Mom Shares Her Son’s Crazy Surgery Bill To Show What Will Happen Under Trumpcare
With Trumpcare’s debut just around the corner, many Americans fear that their healthcare costs are going to become too much to bear. A New Jersey mom has bravely taken up arms against the pending changes by sharing the hospital bills she pays each month to care for her chronically ill son on Twitter, and her story is so powerful that it’s shaking the Internet.
Ali Chandra, a registered nurse by profession, was still pregnant with young Ethan when she found out he would be born with heterotaxy syndrome, a rare disease that causes vital organs to be arranged abnormally, and several heart defects. Ethan had his first open heart surgery just 6 days after he was born in July of 2014, and has undergone multiple procedures since then, most recently in late February 2017. Though most of Chandra’s expenses related to Ethan’s medical needs are covered by her insurance, that could change with the new healthcare plan soon to be implemented by the Trump administration.
The most damaging law proposed by the new Trumpcare bill is the “lifetime cap,” a limit on how much money any one person can claim through their health insurance plan. These limits were banned by the Obama administration, but they could be back on the table if the GOP moves forward with their current objectives. This means that children like Ethan will most likely be already maxed out as soon as the law comes into effect, leaving their parents to foot the bill out of their own pockets. “A lifetime cap on benefits is the same as saying, “Sorry, you’re not worth keeping alive anymore. You’re just too expensive,”” Chandra wrote on Twitter.
Both the mom’s photo of her last hospital invoice and her stream of tweets that followed have gone viral, gaining over 52 thousand retweets and over 79 thousand likes. Other parents identified with Chandra’s concerns, and stood in solidarity with her staunch opposition to Trumpcare. Follow her compelling story below, and tell us what you think in the comments.
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Btw: How is "lab chemistry" $15k and "sterile supplies" $10k? What are they doing in the lab?? And are the supplies sterilised in mineral waters taken from the peak of Mt Everest or something?? Can someone explain this madness? (That said, in Singapore, I've been charged $5 for "disposables" - which amounted to a single ice cream stick. I could have purchased a pack of them for like $1 and brought one myself.)
This tell you a lot about a crooked healthcare system. Insurance is just a tiny part in it. Building a just AND efficient healthcare system is something that pretty much all countries struggle with. It either is not just, or way too expensive. And in many cases, it is both. Alas.
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Sadly no easy solution to it. Independent companies supply tools and meds. Priority 1 of an independent company is make money to not go bankrupt. Excessive regulations and caps on prices would mean risking losing against competition in other countries. Also research costs ridiculous amount of money and doesn't always result in marketable product. Money used has to be recouped, so if prices are capped, no one will want to risk investing money in research. Alternative would be state-owned companies, but uses tax money, in democracy if given choice between 100$ extra tax every year for research on rare disease or 100$ less tax, majority will vote less tax, so doesn't really work either...
In the mid-90's, when I had no insurance, my husband crushed his finger and had to go to the ER. I asked for an itemized invoice, and they charged him $200 for penicillin. I told them I was not going to pay for it and they argued that I had to. I then explained that as he is highly allergic to penicillin, and had not died I was sure that they had not given an antibiotic and they could revise my bill accordingly. They then tried to tell me it was a typo and should be Tylenol. $200 for 2 Tylenol did not fly with me either, so I refused to pay a penny until I received a reasonable invoice. That took about 15 minutes and several other items were removed as "mistakes", like the $30 band-aid. It is a racket, meant to take advantage of us at our most vulnerable.
Not sure about the lab chem part, as it depends a lot on the tests done. About the sterile equipment, sadly it's not as simple as dunking equipment in hot water. Many things are single use, for example scalpel blades. As for equipment which is reused, usually they're transported to a specialised facility to be processed. There, the tools are cleaned, inspected, and sterilised in special machines (for example 120°C/248°F steam 30 minutes). After sterilisation, the tools are packaged and care must be taken so they remain sterile. So many tools are newly made and those that can be sterilised are done in special facilities. Sadly, the rarer the condition or disease, the more things end up costing, since economy of scale no longer applies. If you're wondering about cheaper ways to sterilise, sure they exist, but if the rest already costs 200k, you don't want to skimp on that 10k to save some money but increase the risk of complications by a few %.
