that veganism being an unbalanced diet is a myth. as long as you eat balanced, there's no risk at all. you can find iron, and calcium in algaes, and leguminous plants
holier than you exist everywhere nowadays. it's not a purely vegan defect. some vegams go extreme (and certainly wrong), but you can also see these abuses (because they are) simply like persons considering their pets like a part of their family. if you own a dog, and see an abuse in a chinese dog slaughterhouse, they your blood just flip. This being said, i'm vegan myself, and i firmly condemn any bashing from any lobbying group
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So, because animals consume a lot of crops, you condemn ALL meat eating (which would include hunting for example, which involves killing animals who've usually lived off food they get for themselves, and happens in the wild anyway), but the way agriculture is ruining the land, and allowing much worse working conditions, even if not encouraging, to produce things like quinoa, which let's face it not a single gram of which is going to cows etc, is worth the price? Also, might I add, you can also have a humane meat industry, that provides for demand, the two aren't mutually exclusive, and might I finally add, COMPLETELY cutting out meat because of what the current, extremely bloated, inhumane meat industry is doing, including the meat producers, for example local farmers, who are practicing humane meat production, the same way it's been done for quite a while, in favour of agriculture that has decimated Borneo rainforests, for example, is one of the greatest overreactions I've ever seen
Firstly, let's make one thing quite clear: the idea of killing an animal for meat is not immoral. The idea of killing more animals than is strictly necessary in an inhumane method is immoral, but hunting? That's not immoral, that's what every other omnivorous species in the world does. Secondly, if we didn't hunt, and didn't keep livestock, because remember, veganism involves no animal products whatsoever, then they lose their main predator. If you look at a predator-prey demographic, you'll see that when a 'prey' species hasn't got enough of a limiting predator, they shoot up in numbers, causing overgrazing in their habitat, causing a net damage to the local area. Thirdly, and this is very important to note: You can use less resources by eating LESS meat. If you dial down the amount of meat you're eating, and make sure you're eating free range, from animals that have had a decent life, you're being more moral, still cutting down on resources, and staying in keeping with natural order.
well considering humans are animals, and that they have the possibility not to kill, for me hunting is a simple fun hobby. and killing an animal for fun is immoral. also any hunter who respects himself/herself love his/her dog. why he/she loves the dog, and kill the deer. there's a kind of illogism into this. animals certainly prays onto themselves, but veganism never claimed to recreate the whole world. they don't need t; as killing in the animal world is 100% about surviving, and 100% cruelty free. vegans don't want to abolish praying into animals world, vegans try to end animal abuses caused in 100% of the cases by humans. and if you want a strong law to ever be born someday, you need to acknoledge the fact that killing an animal should be reserved for extreme situations. a bit like killing a human criminal that had gone wrong
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Cows require more agriculture to farm than a veg diet requires to eat, for the same reason that your weight it not a combined weight of everything you've ever eaten. Feeding a cow in order to eat the cow is logistically the same as using a fire hose to turn the knob on your kitchen tap. The meat industry could be more humane and considerate, as could the agriculture industry, but if both of them became as humane as possible, only one would still be taking lives. You can only be so humane when you're killing a sentient being. That said, of course eating meat is natural, and of course I'm not going to yell at my cat for not becoming a vegetarian. However if I can go about my daily life without killing something, and with consuming less resource then that's better off in my eyes.
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a step in the right direction? direction of what, a fantasy? people have been living off of animals to survive since our existence......"step in the right direction"
People have also been raping and killing each other since our existence, you dipshit. That's no excuse to keep doing it.
Despite all opnions given. I think we can all agree that the problem is the humans. we kill, we destroy and blame each other for it. we have no respect for the place we live in and we intend to move to another planet, like a disease, and do it all over again.
Amen
Yes the problem is the humans, like those ones without compassion and smart mind to realize that something cruel and unhealthy should be rejected. So no more excuses VEGAN is the way to go.
Oh my god this is so incredibly stupid. Of course veganism isn't 100% cruely free, we all know. But it's a whole lot less cruel than partaking in the killing of 150+ billion animals each year. Or does vegan food kill 150 billion workers each year? How fantastically stupid many people are never ceases to amaze and depress me.
I agree! This "argument" against veganism is idiotic. No vegan ever said he/she lives a 100% cruelty free life. They are making a small, personal choice to eat more healthfully and humanely. And this offends people. What a stupid world, indeed!
Vegan is 100 % cruelty free, the world is not but we should aim to that, you got it now? Besides is so idiotic as you said to blame exploitation on veganism when always every product you buy in the supermarket implies exploitation. It is the SYSTEM that has to change. SO no more excuses go vegan for your sake and the sake of the whole creation.
I wonder how many of these people who are judging vegans for affecting the cruelty of "brown people" have no problem shopping in their favorite stores where the products are also made by "brown people" for slave wages.
Aunt Messy: No, I'd rather save a billion cows. Also, that kid is probably gonna die from pesticide poisoning anyway, you know. Me not eating meat will probably not affect it much. Also, please do not force racism on me, like that. That's low. I don't care what color people are.
that's true lol x)
A) if we killed *less* animals, in a humane fashion, I don't see any immorality, I just see nature B), if you look through the comments, you'll see there's a lot of reasons why eating meat is a necessary thing C), if you don't think of eating meat as cruel (which you shouldn't), then being a vegan isn't any less cruel D), it's 2018 and you're still amazed by people being twats?
