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Someone Asked “What Beloved Person In History Should Be Hated?”, Here Are 30 Eye-Opening Answers
Philosophers and writers have long debated the roles people have played in influencing the progress of civilization. While Thomas Carlyle, for example, felt that great figures are key to guiding us forward, Leo Tolstoy, on the other hand, was of the belief that no individual can single-handedly steer the course of humanity, no matter what position they held.
Regardless of what the case might be, there are two kinds of people: those who are forgotten and those who live on in our collective memory. In an attempt to figure out if some of the latter are getting undeserved praise, Reddit user TGYHJDFGH made a post on the platform, asking everyone: "What beloved person in history should be hated?" and it was immediately flooded with answers.
But before you scroll down to check them out, I want to make things a little bit more interesting and/or complicated for you. Tell me, can we judge someone's morals after hundreds of years, when the entire cultural landscape has changed course? And where do we draw the line between what we can and cannot accept about someone's personal life if their work has transcended time and allowed countless people to find meaning?
I know, these are pretty tough questions. But humans are walking contradictions and it would be irresponsible to instantly dismiss the legacy of, say, the Founding Fathers or Mother Teresa.
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Christopher columbus...didnt discover s**t and brought misery wherever he went.
This needs to be higher. Columbus was THE WORST. Slavery, murder, torture, you name it.
Mother Theresa. My father was a taxi driver in Australia and one of his customers was a man who'd been raised in Mother Theresa's orphanage. He said she beat him terribly.
Another user also added: She was obsessed with preventing wartime sexual abuse victims from getting abortions.
Her order sold babies.
She buddied up to dictators and accepted stolen cash from them.
Collected millions in donations and never spent them on her "houses of the poor" which were vermin infested crapholes where people went to die.
Refused pain medication for the dying and ill because she believed suffering = being close to god.
Had nothing but top of the line medical care for herself.
Teresa was a horrible human being. She believed that only through pain you can reach Christ, so let the people suffer in her care. And it was backed by the Catholic Church so that she can convert as many people as possible to Christianity. And the Western world backed her with billions in donations. (Read 'Missionary Position' By Christopher Hitchens)
Thomas Edison. I’ll never forgive him for what he did to Tesla.
He electrocuted an elephant to death to prove his point about AC/DC electricity and I will forever detest him for that.
Ronald Reagan - moved somewhere between 50-80 TRILLION from middle class to upper 1%. Ruined America!
Coco Chanel was a goddamn Nazi spy. Yes, she was an incredible designer, and she's probably one of the most influential humans of the 20th century, based on the number of people who have worn clothing directly inspired by her over the past 100 years. She really did change the way women dress in a truly radical way, and I respect that - knitwear, feminized menswear, ditching the corset, transforming black into an everyday color, the essential skirt suit, costume jewelry, synthetic fragrances in perfume, the list goes on.
But she was a goddamn Nazi spy. Coco was a wretched anti-Semite, like so many other members of the European elite during the 30s. She dated a number of staggeringly wealthy British aristocrats and they'd all sit around talking about the Protocols of Zion and s**t, trying to figure out whether any members of the royal family were secretly Jews, etc. When war broke out, the two Jewish brothers who ran her perfume empire (aka Chanel No 5, the best selling perfume in the world then and now) had to flee to the US for safety. How did Coco respond? By writing to the Nazis to ask them to transfer ownership over to her, a good Aryan, so she could make more money. But that's not the half of it.
She fell in love with a dashing German spy named "Spitz" who'd been seducing bluebloods all over France and England for years leading up the war. Coco was a useful woman - she was simply one of the richest women in the world, and she knew everyone in the British aristocracy, including her old hunting buddy and dear friend, Winston Churchill himself. She and Spitz socialized with all the biggest Nazi names in town, especially Otto Abetz, the Nazi ambassador to France, who invited them to every party in town. Spitz convinced her to join the Abwehr (aka the German secret service) and make trips to Spain. Operating under the code name "Westminster", she attempted to broker a "separate peace" between Germany and England. (In the meantime, she may or may not have reported at least one woman at the Hotel Ritz whom she suspected of being Jewish to the SS.) She had a grand old time going on her adventures, and wrote about the excitement of working for the Abwehr in her private notes.
