This Group Is Sharing Painful Truths And Jokes About Being Poor, Here Are 40 Of The Best
Interview
Google "how to save money" and you'll get 3,740,000,000 results, promising you will be able to save up for any purchase if you just give them a click and scroll through their ads. Oops, I mean, text. Move over Jerome Powell, nowadays even teenage TikTokers are experts on macro and micro economy. Or are they?
The members of the subreddit Poverty Finance: Personal Finance For The Financially Challenged don't think so. And when you look at their content, it becomes pretty difficult to disagree with them. These Redditors share actual financial advice, frugality tips, stories, opportunities, and general guidance for people who are struggling financially. Oh, and they also torch pseudo financial gurus, burning their out-of-touch content to a crisp. My favorite.
So this time, as an introduction to the online community, we'll focus on the jokes and memes they've collected since getting together in 2018.
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Being Poor Is A Choice? If You Play By The Rules You'll Be Safe? Really? Tell That To Him
A huge part of this community's charm is its inclusivity. "Much of the financial advice online and on Reddit is aimed at people who have varying degrees of disposable income, ability to invest, lots of free time, available transportation, no kids, a partner, access to credit, and beyond," the people running the subreddit write in its 'About' section.
"This is a place for people who do not have a lot, nor ideal circumstances, to help each other get by and hopefully move up in the world."
Being Poor Is Expensive
This is pure gold. Prattchet is a genius. But not only that. Before you could sort of trust that more expensive objects were of better quality. But nowadays most clothes and shoes (not talking about really expensive ones but the ones you can buy in still expensive brands like Nike) can be very expensive and still be done with cheap materials that do not last long. Nowadays often the price is in the brand and not the quality. So how am I going to risk buying a 100€ boots (even if i could afford them) of they are likely to last as little as the 20€ ones?
this is so true. i go through shoes quickly they either wear out easily on the souls or split/separate at the sides or toes. i have tried pricier brands and have tried cheaper brands, none of them really last that long. Now i make it a thing to check every shoe to see if it is stitched or glued before even trying them on and that still doesn't account for other quality issues and it doesn't change based on how expensive the shoes are either.
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I have an employee who I found out was going to pay day loans every month because she is is always short when rent is due. I own my home and she rents, I don't get a late fee until the 16th, she gets a late fee on the 2nd and every following day she is late. My 4 bedroom house cost me $850 a month, her 2 bedroom apartment is $1,300 a month. I told her I had a line of credit from my bank for if I was short so I could move money over, her bank told her no when she applied for a line of credit. I fought to get her a raise, but the raise ended up being less than the increase for cost of living. It pains me to have an employee of mine that works like hell using pay day loans when our institution brings in around a billion in research funds every year. Being poor is incredibly expensive.
if there is one lesson my grandmother taught me is to be good to your feet. granted, i didn't listen when it came to high heels and, therefore, am not paying the price for it. but, when it comes to spending more for quality she was right. the only thing that annoys the hell out of me is nowadays 'cobblers' / shoe repair people are hard if not impossible to find. where i lived the man there had been there for at least 40 yrs, later taken over by his son. but, eventually, cheap disposable shoes caused him to close his business.
So true. The only place I can find where I live in the UK is a chain called Timpsons which are ok but not great. I'm ever hopeful that people will stop buying cheap disposable fashion and will want things repaired and altered. I have a pair of boots that I bought maybe 15 years ago that I wear a lot in the autumn/winter and it'll be the first time I'll be getting the heels fixed. They weren't massively expensive but the quality is exceptional and I wish I'd bought another pair at the time!
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While the above quote is poignant, having grown up extremely poor and no longer so, it’s possible to make tough sacrifices to invest in things like a pair of boots that last a few years that will help pull yourself out of poverty. Imagine the poor person who did manage to save for the boots, could then easily save for the next pair over two or three years and still have more money at the end of the day. When you are extremely poor, either you can blame the system and stay poor or you can find a way to climb up the ladder. I chose to understand early that the system was very unfair, and society was shirking its responsibility, but where there is a lack of responsibility, opportunity blossoms. I took the opportunity despite the hardships. Now apparently I’m an oppressor… 🤦♂️🤷♂️
If it makes you feel better Sam Vimes ends up doing well for himself through circumstances. A key aspect of his character though is that he never forgot where he started from, nor let his better fortune go to his head. An important lesson there.