Vegan is 100 % cruelty free, the world is not but we should aim to that, you got it now? Besides is so idiotic as you said to blame exploitation on veganism when always every product you buy in the supermarket implies exploitation. It is the SYSTEM that has to change. SO no more excuses go vegan for your sake and the sake of the whole creation.
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So you just made the author’s point. You’d rather save a cow and let a kid die of pesticide poisoning - why? Because the kid is probably brown?
a + for the bees. I do think not eating honey is alright if you don't like the taste or you have diabetes or something, but because of "animal cruelty"? Dumb
Apparently it’s “bee slavery”. Clearly it was coined by someone who had not the vaguest notion of the social life of bees.
you clearly have no idea either
each to their own. we don't need more reasons to hate each other.
Did you even read the article Sheila?
Sheila, be a good turtle and pull your head in.
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really????? Try being that pig or cow in a slaughterhouse and then say to each his own - POS
There's definitely one piece of shit in here, you're right about that.
Try being a pig or cow in a world where they've lost their natural predator, have shot up in population, overgrazed, lost their food sources, and have now wiped themselves out because some preachy vegans were assholes in internet comments and then try being a self-righteous idiot about it
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guess you'd say that about slavery and rape and murder of people as well, right???
Real enlightened, there, Sheila.
Let's not forget how much of food is wasted every day, every year. Plus consumption of meat is getting crazy, my grandparents ate meat once per week, my parents grew up having meat few time per week, now people in my country having meat everyday for breakfast, lunch and dinner.
This article does not address that non-vegans are eating from the same crops as vegans! It makes it sound like vegans are contributing more to human cruelty that non-vegans, which is not true. Veganism is a fight against animal cruelty- human cruelty is a separate issue that needs to be adressed by all people. Vegans have little to no bearing on it. The foods people labor to make are bought by vegans and non-vegans alike.
at last - you'd think non-vegans never eat a single solitary vegetable, grain or piece of fruit ever
I'm really confused as to why this Bored Panda shares so much anti-vegan propaganda. I love the animal pics, the heart warming stories, the funny anecdotes, and the awesome art, but why this???
I wonder this, too! And this post isn't even a halfway intelligent argument against veganism; it is cherry-picking random and unproven ideas. Rabbits have to be gas-bombed to grow crops? Quinoa supplies are depleted because of ... vegans? Um, no.
lol quinoa made me laugh too
Always the same - anything bad that isn't explicitely and only anti-vegan is to blame on vegans, while the production of meat is actually turning this planet in a paradise for each and every human. This is just low-level propaganda, not even missing a point, but not even aiming at any point that's a member of reality. Veganism is one way out of a few parts of cruelty, not making them disappear at once, but refusing to actively cause them. ... but haters will hate, and it is very likely to always find someone backing up the dumbest shit of meat-apology, just because "bacon, thug, YOLO!" or something alike. People treating other animals AND humans like shit will blame you for not preventing every case of humans being treated bad. Be vegan and buy one soy bean - the fact that soy beans are grown in former rainforest areas makes you guilty, even if yours were from somewhere else - buy pig's corpses that actually ate the soy grown there - you're innocent. Stupid people are simple.
Because... it's true?
You should do some actual research before you start spouting this ignorance.
well i guess any subject has the right to debate. but i agree that the author probably never read how disastrous meat eating is on an ecological level
My thought exactly!
Probably because they're in charge of their website and they can do as they please.
Not really hating. Just picking out flaws, and pointing out problems.
Because they also share preachy vegan propaganda (though it's usually in the form of some dickhead in the comments), and because free speech exists, and you're allowed to share whatever you want on this site.
Well not whatever you want, but you know what I mean
Most stupid responses I ever read: Do you know how much land they chop down just to breed and slaughter animals? 65 billion animals every year. You can also multiplay this number by 14 since animals needs 14 times more food than humans. Stop coming up with excuses for your tastebuds. They can all be easily debunked in sqeconds.
sadly true
What about crops wihch are exported or harvesed by children to feed animals that will be eat by men?
What about it? Are the crops to blame? Or the system we have in this world? Think, think hard. You see? Well, no more excuses Go Vegan for your own benefit and the planet benefit too.
Much of that is what is deemed not human consumption worthy. A wast majority of animal feed is in fact soy bean by products.
Exactly
Because it's not possible to live 100% cruelty free, people shouldn't waist their time doing the right thing. This argument can apply to everything humans do, and is completely absurd when applied to basically anything. That is why it is a fallacy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana_fallacy
That's is just a silly excuse from somebody that clearly eats flesh and don't have compassion on animals. YES we can be 100% free, we have to aiim to that. Exploitation is due to the system we live in, so is the system to blame not the crops, agree? Yes that so dumb. Well sir no more excuses to keep eating animals, for your sake and the sake of the animals and the whole planet Go Vegan.
Erm... belittling people with different opinions is a horrible idea and counterproductive if you aim for a good cause.
Being vegan is just a way of life and not a diet. Vegans don't use leather products, don't use products that came from testing on animals and don't use generally whatever comes from the cruelty against animals. A vegan can just eat whatever exists in his country and it's not necessary to eat quinoa or anything else. All of you meat eaters who judge vegan for non cruelty free behavior don't changing your fucking cruel diet and lifestyle in anything. Vegans try at the end. I best most of you drink coffee which comes from huge brands mostly by children's slavery in many countries in Africa. If you try o change something in your lifestyle maybe you can be a little better for the stain you leave behind you in this planet!
well said
Goddamn, I am so proud of shopping at my local farmer's market
I'm vegetarian and I don't understand why people think it's okay to be violent ab all of this , be nice . No ones gonna listen to you if you're yelling at them .. they will do the opposite. If you want people to become vegan . Show them your side and ACTUALLY research your stuff . Or just leave them alone .. maybe there happy with there life style . I wouldn't want someone yelling at me about how they think it's wrong that I'm vegetarian. I'm vegetarian because the meat industry is completely bonkers (in my opinion ) but I'm also a lgbt rights activist, feminist and people that only care ab the animals in my opinion are crazy . if you're gonna care ab one living things life . Then you need to care about every sex, race, culture, and sexuality .