Excellent post Sheralyn. This is just part of what Frederic Bastiat meant in his famous essay on the 'Seen' and the 'Unseen'. But there is far more to is all than just that. Who ultimately pays for all of this? Who pays for the added government bureaucracy when we finally wind up with socialized medicine? https://fee.org/articles/what-is-seen-and-what-is-not-seen/
Exactly! I used to have excellent insurance...than Obamacare hit. Now, my deductible is $5,000 per person, and premiums are going up. I need to get on welfare... :(
My theory is that hospitals have to charge so much, because the insurance companies do not pay enough. So the overcharge to get as much as they can to cover the costs. I know no good answer. My hospital bills are the same way. They charge so much, but they really get paid very little from the insurance company. The amount received from the insurance companies in that example that she showed....seems wrong. I have seen how little they pay, for what they are billed...they never pay the whole amount the the hospital bills them. They we pay our deductible....and there is usually a lot they have to "eat"....which is what I used to call the difference. It really means how much they have to do without.
Right. Easy enough to test that (or similar) theory. Look at what a doctor charges when billing insurance compared to direct pay.
I worked in Procurement (purchasing) for an NHS hospital here in the UK and that was EXACTLY the though that crossed my mind. Where on Earth do those figures come from?! Sterile supplies in individual units (once you've broken a bulk pack down) cost pennies, in some cases fractions of pennies. More specialist items, depending on what they are and what they are made from, cost more (such as a sterile titanium surgical screw (£70) or a Stent (£100+) sure, but you can't tell me that child has $10K worth of items in their body or was used during surgery.
that was my thought... is she paying for the supplies for the entire hospital for one surgery? I don't think Trump's Bill is the real problem.
Oh wow, allow me to share the experience of a hospital in Singapore dumping sterile supplies on us and then charging us, WITHOUT USING SAID SUPPLIES AT ALL during the course of the stay. When we disputed the charge, we were told that they couldn't take back any supplies as it might have been contaminated.
As a Canadian I can't even imagine having to pay for this. Unbelievable that people think this is the best way to live. This is not freedom.
After moving to Canada a couple of years ago, having a fairly healthy family with kids: My Canadian taxes are definitely less than my US taxes + health insurance premiums - and my health insurance coverage over the last few years turned to c**p. Add that to the fact that a doctor visit is going to cost $180 out of pocket and prescription co-pays are generally the same as _retail_ price in Canada, I'm saving a lot of money. From what I've seen with my family and a new baby since moving, the health care we need is easily as good and available as the US. (and costs nothing) It took me a couple of years to pay off the bills from my oldest son being born premature in the US (insurance covered 90%). My youngest son's costs? 0.
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No one said that, but USA seems to be pissing into the teeth of why society exists; the great truth that together we are stronger has no value except when you have to send your children to wars for big business. No respect for the human being, only judgment, greed, GREED and GREED. They would and will leave that child to die, it will be donations of random people, who already contribute in tax and who will have to spend extra because their State does NOT fulfil their wishes. In this- do it yourself or you're f****d even though you pay someone to represent you we also see the absurdity and death of your so called democracy- The fact is a communal health system is the only sane solution, not only because it is cost efficient in the long run but because you also have a happier, healthier, more productive and less crime oriented society. As for those who think they're too privileged to help others I say let them live in caves, without any benefit humanity has acquired together.
We pay with our ever increasing taxes, Lyndsay B. don't fool yourself. We pay WAY more taxes than our American neighbors and it's only getting worse every day Trudeau is in office.
We pay less per capita for health care than the US does, by far. And that's not counting the people in the US who forgo treatment because they can't afford it.
Would you feel better by paying fewer taxes and then letting a child die for lack of funds? Bear in mind, bankruptcies affect everyone in higher health care costs, and added costs for banking charges and added costs at the till to recoup those losses due to bankruptcy. Pay me now or pay me (more) later!