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Terry Pratchett had a deep wisdom that he always shared with his own special wicked sense of humour. RIP
I just discovered him and he has grown to be my favorite. If you're reading this and like funny and smart fantasy novels, this is your guy!
Absolutely true. People who can afford to, buy in bulk which makes a product cheaper in the long run. Poor people buy what they need, at the time, which is more expensive. This applies to almost any consumable product. Take toilet paper. Buying a 24 pack is much cheaper per roll, but poor people don't usually have the disposable income to get a 24 pack. They buy a single roll, which is far more expense.... The deck is stacked against the poor from the outset.
Even if a poor person does happen to have the disposable income, storage is often a concern (domestic square footage being expensive as well). I absolutely see the economic sense in buying half a cow and keeping it in a deep freezer, but I have neither that nor a garage to keep it in.
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Just like an old proverb "a cheapskate end up paying double". unfortunately, a poor one in this case.
Everyone should read Terry Pratchett, he was such an amazing person and author ❤️
My father always said that he wasn't rich enough to buy cheap goods.
Terry pratchett “discworld” series is my absolute favorite fantasy. And no need to read them in complete order! His universe is big, and the characters keep growing on you. So funny, clever, entertainimg amd well written. I do NOT recommend starting with the three first titles though, books where the wizzard Rincewind is main person, They are not as “together” as later books, like a beginners version. So many amazing omes “ Guards Guards!” And “little Gods”, and “ clay feet” Just amazing.
It has always been very expensive not to be able to afford the best and have to buy the cheapest stuff in order to be able to buy some other things as well.
one of my best days was getting an extremely comfortable pair of smart Moshulu boots on ebay for less than £20. SO happy. I LOVE them, they are extremely comfortable, and a friend of mine had lent me a pair of hers once, and I found them wonderful, but could never justify the prices. and it made me think about this quote, because I was so lucky to get them for what I could normally afford to pay for a cheap pair.
The $50 boots would have to last longer than 10 years to be economical though.
My husband bought the best boots available within our budget (about $300) and still had to replace them yearly
Get a job earning more that does not require $50 boots. No one is a slave these days, you can get a new job.
It's like this with a lot of things (bad quality food leading to health issues, bad quality clothes ripping way too quickly, cheap car breaking down faster etc) but shoes is a very good example.
Love Terry Pratchett, and this I why I often love to exclaim out loud - especially when rich people are whining in my vicinity: "The rich get richer, and the poor get the picture."
I used to shop at Old Navy where I could buy a decent T-shirt for $20 that lasted a full year or maybe two before becoming faded, shrinking, generally old-looking. I bought a BOSS t-shirt ten years ago for about $90 at my wife's insistence. That shirt still fits and looks like new. For the past ten years, I have also only bought Nike Air Max sneakers because they are so comfortable. They run me between $150 and $190 and last about 3 years before looking ragged. 5 months ago I bought a pair of Sketchers that are super comfortable and laceless for ease of putting on. I paid $65 for them but guess what? The soles are almost completely worn out already. They won't last the year. We don't buy American-made vehicles for the same reason.
I've actually subscribed to amc+ so that I may watch "The Watch" next season. I love all of his books.
This took me a long time to learn when I was first on my own. When I was a kid, my parents only ever bought the cheapest thing available: cheapest tools, cheapest kitchen appliance, cheapest lawnmower, etc. When I grew up, I did the same thing, because even looking at the more expensive choices felt so extravagant and wasteful and wrong. It took a while before I came to realize how much money I was wasting because I had to keep replacing broken or worn out things that didn't last long. (I have since discovered that the most expensive one is rarely a good value, either.)
Whilst a good quote for some things, the guy could save $10 a month and buy the expensive boots !?! No ?!?!
The point is that he needs to spend the $10. He doesn't have it spare to save. If he saves it, what does he put on his feet in the meantime?
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What A Lot Of "Frugal Bloggers" Don't Realize
As of this publication, it has 847K members and if you relate to Poverty Finance's content, we suggest you join them too. "You do not have to be absolutely destitute to be here. Whether you are a single parent only pulling 10K a year, or a single person trying to get past student loans at 28K, you are welcome here," the moderators say.
"The goal here is to help anyone who doesn't have a lot of breathing room get to a place where they have stability, comfort, contingency, and maybe even a little luxury."