The dairy and egg industries aren't a paradise either. And why do you assume that people who care about animals don't give a damn about people? It's not either/or.
Veganism is not wrong.. Its not easy to save whole the world... but... when you save just one life it will be whole world for this life... just try to do your best and do not be blind
Being vegan isn't a matter of being perfect. It's a matter of trying to do the least harm to nonhuman animals as is reasonably possible. If everyone did that what a beautiful world this would be. Being vegan is easier, better, and more compelling than ever. If you aren't already what are you waiting for? There's no good reason to not be.
I think the point is that just because something is 'vegan' doesn't mean that it's not having a deleterious impact somewhere in the food chain. The take-home message is that even vegans need to be responsible in the choices that they make, and if we're all going to step as lightly and as kindly as possible on the planet that means that we should minimise our consumption of things like palm oil as much as we do our consumption of feed-lot beef.
Actually it would be a World with a significant overgrazing issue, dooming numerous herbivorous species
And how does it even matter? It's interesting, the current backslash against vegetarianism and veganism (and organic farming, too, by the way). I'm wondering what's the need to "fight back" people based on their choice of diet. Is it lead by the meat industry? I'm just wondering. I have been eating meat, vegetarian and vegan at different point in my life (and I'm probably going to cycle through it a few times again) and that's just what I want to do. I do believe there is value in a meat-free diet for the environment and your own health, but I don't preach others to do the same. Everybody is free to do what is best for them. I don't understand why there need to be "campaigns" against a minority group that are trying to improve an aspect of their life (compassion toward other living beings). Save your effort to make yourself a better person in the way you chose to and let others live their life. Seriously.
I don't know how it is in other countries, but in the U.S. people get very defensive if they feel they are being told what to eat. (Similar to the gun-right argument: No one is trying to take guns away but Americans get furious if you even suggest gun reform.) Perhaps this is because there is, surprisingly, a huge vegan movement happening in middle America. Probably because people are sick of having heart attacks, but Cooks Illustrated just put out its first vegan cookbook because it said 40% of its recipe requests are for vegan food. 40%!
What a nonsense, it's like saying, "sometimes i have slaves and sometimes not, what does it matter anyway, what's wrong with that, let people do what they want". Please! No more excuses for your sake and the sake of the whole creation don't eat animals again, cause that's wrong and that is a fact.
Let others live their life? Then how about let animals live their lives? Radical thought!
Let's be brutally honest. We're all a part of the human (over)population on the planet, so we're all contributing to the pressure that our diets put on the global ecosystems. Even if we're eating veganly, our soy contributes to the destruction of the Amazon and our palm oil (which is in a huge proportion of things that come into contact with the inside and outside of our bodies) contributtes to the destruction of SE Asian rainforests - the home of orangs. Yes, more vegetables and less meat is better, but eating some meat is the price that prey species pay for evolutionary continuation: remove their utility and they would otherwise become extinct. Want to make a big difference to the planet? To paraphrase Michael Pollan, "eat [real] food, [fresh and locally-grown]. Mostly plants. Not too much."
The vast majority of the soy that is grown in the Amazon is used as food for cattle. Farmed species were not invented by humans. There are wild populations of chickens, cows, pigs, etc., and many domesticated ones have very successfully thrived in the feral state, so no, these species would not become extinct if people stopped abusing them for food.
5) To finish, I personally do not eat red meat except when a neighbour slaughters one of their own animals, in which case I might have a biennial meat meal. I don't eat seafood because the netting process has awful impact by way of bycatch, and because the animals are not dispatched quickly - anyone's who's had to endure the asphyxiation of a squid or a tuna on a deck would understand why seafood is in many ways far more inhumane than land-based protein. And with seaoofd there's also the issue of profound over-harvesting - humans have emptied many of the seas of their species, and I cannot in good conscience contribute to that. The only meat that I eat is chicken, and I raise them myself, and do the deed myself, so I have enornous respect for the birds in my care. Eggs are the main protein staple, and as my birds are free-range and absolutely spoilt I have no problem at all consuming them.
4) So, having animals for consumption is not necessarily a bad thing - as long as we genuinely and assiduously pay attention to the welfare of the environment, and to that of the animals that we have in our care. It is possible to have happy animals, and on a well-kept and humane farm they are often much happier than the lives led by their wild counterparts who are at the mercy of Nature's red teeth and claws - and falling trees, and ravaging diseases, and young turks, and... I think that you get the idea - there are many brutal ways that animals die naturally, and they all die in the end. ON which point - if we removed animals from agriculture we'd see a resumption in more hunting, because we will never achieve 100% vegetarianism in humans. More hunting would see more suffering than would probably happen if the same animals were killed quickly on a farm.
6) And one last point - we need to be careful not to anthropomorphise animals. Doing so demonstrates disrepect for them, and imposes on them our own motivations and feelings - which may be worlds away from what is best for the animal. Instead, we should try our best to understand them from their own perspectives, however philosophically-fraught that might be. In doing so we need to be both objective, with recourse to scientific fact and impartial assessment, and also thoughtful and introspective... Whether one regards it as symbioses or spiritual bonds, we are connected with the animals in our care and it benefits all of us if we do our best to understand these relationships as best as we can.