So you pay an extra thousand a month for a family of 4 in taxes. Then, when you need healthcare, you pay between $25-40 in taxes, $10-25 in taxes to get basic, common medicine, and are responsible for anywhere between $1,000-$10,000 a year if something serious happens where you have to use the service that you already pay $1,000 month for. The really crappy thing about this is that this is a moderate example American Healthcare. Don't let them fool you. Every day people here in the US have to make decisions about whether to get treatment vs. what they can afford. The #1 reason Americans go bankrupt is healthcare. If you think things are so great here, you should come on down and give it a try. This country is not so racist against Canadians as it is Mexico (sadly ((that we are racist at all)) this is a true fact).
Yes, we pay more taxes than Americans, and I'm glad we do. We get affordable and good schooling for children, lower university tuition, free health care, employment insurance and welfare. A society with great disparity between the poor and the rich is a violent society, as is a society where there is little social mobility. Canada has social programs, and thus the potential for social mobility--and that makes Canada a good place to live. If you want to pay less tax, move to the United States.
You may pay higher taxes, but we pay insurance premiums, deductibles, co-pays for office visits, urgent care AND emergency room visits. PLUS obscene amounts for prescriptions. Someone who is very ill is spending a fortune. I'd rather pay the taxes and be done. #dumpinsurancecompaniesaltogether
Ever increasing? Wake the hell up. You pay less in tax as a middle income earner now than you did under that wanker Harper. 1st world issues. There is government waste no matter who is in power. You are just being plain ignorant, supporting your party regardless of the truth.
Umm no you don't. The US has some of the lowest taxes on the planet http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/how-do-us-taxes-compare-internationally
I lived in Seattle for many years and we sure had a lot of Canadians (the ones with money) that came to our hospitals because they didn't want to wait for treatment under the "free" Canadian system.
And yet after living in Canada for 5 years (NOT on your healthcare program) I saw things like a baby that the GOVERNMENT decided to remove from life support even though his parents asked that a simple feeding tube be left so he didn't starve to death, an older lady denied hip replacement because of her age (she and the baby both came to the US for treatment), and a baby taken to the ER several times over the course of a long weekend because he was having seizures and his parents were told to "come back Monday, there is no one here to read a brain scan". SMH I wouldn't have your system for anything. YOU do not have freedom, you are beholden to your government and you're too dumb to see it.
No doctor lets a baby die. My 90 year old aunt just had a hip replacement. You don't live in Canada. You are a liar.
The "Pro-Life" people are such bullshitters. They don't care about people's life, except for when they're embryos. Absolute nonsense.
Bob 2.0 How do you figure Pro-lifers have anything to do with insurance caps? How did you connect those dots because that is wacky. I'm Pro-life and know plenty of others and not a single one of them has ever expressed a desire to see insurance caps. The only people in favor of insurance caps are the shareholders of insurance companies. The only representatives or senators that would vote for ins. caps are the ones that are in those shareholders pockets. Quit trying to lump huge groups of people into one. It's stupid.
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The elected officials who support insurance caps are the ones who pandered to Pro-Lifers to get elected.
When you all start worrying about the hundreds of thousands of kids in the system instead of a woman's body, then you may speak, Ron.
I think Bob 2.0 is referring to those who support this stupid health care bill in Congress, and claim to be on the side of life.
then you must resist the healthcare bill - it is a death warrant to many Americans -
They are doing this right now Your senators are voting this in in 2017 Part of the AHCA You OK with it? Because my grand will die if this goes through and will do w/o care she needs If your prochoice you have to know that children are not always born 'normal' and families may need help Not the insurance companies The senators are voting this in to save the insurance companies and because they don't want healthy people to pay for insurance even though we know that accidents happen and we age and they will need tit then It is just like car, house insurance you buy for protection and by doing that we can all have more affordable insurance price we pay for being human beings with compassion and care for others
Who says pro-lifers do not care about kids in the system? Maybe pro-choice people should care about getting those kids (and mothers) out of the system instead of perpetuating systems of co-dependency that do nothing but promote a class system and propagate hopelessness.