So True It Hurts
We picked a credit union because we made it clear that if we don't have the money, we wanted to be declined. No bank would agree to that but we found a credit union that promised they would not if we signed up for the overdraft protection. They got rid of it a year later without telling us, my husband was 50 cents short and our credit union allowed the cable company to try to run the payment 3 times in one day, meaning 3 overdraft fees of $32 for being 50 cents short. My husband gave a very impassioned speech in the lobby, about how they were their to protect our money and they had left us exposed, etc. Told them that our money was better protected in our mattress. The manager came out, agreed with my husbands logic and set us up a line of credit so if we don't have the funds in our account, it pulls from the line of credit automatically. No overdraft fees in 10 years. Highly recommend if you can find a bank who will set that up for you.
Just A Holiday Reminder
That's how I think about unnecessary purchases. "Well, this coat will cost me three days work", or renting a movie will cost five minutes work, or and a possible vacation will cost two weeks work or whatever. Thinking about whether an item is worth the amount of work put into buying it really puts things into perspective!
We contacted the moderator team and one of them was kind enough to spare their morning break for us. Regarding the content on the subreddit, they told Bored Panda: "There are fewer themes and more cyclical subject matters that come up depending upon the time of the year and the current economic and social ongoings. Right this moment, questions about housing, the moratoriums, how to get an apartment with low credit, or whether even buying a house is within the budget of those who fit within the national and international descriptions of low income/poverty line."
As an example, the moderator took us back a few months ago when there were many questions regarding the Emergency Broadband Benefit program issued by the government. But with fall fast approaching, they think the subreddit will soon see questions about how to get supplies for students and questions on how to qualify for free or reduced lunches at school."
Had A Good Laugh At This
Love this! I think I'll go out today and invest in some avocados. I finished my last investment (bananas), and want a change now.
*Sad Noises*
This is exactly my situation. Rent is almost 900e/month. If I somehow managed to save 4000-6000e, I could ask for a loan at the bank and buy a nice place at 120k. And pay that 500e or something a month for 25 years. But I can't save much because my pay is 1900e / month and over half goes to rent and bills.
"Once we approach November to December, we will be fielding questions with regards to worries about being able to afford gifts for their children, how to survive the holidays if you are economically disadvantaged," they continued. "Year-round common subject matters tend to be where to find the resources for food, someone to handhold or direct on how to apply for SNAP/EBT, Section 8 Housing, the hardships of just existing in society this day and age and just looking for some emotional support from their economic peers."
According to the moderator, their community is mostly composed of those who have or are currently experiencing poverty. "Whether it's [someone who faces] generational poverty, long-term poverty, short-term poverty, or self-identify as low income for their various regions. We have those who have made it out and into the middle class but are still dealing with the after-effects of having experienced poverty short or long term and the problems that that in and of itself brings."
Financial Health Is The Best Form Of Therapy
Money doesn't buy happiness, but it does buy food, housing, heat, clothing....
Can Anyone Explain Where My Starbucks Money Is Going?
Not drinking enough coffee. You could be a billionaire when you're high on caffeine. Infact, you could be anything.
Certified financial planner and frequent contributor to Forbes, Jeff Rose, agrees that there is no shortage of bad financial advice in this world. Rose finds it especially troubling when some of them become so widely spread, so championed, that people actually start blindly following them. The financial planner believes the most harmful tips are: 1. Never use credit cards; 2. Don't waste money on conveniences; 3. All debt is bad; 4. Getting a tax refund is bad; 5. Always get the 401k match; 6. Your home is your most valuable asset. Click here if you want to read Rose's thoughts on each point.
Talking about bad financial advice, the moderator of Poverty Finance thinks it has to do less with authors and influencers being out of touch and more with the fact that one size rarely fits all. "More and more people gain access to technology that's being developed to give the everyman more access over their finances and their financial future," they explained. "Things that were previously thought to be the purview of just the upper class or left to the financial professionals who knew better."
Pretty Much
Stress
But they wonder if it can also be a sign of gatekeeping: "Oh, you're poor? Then you have no need for financial advice, it won't benefit you or the maintenance costs made what amount you wanted to add in, too costly and pointless. You can't come up with 10k to open an investment account? They don't want to deal with you. Salary jobs usually come with a 401k, hourly jobs at McDonald's and the like generally do not, and so you're left on your own to figure it out because no one will help you."