3) Continuing further, I have a friend who was vegan for 30 years. She was suffering from an ever-increasing range of illnesses and a lot of investigation eventually concluded that she had a type of malnutrition that resulted from her diet. Even though she is an 'expert' in balancing vegetarian foods she started to incoporate a little bit of animal protein into her diet, and the effect was immediate and profound - her health rapidly improved. Finally, this same friend is a market gardener, and she raised a point that many people omit - in both a biodiverse (permacultural) farming context and in natural ecosystems, removing animals/predators creates imbalances that affect the overall resilience and productivity of the systems.
2) Further, the feral varieties are in many cases not present in their original (natural) ecosystems, and are therefore pests that damage the systems in which they are found and should therefore be removed. Further still, the original ancestors of some of these breeds are already extinct (auroch and horse predecessors, for example) and there's no guarantee that all feral versions of domestic breeds will survive the inevitable climate change that humans have locked in over the coming century and beyond - they have a better future if they maintain their symbiosis with humans. I'm arguing that utilitarian breeds have their own evolutionary, social, and economic worth, and the line that I draw is where humans select for features that result in disease/distress for the animals - bulldogs, goats and cats that fall over when startled, etc…
1) Mary, I'm primarily talking about the astonishing varieties of domestic species that have evolved through 'artificial selection' over thousands of years - which is actually an evolutionary compact between humans and animals: evolutionarily, both benefit from the domstication. (As an aside, it's interesting to delve into the theory that dogs domesticated humans as much as humans did dogs). But back to the point: in this context "farmed species" absolutely WERE "invented" [sic] by humans. The vast majority of these species would disappear if they were not used for the purposes that originally pushed their evolution, and many of these varieties are the iconic mascots that are used in animal welfare campaigns in the first place. It would be ironic if their salvation from exploitation resulted in their extinction. And yes, they would become extinct, just as there are many thousands of domesticated plant and animal varieties already teetering on the edge of disappearing forever.
I am vegan, thanks God, I don't eat soy or peanuts, which i see people here complain so much about it, you have all kind of grains to choose from, and flours, and fruits and vegetables, and can do many dishes with them. SO what is the excuse now. Money i live with 40 dollars a month, even in the middle east this is very little money, so no more excuses Go Vegan, no more eating animals, for your sake and the sake of the whole creation.
if you watch a couple of data sites on the web you just can't compare crop agriculture, and meat/cattle agriculture. meat industry is disastrous in comparison. veganism is not about clean kiling of animals. veganism is about (among others) trying to give a chance for a strong animal protection law to ever see the light someday. and this can't happen as long as you kill animals for food. vegan diet is perfectly good, but your friend obviously didn't took the thing seriously, thus the cause of his diseases. It's crucial when you start a vegan diet to do some research, to learn your body needs. if you do this correctly, i can ensure you that the vegan diet is perfectly good for humans. pest isn't a problem at all if you reintroduce predators
I agree, you can minimize the cruelty, although not live cruelty free. But I think that such things as animal testing and fur farming are not even useful and should be stopped.
Idiotic argument...what is wrong with you Bored panda writers?
Here's the thing: We as human beings can and often have a negative impact the earth, people, and animals. The clothes you wear , the products you use, the way you live is probably having a negative impact on something. We just need to CARE. Vegan, non-vegan, not shoving options down each other's throats. I believe that we should just do anything that we can, no matter how small, to lessen that impact. Educate yourself, make small changes, be kind to people. JUST CARE.
Yep.
Stupid article that tries to blur the lines by saying that what wont work for like 1% of the population means that the other 99% are justified in doing. If there was a vastly superior alien species and like 5% of them "needed to eat humans to survive", would you just shrug and go "well, they're superior... I guess we gotta sacrifice one of our newborns once every month to keep them alive even though the other 95% don't need human flesh to live"? No, we would try to find a way to feed those beings without killing our own. This article pretends to be ignorant the reality that animal agriculture takes up significantly more land than plant agriculture and that plant agriculture is used to feed animals... so even if "you are still hurting animals to grow crops", you're still growing plants to grow to feed animals. And it takes a lot more land to feed animals to feed humans than to feed humans directly. Ignores that a lot of problems brought up can be resolved by GROWING YOUR OWN FOOD!
Whether veganism is/is not cruelty-free is a question worthy of intelligent debate. Stupid comment suggesting that white quinoa-eaters care more about animals than they do about brown people is just such a stupid comment. If you're going to associate veganism with racism, the least you can do is provide some checkable facts and references regarding the quinoa-deprivation of brown populations worldwide. Otherwise you're just making witless noise and embarrassing yourself.
What horrible arguments. I hate getting drawn into clickbait like this but FFS these arguments are ridiculous. It's like saying you should beat the shit out of your girlfriend because you'll accidentally bump into her sometimes which might cause her pain if she hits the corner of the coffee table.
I really hope that logic tells you that the production of meat requires multiple times the agricultural products (wheat, soy, potatoes, whatever you want to feed to the animals before you slaughter them). Depicting vegans as racists just because may be the top of hypocrisy. Yes, it's goddamn annoying that rabbits are being killed by farming machines, not to mention the child labour, use of pesticides still going on, but you can reduce all of that shit simply by directly eating plants.