"Pro-lifers" (really pro-birth) voted in the monsters who have no conscience and no empathy for others into office. They are so concerned about embryos and don't care if the already born children live or die. They've proved this by voting for the very politicians who vote to take healthcare away from children like Ethan. Get offended all you want to, you certainly offend me.
they dont care about sending people to war either or the homeless people in America. i just dont get it.
dear anne, the fact that somehow you still call yourself a conservative doesn't change the fact that conservative policies in the US are brutal, heartless and amoral. your fellow conservatives start the wars, slash protections for the workplace and the environment. slash help for the poor and disabled, and legalize discrimination. that IS their platform, and always has been. are you really that stupid or are you just a troll trying to muddy the waters?
As a pro-lifer and conservative . . . rest assured, I do care about the embryos AFTER birth; I don't believe in war unless absolutely necessary (as in the U.S. being attacked), our church has 8 teams of 8 people . . . the Soup Kitchen in our town in closed on weekends. One church opens it on Saturday, and we open it on Sunday. We PURCHASE and COOK the food using our electricity and supplies (this is usually an all day Saturday job just at my house), we go to church and put it in the warmers; leave church and re-load the car to take to the Soup Kitchen; unload, sweep and clean, remove chairs stacked on tables, put the food we've prepared out for 120 people, clean up, wash dishes, talk with people who just need human contact . . . it's pretty much an all day Sunday event. Furthermore, I'm against the death penalty. NOW . . . do you have anymore broad statements/assumptions about ALL conservatives?
Listen ya Pansy a*s'd liberal buttercup, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about...jackass!
This comment is hidden. Click here to view.
Really? Check again when it comes to who is 3X more charitable than liberal progressives. We support our causes with money and time, not just a march carrying a sign. I'll tell you what, next time you want to protest, how about volunteering at a charity instead?
you folks always say that but 2 things about that study you think you're citing: 1) your stats are wrong. 2) the only reason the giving rate is higher is because you folks are giving money to your private religious schools, your churches and anti abortion groups. when you give to "charities" it turns out the beneficiaries are yourselves and your political allies. if you remove those from the equation and limit the giving to actual charities that help people no matter who they are your rates are actually lower. that was the real conclusion of that study. but just like the bible, you cherry pick it to suit your own selfish purposes. thou shalt not lie. thou shalt not hold false witness against thy neighbor. hope your get out of hell free card works.
Bob 2.0 I don't think anybody cares that you're carrying a sign, either. You're a nuisance more than anything. Actually, you should check out how many charities are actually out there if you think that the federal govt should be the end all to everything. Guidestar.org. You will be amazed.
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And we're not supposed to care if someone doesn't WANT to find a job too I suppose. We have millions on a FREE system because they're too lazy to look for work & then people like you want to allow illegal aliens to fill those jobs that the lazy won't do. Your attitude is the absolute nonsense.
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I am prolife and I DO CARE. My 2 sons are career military and I have cancer. You do not know what you are talking about.
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I'm sorry, why are men commenting on this? YOU DON'T GET AN OPINION ON THIS
Why not? Last I checked it takes a man and a woman to create a child.
Btw: How is "lab chemistry" $15k and "sterile supplies" $10k? What are they doing in the lab?? And are the supplies sterilised in mineral waters taken from the peak of Mt Everest or something?? Can someone explain this madness? (That said, in Singapore, I've been charged $5 for "disposables" - which amounted to a single ice cream stick. I could have purchased a pack of them for like $1 and brought one myself.)
This tell you a lot about a crooked healthcare system. Insurance is just a tiny part in it. Building a just AND efficient healthcare system is something that pretty much all countries struggle with. It either is not just, or way too expensive. And in many cases, it is both. Alas.
Load More Replies... Sadly no easy solution to it. Independent companies supply tools and meds. Priority 1 of an independent company is make money to not go bankrupt. Excessive regulations and caps on prices would mean risking losing against competition in other countries. Also research costs ridiculous amount of money and doesn't always result in marketable product. Money used has to be recouped, so if prices are capped, no one will want to risk investing money in research. Alternative would be state-owned companies, but uses tax money, in democracy if given choice between 100$ extra tax every year for research on rare disease or 100$ less tax, majority will vote less tax, so doesn't really work either...