The good thing is that technology might be starting to bridge that. "People realize that there are far more low-income and middle-income individuals with a willingness and ability to put away ten, twenty, a hundred, five hundred a month into an account. Who care about not having to work once they hit sixty-five. A neglected and overlooked economic subset who have a significant buying power en mass. But the advice isn't there from the usual places because their advice only works for the upper income. For the gross amounts of money vs the smaller amounts," the moderator added.
I Know Many Of Us Are Taking Responsibility For Our Part, But...
The lie that all poor people are poor because they're "bad with money" needs to die.
It’s Not That Hard
But the reality is a bit worrying. Financial literacy — defined as the knowledge and understanding of areas related to personal finance, money, and investing — has been in decline. In 2009, 42% of respondents were able to answer four or more questions correctly in a five-question survey on fundamental concepts of economics and personal finance. By 2018 this dropped 8 percentage points to 34%. What's even more alarming, less than one-third of adults understand three basic financial literacy topics by age 40, although many important financial decisions are made decades earlier.
Under such circumstances, (online) communities like this one might be doing society more good than we can imagine.
Money Saving Tip!
They are not everywhere.Distance costs money but the peace and books are worth more than anything. *sighs
Me, Organizing My Finances
To Be Honest
I Felt That While I Laughed
I’ve Never Felt More Prepared
Ain’t That The Truth
Poverty Marriage
One Star
Amirite
Overdraft Fees Cripple People Already Struggling Financially
It Never Ends
Well, It's Technically A Phone Number...
It’s Almost Offensive, Right?
Santa Won’t Bring Me Rent Money
Big Poverty
Of course there is. Nothing easier than taking advantage of someone who can't afford to fight back. It's the socioeconomic equivalent of beating up crippled people.
Finally Figured It Out
It’s Fine, I Didn’t Want To Have Fun Anyway
Breaking News! Millennials Are Still Poor
Oof
Well if you want to look on the bright side of things, we poor folks are always ready for that struggle battle, and come out of it alive until the next one comes along
Here’s How To Pay Off Your Debt
Save Half Your Paycheck, Regardless Of Whatever Else You Have To Pay For, Regardless Of What You Earn, I Guess
And It Also Doesn't Have Debt
Pigeon breast cooked in a herb and cracked pepper butter, with a red wine and plum sauce reduction on a bed of sorrel leaves. And $20 to spend on drugs and alcohol.
Two Ways
I have just been able to retrain for a job that will pay me more, with a government grant and £10 000 of debt. I mean, I worked hard, but essentially I paid for a qualification in order to earn slightly more money, which I will now spend several years of my life working off. I do wonder if it was worth it.
This Hit Me Hard
YES. Double if you have a sibling doing better than you, that your parents like better, but you’re still the retirement plan.
Game Stop Stock
"Poor People Are Just Bad At Saving Money"
So True
There are only houses in this price range in some states. Definitely not California!
Note: this post originally had 51 images. It’s been shortened to the top 40 images based on user votes.
I went to open my first account in Japan. It was at Citibank. They explained that they would charge $50 per month if I had less than $500 in it. So I asked "so you take money from me if I don't have money?! Is that a joke?". He said it's standard at any bank. I laughingly said "no it's not" an opened somewhere else that doesn't have those fees, even though it was hard because I didn't speak Japanese. I will never even try another American bank.
Ha. I had this same experience. I opened with CitiBank (hilariously Shitibanku in Japanese) because I needed a place for my paychecks, rent, etc. Luckily I was able to maintain the minimum. After a few months, I was able to get my office manager on the phone to set up an account with Mizuho. That said, I've never had fees in the US on any bank.
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Was talking to a buddy of mine a while back. He told me that he and his wife had a deal. If either one of them got really sick, they'd immediately get a divorce so they wouldn't totally destroy the family's finances. Why the hell should that even have to be on the table? To have to do such drastic measures just to avoid ruining your finances is just criminally depressing.
That is sad. Kudos to them for their creativity in finding a solution, but awful that they had to resort to a plan like that.