Sissikuk and others, you really think the explotation of people has something to do with veganism? That veganism should stop bc of that? Man! people has no brain. THE SYStem has to stop, no veganism. Companies exploit many people for many products, almost every product you buy in the market means somebody is exploited. I am from South America and i am vegan, thanks God. The meat industry, the plastic industry, the paper industry, the toy industry, the sport industry, and a long etc exploit people. Is this capitalist system who has to change or better has to be eliminated. So please think before posting something like that.
I know I will be downvoted to death, but I can't live without meat... I respect a lot those who are vegans, because I don't have the guts to do it! Salmon, barbcue, chicken, beef... It is part of my life. Yes, I like animals. I don't like the cruelty of the food industry. But I have also other point of view, that will probably make you hate me more than I hate myself: Humans are animals too, meat is an important protein for us. I'm sorry if I ofended anyone, not the point... But I just can't go vegan.
Please let me contradict you: You sure have the guts to eat less or no meat or even become a vegan, if you like! I was kind of dependent of meat for a long time, then I started to simply add more vegetables to my diet, and it seems that's what I was lacking all the time. Now I crave for vegetables and feel a lot healthier. If you'd like to try "veganism", simply start by testing various vegan foods, pick what you like and make it part of your diet. That way, you'll automatically start to eat less meat by eating more different things - much better than just leaving a vital part out.
Lapetos, thanks for the kind response! I love vegetables as well, and living on brazil, our daily diet includes lots of them. But something I forgot to mention is that I'm still 13, and maybe just cutting meat out of my diet would damage my growing process. Maybe when I'm older ot would be safer to try and go vegan, but for now I think ill wait. I have a friend that wanted to go vegan (same age as me) but when she went to a nutricionist, he said that it would be best for her to wait until she fully develops her body. Again, thank you for helping, and excuse my poor english, as I'm brazilian, hehe...
you can perfectly go without meat. Just open the door of a dietetician. And you'll see meat is not mandatory at all for human body
At least they tried. Im anemic as well, not that severe though, but I also cant digest any meat besides fish. It just doesnt stay down. Some people with iron deficiency caused anemia will always be anemic regardless of what they eat. Ive always had that problem and it runs in the family, non-meat eaters and meat eaters alike.
Yes veganism most certainly is not the best choice for everyone! A lot of vegans seem to forget/not care that some people have serious medical issues that would prevent them from going vegan. I know someone who is anaemic and when they attempted a vegan diet they ended up hospitalized
Gosh you know one person who was apparently hospitalised after attempting a vegan diet - that settles it then. None of us should ever go vegan. Jeez - just do a little research, do.
I agree. A vegan diet should be carefully planned, and especially if you're anaemic, it can be devastating just to change to veganism from one day to another. Wouldn't it be much better to start by just adding more vegetables and other vegan foods to your still-meat-eater diet? That way, you can explore what does you good, what's a good idea to replace and what can't be replaced.
Everyone seems to missed that the vegan claimed "Veganism is cruelty free, affordable and the best choice for everyone", they also called op name for not being a vegan in the first reply and the "anti-vegan" arguments below are simply the replies to that vegan's angry rant. They're are not making vegan looks "bad"
I tried to be a vegetarian, but not vegan, in my younger days. After just a few days, I found I had no energy, felt ill, and was constantly hungry. I also noticed changes in my hair and skin, and not for the better. Went back to including meat and those problems went away. Guess there were some nutrients in the meat that I wasn't getting from other sources. If it works for you, fine. But don't expect everyone else to follow you. It doesn't work for some people and causes more problems than it solves.
Also, a lot of vegans have better iron status than people who consume milk and meat or vegetarians with high milk consumption, because milk protein disturbs the intake of iron from any source. Greens, legumes, and fresh whole-heartedly are very rich in on iron, but milk protein will wash it away... I always have to remember that when tempted to add cheese or other diary to my incredible good looking, fresh salad
Fortunately nowadays the issue of malnutrition in vegan diets is solved an science says: if you eat a balanced diet of greens, veggies, grains and fruits the only thing you have to replace is B12. But since it stems from soil bacteria in nature, most farmers feeding grains mostly have to substitute it in cage/indoor breeding as well. So why not skip this step and substitute it directly?!
for B12 algaes (spirulina, chlorella...). algaes are true gold mines
you simply made a classic (and dangerous) error lot of vegans do. to start that diet without doing some research on your body needs. But if you eat balanced (which is easy once you know) that diet is perfectly wealthy. You were probably in deficiency of lot of stuff
Yeah, that happened to a friend of mine. They just cut out the meat, but unfortunately replaced it with noodles and cheap bread, which is basically sugar. And by not eating meat from the takeaway places, he lost a lot of vegetables in his diet, the meat food was garnished or mixed with. But for him it took 2-3years to notice those effects, so maybe you already were depleted of important nutrients?! Then he got a proper consultation on nutrition and now he is freakishly athletic and proud of his health.
There are also many people who demonstrably improve in health when they go back to a diet that includes animal protein.
It was more likely a placebo effect, the fact is there are plenty of people who are vegan(Williams sisters for example) who don't go through these extreme effects.
Ok, so maybe veganism isn't 100% cruelty free, more like, 90%. You can't argue that since something isn't perfect it is there for pointless, that's stupid. Live and let live.
You're purposely missing the point, and that's really unfortunate. You'll never learn anything when you hide your head in the sand.