In the mid-90's, when I had no insurance, my husband crushed his finger and had to go to the ER. I asked for an itemized invoice, and they charged him $200 for penicillin. I told them I was not going to pay for it and they argued that I had to. I then explained that as he is highly allergic to penicillin, and had not died I was sure that they had not given an antibiotic and they could revise my bill accordingly. They then tried to tell me it was a typo and should be Tylenol. $200 for 2 Tylenol did not fly with me either, so I refused to pay a penny until I received a reasonable invoice. That took about 15 minutes and several other items were removed as "mistakes", like the $30 band-aid. It is a racket, meant to take advantage of us at our most vulnerable.
Not sure about the lab chem part, as it depends a lot on the tests done. About the sterile equipment, sadly it's not as simple as dunking equipment in hot water. Many things are single use, for example scalpel blades. As for equipment which is reused, usually they're transported to a specialised facility to be processed. There, the tools are cleaned, inspected, and sterilised in special machines (for example 120°C/248°F steam 30 minutes). After sterilisation, the tools are packaged and care must be taken so they remain sterile. So many tools are newly made and those that can be sterilised are done in special facilities. Sadly, the rarer the condition or disease, the more things end up costing, since economy of scale no longer applies. If you're wondering about cheaper ways to sterilise, sure they exist, but if the rest already costs 200k, you don't want to skimp on that 10k to save some money but increase the risk of complications by a few %.
Excellent post Sheralyn. This is just part of what Frederic Bastiat meant in his famous essay on the 'Seen' and the 'Unseen'. But there is far more to is all than just that. Who ultimately pays for all of this? Who pays for the added government bureaucracy when we finally wind up with socialized medicine? https://fee.org/articles/what-is-seen-and-what-is-not-seen/
Exactly! I used to have excellent insurance...than Obamacare hit. Now, my deductible is $5,000 per person, and premiums are going up. I need to get on welfare... :(
My theory is that hospitals have to charge so much, because the insurance companies do not pay enough. So the overcharge to get as much as they can to cover the costs. I know no good answer. My hospital bills are the same way. They charge so much, but they really get paid very little from the insurance company. The amount received from the insurance companies in that example that she showed....seems wrong. I have seen how little they pay, for what they are billed...they never pay the whole amount the the hospital bills them. They we pay our deductible....and there is usually a lot they have to "eat"....which is what I used to call the difference. It really means how much they have to do without.
Right. Easy enough to test that (or similar) theory. Look at what a doctor charges when billing insurance compared to direct pay.
I worked in Procurement (purchasing) for an NHS hospital here in the UK and that was EXACTLY the though that crossed my mind. Where on Earth do those figures come from?! Sterile supplies in individual units (once you've broken a bulk pack down) cost pennies, in some cases fractions of pennies. More specialist items, depending on what they are and what they are made from, cost more (such as a sterile titanium surgical screw (£70) or a Stent (£100+) sure, but you can't tell me that child has $10K worth of items in their body or was used during surgery.
that was my thought... is she paying for the supplies for the entire hospital for one surgery? I don't think Trump's Bill is the real problem.
Oh wow, allow me to share the experience of a hospital in Singapore dumping sterile supplies on us and then charging us, WITHOUT USING SAID SUPPLIES AT ALL during the course of the stay. When we disputed the charge, we were told that they couldn't take back any supplies as it might have been contaminated.
As a Canadian I can't even imagine having to pay for this. Unbelievable that people think this is the best way to live. This is not freedom.
After moving to Canada a couple of years ago, having a fairly healthy family with kids: My Canadian taxes are definitely less than my US taxes + health insurance premiums - and my health insurance coverage over the last few years turned to c**p. Add that to the fact that a doctor visit is going to cost $180 out of pocket and prescription co-pays are generally the same as _retail_ price in Canada, I'm saving a lot of money. From what I've seen with my family and a new baby since moving, the health care we need is easily as good and available as the US. (and costs nothing) It took me a couple of years to pay off the bills from my oldest son being born premature in the US (insurance covered 90%). My youngest son's costs? 0.