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Eddie Vedder had a great take on wealth: There's only two things I appreciate about finally having some money. The first is I no longer have to worry about money, & that's such a constant burden that's lifted. And secondly, I can help those in need or help righteous people or organizations that deserve it. Money is like fertilizer: If you spread it around it can do a world of good. If you don't, your selfish ass will end up with a pile of s**t.
The quote is "Money, pardon the expression, is like manure. It's not worth a thing unless it's spread around, encouraging young things to grow." Dolly Levi.
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I don't understand,if we are majority in population then why does everything work against us?(Us being the broke people,poor)Have the capitalists really bought the earth so only they get to live in them?
Politicians don't get elected unless they are financed, and political campaigns cost an absolute fortune. Most people are only politically active during election season so once the election is over, the support base disappears for another 4 years. This means that the laws and finance sectors are created and regulated by the people who made them (the top 1%) and they have structured it to benefit them alone and exploit everyone else. Politicians can't do much against this because they receive all of their financial support from that 1% and will not be re-elected if they try to pass anything to restrict them exploiting others. That and half of the population sees this restriction as punishment for success, even though that success is built on exploiting workers, or because they fear they will lose the jobs they have now. I am coming from a very Western view so this doesn't apply globally but that is the jest for most developed nations.
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Unpopular opinion but it feels like the average family is being priced out of having children too. The UK literally has the most expensive childcare in Europe (possibly the world) you either have to a) not work to look after your kids . b) be privileged enough to have a very well paid job. Or c) have a family member that is able and willing to watch your kids for free. The only other option is to not have kids at all. I appreciate a lot of people don't want kids and that's fine. But surely it shouldn't be a choice of poverty or a child(ren)
I feel this list deep in my bones. Just been knocked back for a home loan. Got a deposit, all our ducks in a row. The reason? We don’t earn enough money. The mortgage repayments would have been around $300 a week, give or take. But $450 a week in rent? Sure! You can afford that! Sign here! 😡🤬
Our daughter has got her first job. It's going to break my heart when she gets her first wage
Twisted ankle and just bought a brace to avoid going to the doctors. Only went to the doctors after twisting it again the morning after. It felt worse and was afraid I broke something because I don't know how to make a cast. Turns out I just further torn my tendons. After my ankle healed I kept the air cast and crutches in case I get injured again to avoid going to the doctors. Cuz doctors = money
When people say nothing better then laugh about yourself, they mean this ? Because I first laughed, because the other option would be cry.
No one wakes up and decides to be poor. No one. But when the wealthy start foundations it’s their way of keeping from having to pony up their share. I just want to have a stable roof over my head, and maybe, maybe decent healthcare so that during, say, a global pandemic, I have an equal chance at recovery.
Way back in 2007, I went to Chase bank to open a checking and saving's account. I stand on line, get to the front, say what I needed. So I was led back to someone's desk, and everything was fine.....But when she saw how much I got paid, she very kindly told me I didn't make enough to open an account with them. I was mortified, got up and walked out. If I EVER make it big, I will NEVER do business with Chase. The experience with them, really made me feel like crap.
Moral of all this: If you born well-off and are without conscience, you can be rich! Of course, if you are born poor and are without conscience, you will end up in prison. ....
Once, just for fun, I saved four avocado seeds and planted them. I used to joke that my four little potted avocado plants were my retirement fund. Then they all died because I am a terrible gardener and live in entirely the wrong climate.
I don't get investments. When does one reap with the benefits and cash out? If I can make a monthly profit and cash it out when I have to pay bills I'm all game for that.
You reap the reward when, and only when, and if and only IF, someone in Wall Street/The City/whatever decides NOT to crash the whole economic system for short-term gain.
Load More Replies... Let’s see. Working people spend the money they earn so that money goes back into the economy. Rich people hoard their money and it never reaches the economy.
Load More Replies... I went to open my first account in Japan. It was at Citibank. They explained that they would charge $50 per month if I had less than $500 in it. So I asked "so you take money from me if I don't have money?! Is that a joke?". He said it's standard at any bank. I laughingly said "no it's not" an opened somewhere else that doesn't have those fees, even though it was hard because I didn't speak Japanese. I will never even try another American bank.
Ha. I had this same experience. I opened with CitiBank (hilariously Shitibanku in Japanese) because I needed a place for my paychecks, rent, etc. Luckily I was able to maintain the minimum. After a few months, I was able to get my office manager on the phone to set up an account with Mizuho. That said, I've never had fees in the US on any bank.