Ok, it's not just not cruelty free, it also has caused a lot more land to be taken up, and a lot more environmental damage, as agriculture has to expand to accommodate "superfoods" etc. (UGH), and you can argue that switching to something equally cruel is pointless, because it is. Also, you can't say live and let live and support the argument we should all go vegan
Also, @anarkzie, I don't know what you're talking about with slave labour, personally I recognise both industries are accountable for these things, but yes, land is taken up for cattle, and because of it there's far less necessity for the huge swathes of agricultural land. Both take up land, and, provided the meat industry becomes far more humane, and our diet becomes far less wasteful, an omnivorous diet is the balanced, far more environmentally friendly, safer option. Plus, it would mean leaving off on self-righteously trying to imply that meat-eating as a diet is in some way unethical, or damaging to animal populations, saving an awful lot of time, effort, self respect, and the sanity of the internet community at large
@Mary Finelli. Wrong on both accounts. Firstly, in order to fully sustain yourself on a vegan diet, you have to have far more crop diversity, meaning far more individual fields, whereas, if we were far less wasteful, and ate, again, *less* meat, the meat industry would be far more efficient, and due to far less need for crop diversity, so would farming. Secondly, how many times, it's not unethical to kill animals for meat. It's what has happened in omnivorous and carnivorous species since the dawn of time. There are many humane methods of doing it, and without a natural predator, as previously discussed in these comments, herbivores start to overpopulate, since their population is far less limited, causing overgrazing, causing overall damage both to land, the planet as a whole, and to the herbivore. We are that natural predator, and we're a necessary part of the food chain. It's not immoral, it's a necessary part of nature, and without it, there's far more environmental damage.
@Derpy you act like land is not being taken up for cattle, it's one of the main reasons the Rainforest is despairing. For as much as you guys harp on about Vegans telling people what to eat for the good of the world you cannot see that you're coming out with the same crap, just that your arguments does not hold up, what about the crops that feed the animals that you kill, is only crops that feed vegan that use "slave Labour" or whatever? Eat meat if you must but don't act sanctimonious about it.
Wrong, Derpy Bob. A vegan diet is far more efficient with land use and other resources, and it is far less cruel regarding farmed animals and wildlife. Live and let others live: animals.
I cannot metabolize carbohydrates properly. For health reasons, the vast majority of my diet must come from animal products. This is not a choice. After explaining this, a vegan told me that the world would be better off if I went vegan and became sick and died. How is that not cruel?
Oh, veganism is not 100% cruelty free? Then let's kill animals instead ... :-( Most amazed about the argument "Immigrants get exploited for crops" ... pray tell, who do you think works in slaughterhouses, most often under horrible conditions???
Bored panda, why the f*ck you share again such an old post that as been said again and again is full of s**t ? Seriously clickbait is stupid.
ok here's my (vegan) song. perfection doesn't exist nowhere. but, veganism doesn't encourage force breeding, and baby animals being sold 1€ to the slaughterhouse (for milk). veganism doesn't encourage animals farms where animals never see the sun light of their lives. veganism per squared km is tremendously more productive, and less polluting than the meat industry. veganism condemns animals being considered as a furniture (can be kiled), thus gives a chance for a serious protection law to be born someday. veganism can (very) easily be local, and organic (and save the quinoa. never heard such a bull seriously lol). red meat is known to be a cancers vector. meat industry is rain forest deforestation main vector. veganism is logical. we treat cats, and sheeps with same regards. I AM NOT bashing the meat industry. Just want to be clear about that one. just pointing out what meat eating consequences are here
Stupid arguments. What is most of the harvested crops used for? Obvious not to feed animals, they don't need any food right
This goes in the other direction way better: A non-vegan life is not 100 % cruelty, but it certainly is the closest we can get. Actually, I'm a bit impressed about how much ignorance towards the violence towards animals is expressed by the entitled brats that think they are the victims for being told a reality they had no problem to cause. The violence against humans connected with animal productions also is an issue that, by decision of said entitled brats, is not to be mentionend, because their little feeling-feelies can hurty-hurty after they came to knowy-know about them - which this kind of human, of course, never does on purpose - the less you know, the happier you are!
It's pretty self-righteous to consider ordering the killing of a sentient being and then demanding that everyone shall mind their own business, while said sentient being never was asekd, never agreed and never met anything but cost-effective cruelty in their entire life. Grow up, accept that your choices, no matter how common they are, have an effect and nothing justifies to keep said effect out of discussion. The maximum of self-righteous BS is reached when, after binging on meat and telling people to mind their own business, these exact same people start bragging about food being thrown away, as if this really was worth mentioning, in relation to the food-wasting practices they themselves engage in and want to keep unjudged - what if I said, I throw away as much 99% vegetables as I want - and want you to STFU, mind your own business and leave me alone with your preachy Blabla?
It misses the point again. Veganism is literally defined as: "Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals." With the emphais on 'as far as possible'. https://youtu.be/ASbzfvJwxLQ https://youtu.be/49NpNt6V3kY https://youtu.be/PrXrAytJq4E https://youtu.be/7WYq8dEZ4pw https://youtu.be/g5L2ujK-dgg
Mind your own business - and leave everyone else alone. With everyone, I REALLY mean everyone. Really everyone, no exceptions. Live and let live. Without exceptions. I always wonder how one can be offended by thinking a second about that what he/she eats, maybe didn't want to be offended and just wanted to mind its own business, or, in the first place, just not being killed. Guess it's more about being offended than about the actual so-called offense...
What?