Load More Replies... No one said that, but USA seems to be pissing into the teeth of why society exists; the great truth that together we are stronger has no value except when you have to send your children to wars for big business. No respect for the human being, only judgment, greed, GREED and GREED. They would and will leave that child to die, it will be donations of random people, who already contribute in tax and who will have to spend extra because their State does NOT fulfil their wishes. In this- do it yourself or you're f****d even though you pay someone to represent you we also see the absurdity and death of your so called democracy- The fact is a communal health system is the only sane solution, not only because it is cost efficient in the long run but because you also have a happier, healthier, more productive and less crime oriented society. As for those who think they're too privileged to help others I say let them live in caves, without any benefit humanity has acquired together.
We pay with our ever increasing taxes, Lyndsay B. don't fool yourself. We pay WAY more taxes than our American neighbors and it's only getting worse every day Trudeau is in office.
We pay less per capita for health care than the US does, by far. And that's not counting the people in the US who forgo treatment because they can't afford it.
Would you feel better by paying fewer taxes and then letting a child die for lack of funds? Bear in mind, bankruptcies affect everyone in higher health care costs, and added costs for banking charges and added costs at the till to recoup those losses due to bankruptcy. Pay me now or pay me (more) later!
So you pay an extra thousand a month for a family of 4 in taxes. Then, when you need healthcare, you pay between $25-40 in taxes, $10-25 in taxes to get basic, common medicine, and are responsible for anywhere between $1,000-$10,000 a year if something serious happens where you have to use the service that you already pay $1,000 month for. The really crappy thing about this is that this is a moderate example American Healthcare. Don't let them fool you. Every day people here in the US have to make decisions about whether to get treatment vs. what they can afford. The #1 reason Americans go bankrupt is healthcare. If you think things are so great here, you should come on down and give it a try. This country is not so racist against Canadians as it is Mexico (sadly ((that we are racist at all)) this is a true fact).
Yes, we pay more taxes than Americans, and I'm glad we do. We get affordable and good schooling for children, lower university tuition, free health care, employment insurance and welfare. A society with great disparity between the poor and the rich is a violent society, as is a society where there is little social mobility. Canada has social programs, and thus the potential for social mobility--and that makes Canada a good place to live. If you want to pay less tax, move to the United States.
You may pay higher taxes, but we pay insurance premiums, deductibles, co-pays for office visits, urgent care AND emergency room visits. PLUS obscene amounts for prescriptions. Someone who is very ill is spending a fortune. I'd rather pay the taxes and be done. #dumpinsurancecompaniesaltogether
Ever increasing? Wake the hell up. You pay less in tax as a middle income earner now than you did under that wanker Harper. 1st world issues. There is government waste no matter who is in power. You are just being plain ignorant, supporting your party regardless of the truth.
Umm no you don't. The US has some of the lowest taxes on the planet http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/how-do-us-taxes-compare-internationally
I lived in Seattle for many years and we sure had a lot of Canadians (the ones with money) that came to our hospitals because they didn't want to wait for treatment under the "free" Canadian system.
And yet after living in Canada for 5 years (NOT on your healthcare program) I saw things like a baby that the GOVERNMENT decided to remove from life support even though his parents asked that a simple feeding tube be left so he didn't starve to death, an older lady denied hip replacement because of her age (she and the baby both came to the US for treatment), and a baby taken to the ER several times over the course of a long weekend because he was having seizures and his parents were told to "come back Monday, there is no one here to read a brain scan". SMH I wouldn't have your system for anything. YOU do not have freedom, you are beholden to your government and you're too dumb to see it.
No doctor lets a baby die. My 90 year old aunt just had a hip replacement. You don't live in Canada. You are a liar.
The "Pro-Life" people are such bullshitters. They don't care about people's life, except for when they're embryos. Absolute nonsense.
Bob 2.0 How do you figure Pro-lifers have anything to do with insurance caps? How did you connect those dots because that is wacky. I'm Pro-life and know plenty of others and not a single one of them has ever expressed a desire to see insurance caps. The only people in favor of insurance caps are the shareholders of insurance companies. The only representatives or senators that would vote for ins. caps are the ones that are in those shareholders pockets. Quit trying to lump huge groups of people into one. It's stupid.
Load More Replies... The elected officials who support insurance caps are the ones who pandered to Pro-Lifers to get elected.