Load More Replies... Was talking to a buddy of mine a while back. He told me that he and his wife had a deal. If either one of them got really sick, they'd immediately get a divorce so they wouldn't totally destroy the family's finances. Why the hell should that even have to be on the table? To have to do such drastic measures just to avoid ruining your finances is just criminally depressing.
That is sad. Kudos to them for their creativity in finding a solution, but awful that they had to resort to a plan like that.
Load More Replies... Eddie Vedder had a great take on wealth: There's only two things I appreciate about finally having some money. The first is I no longer have to worry about money, & that's such a constant burden that's lifted. And secondly, I can help those in need or help righteous people or organizations that deserve it. Money is like fertilizer: If you spread it around it can do a world of good. If you don't, your selfish ass will end up with a pile of s**t.
The quote is "Money, pardon the expression, is like manure. It's not worth a thing unless it's spread around, encouraging young things to grow." Dolly Levi.
Load More Replies... I don't understand,if we are majority in population then why does everything work against us?(Us being the broke people,poor)Have the capitalists really bought the earth so only they get to live in them?
Politicians don't get elected unless they are financed, and political campaigns cost an absolute fortune. Most people are only politically active during election season so once the election is over, the support base disappears for another 4 years. This means that the laws and finance sectors are created and regulated by the people who made them (the top 1%) and they have structured it to benefit them alone and exploit everyone else. Politicians can't do much against this because they receive all of their financial support from that 1% and will not be re-elected if they try to pass anything to restrict them exploiting others. That and half of the population sees this restriction as punishment for success, even though that success is built on exploiting workers, or because they fear they will lose the jobs they have now. I am coming from a very Western view so this doesn't apply globally but that is the jest for most developed nations.
Load More Replies... Unpopular opinion but it feels like the average family is being priced out of having children too. The UK literally has the most expensive childcare in Europe (possibly the world) you either have to a) not work to look after your kids . b) be privileged enough to have a very well paid job. Or c) have a family member that is able and willing to watch your kids for free. The only other option is to not have kids at all. I appreciate a lot of people don't want kids and that's fine. But surely it shouldn't be a choice of poverty or a child(ren)
I feel this list deep in my bones. Just been knocked back for a home loan. Got a deposit, all our ducks in a row. The reason? We don’t earn enough money. The mortgage repayments would have been around $300 a week, give or take. But $450 a week in rent? Sure! You can afford that! Sign here! 😡🤬
Our daughter has got her first job. It's going to break my heart when she gets her first wage
Twisted ankle and just bought a brace to avoid going to the doctors. Only went to the doctors after twisting it again the morning after. It felt worse and was afraid I broke something because I don't know how to make a cast. Turns out I just further torn my tendons. After my ankle healed I kept the air cast and crutches in case I get injured again to avoid going to the doctors. Cuz doctors = money
When people say nothing better then laugh about yourself, they mean this ? Because I first laughed, because the other option would be cry.
No one wakes up and decides to be poor. No one. But when the wealthy start foundations it’s their way of keeping from having to pony up their share. I just want to have a stable roof over my head, and maybe, maybe decent healthcare so that during, say, a global pandemic, I have an equal chance at recovery.
Way back in 2007, I went to Chase bank to open a checking and saving's account. I stand on line, get to the front, say what I needed. So I was led back to someone's desk, and everything was fine.....But when she saw how much I got paid, she very kindly told me I didn't make enough to open an account with them. I was mortified, got up and walked out. If I EVER make it big, I will NEVER do business with Chase. The experience with them, really made me feel like crap.
Moral of all this: If you born well-off and are without conscience, you can be rich! Of course, if you are born poor and are without conscience, you will end up in prison. ....
Once, just for fun, I saved four avocado seeds and planted them. I used to joke that my four little potted avocado plants were my retirement fund. Then they all died because I am a terrible gardener and live in entirely the wrong climate.
I don't get investments. When does one reap with the benefits and cash out? If I can make a monthly profit and cash it out when I have to pay bills I'm all game for that.
You reap the reward when, and only when, and if and only IF, someone in Wall Street/The City/whatever decides NOT to crash the whole economic system for short-term gain.
Load More Replies... Let’s see. Working people spend the money they earn so that money goes back into the economy. Rich people hoard their money and it never reaches the economy.
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