I immensely disagree. A lot of times the people who make the decision to go vegan do it both for the safety of animals as well as the environmental impact of animal factories, so they tend to get the produce from farmers markets and sometimes their own backyard. It's terrible to discourage veganism because the meat-eaters are seeing the images of these physically and mentally damaged animals laying lifeless or being shredded alive. Veganism may require labor, but doesn't everything? Look at where we get our phones, computers and devices. This labor further adds to climate change as well as harm to young children and older people. Us vegans are not at fault here, and the animals are not being harmed, and pollution is not being added to, whereas no one can say the same regarding meat industries. Meat-eaters can't be mad at vegans for not doing something about the "cruelty" when they are doing far worse by buying into the meat-industry. It's hypocritical, and frankly not their place.
Considering that most crops on earth are harvested to feed to "meat" animals, you do far more harm by eating the animals than you would be eating the crops directly. Math. It matters.
Anything that exploits children, people or animals - by definition - isn't vegan. You're confusing plant-based diet with veganism. Veganism isn't a diet. To be vegan means you actively avoid products and practices that are known to exploit animals and people - including quinoa and palm-oil etc. To say that veganism isn't cruelty-free is an oxymoron. If it involves cruelty - it's not vegan. Free-range isn't cruelty-free, plant-based diets aren't necessarily cruelty-free, vegetarianism definitely isn't cruelty-free either but none of these are related to veganism. Veganism, by definition, is a lifestyle that seeks to exclude all practices and products that harm or exploit animals. Anyone that falls outside of this definition (including people who try plant-based fad diets or try veganism for a month and then "give up") simply are not vegan - they're average joe-blog, meat eaters. Please don't taint veganism with your lack of understanding of the definition.
So we should in fact, eat our own. Soylent green for me. At least eating humans is okay if they are bad peaople eight?
Veganism is not simply a definition of a diet, but a way of living. "The word 'veganism' denotes a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practicable — all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of humans, animals and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals." – Vegan Society of the UK definition of veganism. Enough said.
Veganism is not simply a definition of a diet, but a way of living. "The word 'veganism' denotes a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practicable — all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of humans, animals and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals." – Vegan Society of the UK definition of veganism. Enough said. It's not a 'personal choice' when your choices have victims.
People need to just do what you want...not what the internet tells ya to do.
So because I can't stop all cruelty I should do nothing? Why not do what we can to help people AND animals? I live in a liberal town so I know a lot of vegans, & many of them DO care about cruelty to people & don't proselytize they just want others to eat less meat & support better farming practices. The world isn't as dichotomous as sensationalists would have you believe.
I don't mind vegans, but I couldn't afford to be vegan and to be honest I don't wanna be vegan. If you don't mind that, cool, I don't mind you been vegan. If you see me walking down the streets however, when I have just bought myself the rare treat of a Greggs/KFC. Please do not come up to me with your flyer yelling meat is murder. I can rarely afford this god damn food and the last thing I need is someone telling me to throw it away.
How about, eat the way you see fit and leave others alone? Im all for treating animals ethically but dont say everyone should be this or that. Its just arrogant.
Yeah, we should also leave slavekeepers alone. I mean, I don't like slavery, but why force this on other people? The entire discussion about the so-called preachiness of vegans is totally missing the point. It is entitled crap of people who misunderstand the freedom to have an opinion as the right to never have this opinion put into question. And, by the way, none of the animals suffering for the sake of nonvegan's desire of fried corps has the opportunity to yell at someone to leave them alone - which preachy meat-extremists usually do after they asked a vegan why he is a vegan ... get it explained and start whining about the oh-so-bad propaganda doing oh-so-much harm to them, while the reality of normality is best described by the german term "Banalität des Bösen" (banality of evil), not even evil on purpose, just something the ignorance causes, as it still is seen as optional to take into account that a lot more animals than just humans suffer the same way as humans do .
We will always be eating meat, in fact our original diet contained a lot of fish and meat (source: Luc De Mestre, Quora). Eating veggies is just not enough for us =/ . Instead of choosing a lifestyle in being a vegan or not. How about we try to reduce the amount of organic waste we produce? Due to over-consumption of food the agriculture needs to produce more for us. Not eating them would br a waste of energy. Therefore, control your portion and only buy food which you can finish. I also understand that extensive agriculture/ livestock farming is caused by the human overpopulation. This is a big problem for humanity( for real, we reproduce like bunnies!) and we can't help it. However we still try to give better sex education and family planning advices, but the population will still grow.
Well well well... How can I say this? You know, people who work in slaughterhouses are mostly exploited immigrants. And, their ratio of employees with depression and trauma is massively higher than any other industry. So, actually, when you are eating meat, you're exploiting and traumatizing immigrants, too... unless you come to your local farmer. Hey, I but my veggies from the local farming market from Uncle Bob the farmer who makes me a neat deal... It's impossible to live 100% "cruelty-free" but let's makes it real : this is not an article talking about how going vegan is actually cruel. This is a bunch of angry, biased, non-fact based, anti-veganism comments from the internet. Really, Bored Panda? Really? That was the worst click-bait I fell for all week!
"Veganism is a way of living which seeks to exclude, as far as is possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose" We're talking about the needless enslavement and slaughter of billions of sentient beings every year, the destruction of our environment, needless torture from animal testing, needless breeding of animals for pets, animals used for entertainment. Of course no vegans would condone human exploitation, and I think most people strive towards living a life style that does not support such cruelty, but before you start casting stones, there is vastly more exploitation and suffering involved in the animal products industry, from the animals themselves, slaughter house workers, meat packing plants, and all the needles suffering from people who fall ill do to animal based foods, heart disease, cancer diabetes, obesity.