When you all start worrying about the hundreds of thousands of kids in the system instead of a woman's body, then you may speak, Ron.
I think Bob 2.0 is referring to those who support this stupid health care bill in Congress, and claim to be on the side of life.
then you must resist the healthcare bill - it is a death warrant to many Americans -
They are doing this right now Your senators are voting this in in 2017 Part of the AHCA You OK with it? Because my grand will die if this goes through and will do w/o care she needs If your prochoice you have to know that children are not always born 'normal' and families may need help Not the insurance companies The senators are voting this in to save the insurance companies and because they don't want healthy people to pay for insurance even though we know that accidents happen and we age and they will need tit then It is just like car, house insurance you buy for protection and by doing that we can all have more affordable insurance price we pay for being human beings with compassion and care for others
Who says pro-lifers do not care about kids in the system? Maybe pro-choice people should care about getting those kids (and mothers) out of the system instead of perpetuating systems of co-dependency that do nothing but promote a class system and propagate hopelessness.
"Pro-lifers" (really pro-birth) voted in the monsters who have no conscience and no empathy for others into office. They are so concerned about embryos and don't care if the already born children live or die. They've proved this by voting for the very politicians who vote to take healthcare away from children like Ethan. Get offended all you want to, you certainly offend me.
they dont care about sending people to war either or the homeless people in America. i just dont get it.
dear anne, the fact that somehow you still call yourself a conservative doesn't change the fact that conservative policies in the US are brutal, heartless and amoral. your fellow conservatives start the wars, slash protections for the workplace and the environment. slash help for the poor and disabled, and legalize discrimination. that IS their platform, and always has been. are you really that stupid or are you just a troll trying to muddy the waters?
As a pro-lifer and conservative . . . rest assured, I do care about the embryos AFTER birth; I don't believe in war unless absolutely necessary (as in the U.S. being attacked), our church has 8 teams of 8 people . . . the Soup Kitchen in our town in closed on weekends. One church opens it on Saturday, and we open it on Sunday. We PURCHASE and COOK the food using our electricity and supplies (this is usually an all day Saturday job just at my house), we go to church and put it in the warmers; leave church and re-load the car to take to the Soup Kitchen; unload, sweep and clean, remove chairs stacked on tables, put the food we've prepared out for 120 people, clean up, wash dishes, talk with people who just need human contact . . . it's pretty much an all day Sunday event. Furthermore, I'm against the death penalty. NOW . . . do you have anymore broad statements/assumptions about ALL conservatives?
Listen ya Pansy a*s'd liberal buttercup, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about...jackass!
This comment is hidden. Click here to view.
Really? Check again when it comes to who is 3X more charitable than liberal progressives. We support our causes with money and time, not just a march carrying a sign. I'll tell you what, next time you want to protest, how about volunteering at a charity instead?
you folks always say that but 2 things about that study you think you're citing: 1) your stats are wrong. 2) the only reason the giving rate is higher is because you folks are giving money to your private religious schools, your churches and anti abortion groups. when you give to "charities" it turns out the beneficiaries are yourselves and your political allies. if you remove those from the equation and limit the giving to actual charities that help people no matter who they are your rates are actually lower. that was the real conclusion of that study. but just like the bible, you cherry pick it to suit your own selfish purposes. thou shalt not lie. thou shalt not hold false witness against thy neighbor. hope your get out of hell free card works.
Bob 2.0 I don't think anybody cares that you're carrying a sign, either. You're a nuisance more than anything. Actually, you should check out how many charities are actually out there if you think that the federal govt should be the end all to everything. Guidestar.org. You will be amazed.
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And we're not supposed to care if someone doesn't WANT to find a job too I suppose. We have millions on a FREE system because they're too lazy to look for work & then people like you want to allow illegal aliens to fill those jobs that the lazy won't do. Your attitude is the absolute nonsense.
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I am prolife and I DO CARE. My 2 sons are career military and I have cancer. You do not know what you are talking about.
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I'm sorry, why are men commenting on this? YOU DON'T GET AN OPINION ON THIS
Why not? Last I checked it takes a man and a woman to create a child.
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