What about Certified Humane meats? It's probably not perfect, but it's a hell of a step up from what's on your plate now. Also look into SuperMeat. Real meat without the existence of sentient life.
Being a vegan isn't just about cruelty-free living, it's about not putting animal products/by-products into your body. Some believe that it can cause cancer and other illnesses. Vegans don't expect the world to convert overnight but to start making changes. Change your impact on our planet.
Bored Panda what is wrong with you? Why would you incite hatred towards people who are just trying to be the best they can - which is the only thing we vegans are trying to do. How is that a bad thing?
Its simply telling vegans its not a perfect solution. Can you handle that?
Vegans already know. But they are doing a hell of a lot more towards a perfect solution than non-vegans are.
I hate it when vegan people try to force others to become vegan. By all means, be vegan but that's your business not mine. If I was vegan, I would become so small and frail that I would be in trouble. Some people have special circumstances that require them to go on a full diet.
Yes this does make sense 👍🏻
Stop telling me what I should or shouldn’t eat. I don’t care if someone feels guilty to have to kill animals to eat meat. Humans are the highest predators on earth, so I feel no guilt at all to eat like a predators instead of a prey.
Why do people try to make things so black and white? Live doesn’t work that way. In my opinion it’s not what you eat it’s where you buy it. Overconsumption kills. I eat meat, I eat vegetarian/vegan meals and sometimes insects wich are grown for consumption. I get my meat (and vegatables and fruit) directly from the farmers, farmers of wich i know they treath and kill animals with respect. Same goes for cheese I grow my own spices, herbs in house. I shop local as much as possible, ‘cause lets face it, transportation is very poluting. I minimise the use of single plastic and if i can buy it cruelty free i will (shampoo, clothes, etc) i believe if we want to make a change thats the way to go. It doesn’t have to cost more money, you just need to take the time to jump on your bike (if you can avoid taking the car) and make some more stops instead of getting everything at the supermarket. You have to grow some new habbits, ditch some old ones and use your brain it’s not so hard
It is impossible to live a cruelty free life, but then again it would be much better if humans didn't exist in the first place soooo... as much as i love animals i would go back in time to kill every single monkey just to stop humans from evolving
Clearly a very educated point of view...
Bunch of people arguing about what they choose to eat, meanwhile a large portion of the worlds' population has nothing to eat at all.
... so let's buy a huge amount of soy, corn, crops, feed it to pigs, cows, birds, and then eat them. This is about acting harmfully against humans, too! The meat production is that great of a waste of nutrition, this can not be taken out of the argument - meat rises the pressure on this. Meat is responsible for human suffering, the suffering of the poorest, too. Indeed, if all the praising of humans and how great they are would be meant real, and not just a lame excuse to piss of vegans, none of the people accusing us of not caring enough about humans would eat meat.
This.
Indeed, this.
Yet we can feed billions of farmed animals. It is animal agriculture that is keeping parts of the world starving.
I think that if people minded their own damn business about what people eat, the world would be better off.
Actually that's one of the main problems.... Because the majority of people in the rich countries care mostly about themselves, saving a penny on their coffee or food, they help exploiting those countries, where starvation and malnutrition is a mayor issue.
Random fact: In Australia, a farmer commits suicide every four days.
Random fact: It happen everywhere! for example, in France it's happenend every two days...
Little does that ad know. I wouldn't mind eating my own kind >;)
Exactly my thoughts haha
How about we just go about our lives with judging the hell out of each other.
Theres no reason to not eat honey...Agave that is a common honey substitute apperently makes more damage, and still vegans eat it?? No logic there.
I can't speak with authority about other countries, but in Australia the commercial honey industry pulls a serious amount of nectar out of natural ecosystems, significantly reducing the sugar sources for native animals including insects, birds, and nectivore marsupials. Honey is not a magic substance that miraculously appears from nowhere - there's this thing called the conservation of mass, and the honey industry is taking from Peter to feed Paul. Pollination's a different issue, and with careful balancing of hive numbers pollination can be achieved with minimal impact on natural ecosystems' nectar sources.
Yea in our current environmental situation, bee farming is beneficial to humans, bees and all the other animals. Some of the bees die, but all of them would die if we stop now. Bees are important to everything, although i feel like if that did happen, the world is so complex it would straighten itself out eventually. Maybe not in our favor.
We all need to eat, whatever it is we need to eat, it's a basic human need, like liquids. Whatever that food is, it's gotta come from somewhere, so unless you're making your own food (living on a farm or growing your own crops) you'll be relying on other people to provide it for you. The best way is to reduce the amount of people involved from field to plate, but even that will have some impact on someone/thing somehow. But to force your way of living/eating/buying onto someone else isn't the way to fix things.
Enough hate. Either way is bad and will kill lives no matter what. Where is the cute wholesome articles?
Yep. Noentheless, that doesn't mean it's not a good idea because it still tries to *reduce* that cruelty. Just by one point alone - land usage. The efficiency gain by dropping meat for vegan cuts that significantly (perhaps by 83%, if not more), which then goes into reducing most/all of the factors discussed here by similar margins. Likewise, those who cannot go 100% vegan for situational reasons can still try to lower the meat & animal product consumption at whatever opportunities they can find for it, however those do or do not compare to someone else's. But yes, the *rhetoric* has to be suitably adjusted.
@Lietuvos Ne Veganai https://www.facebook.com/groups/319153511816414/
@No Vegan Latvija https://www.facebook.com/groups/NOVEGANLATVIJA/
Let's be honest, the only reason that we are alive right now is because our ancient ancestors ate meat.