Chanel was arrested only a few days after the liberation of Paris - absolutely everyone in town knew what she'd been doing and who she'd been doing it with - but for rEaSoNs UnKnOwN she was released without charges. It's widely believed that Winston Churchill personally intervened. It might be because the two of them had been close friends for decades. It might be because she was going to embarrass the s**t out of Britain by outing all the anti-Semites and pro-Nazis in the British aristocracy - including the recently abdicated Edward VIII who used his f***ng honeymoon as an excuse to tour Nazi Germany and shake Hitler's hand. She spent the rest of her life being a nasty, bitter morphine addict living in the Hotel Ritz. The House of Chanel has very, very little to say about the matter, and every few years a few more bits of damning evidence are declassified from the vaults.
If you want to learn more, I did a whole episode about her Nazi days in my French history podcast: "The Collaborator"
Pablo Picasso, he was misogynistic and sexually assaulted women
Gandhi. After learning all the colorist and racist s**t he would say to those who had darker complexion or those of African descent in my 8th grade year i haven’t seen him the same.
Bill Cosby. America's dad. Up until those allegations started
he had creepy eyes IMO even when I was little, and being little, I'd say "creeper eyes"...
Woodrow Wilson.
Guy was majorly racist, segregated the military, kicked black people out of the government, he screened a KKK movie in the White House and was a strong defender of the KKK. Even for his time he was considered racist
PT BARNUM.
Most people know but due to the romanticization of The Greatest Showman, people should know that he was a maniac that did an ungodly experiments on living beings, locked people in cages, abused them, and mocked them. All whilst earning pocket from them.
John Lennon. Treated like s**t during his childhood, whinges about it his whole life, then does the exact same thing to his son Julian.
Based on personal experience with Oprah Winfrey at Barnes Municipal Airport on New Years Eve in 1991, I would say it would have to be her. Cosby's private jet brought her and Steadman into the airport under cover of darkness to go to the Cosby estate up North. I watched from the tower and she shoved a lone child out of the way and slammed the door to the limo. All the child wanted was an autograph. Oprah's kindness and compassion was an act. If she didn't get something out of it, she was quite capable of stepping on feelings of a lone child when the cameras were not on her
Elvis Presley. He groomed a then 14 year old and slept with her while he toured.
King Edward the VIII was a nazi sympathizer who possibly colluded with the Germans to retake the throne in the event of an invasion and conquest of Britain.
He wasn’t just a love sick romantic who gave up his kingdom for a woman.
Alfred Hitchcock, the guy probably was one of the best filmmakers ever, yes. but it's worth mentioning how much he abused his actors, including sexually harassing Tippi Hedren
Not quite beloved, but Joseph P. Kennedy Sr..
He decided that Rosemary (his daughter) who was 23 at the time should have a lobotomy; he did not inform his wife of this decision until after the procedure was completed. And then they sent her away to an institute.
In her early young adult years, Rosemary Kennedy experienced seizures and violent mood swings. In response to these issues, her father arranged a prefrontal lobotomy for her in 1941 when she was 23 years of age; the procedure left her permanently incapacitated and rendered her unable to speak intelligibly.
Sick f**k, who would do this to their own child.
"Who would do this to their own child". In that era? Quite a few people, unfortunately. The lobotomy at that time was peddled as a "cure" ----- they truly didn't know better.
8000 comments so it might be here Apparently John Wayne needed to be restrained from assaulting a native American actress in the 70s at the academy awards or something. I think her name was Sacheen Little feather. And Clint Eastwood allegedly was mocking her too.
John Wayne was definitely racist. Remember the playboy article where he said “I believe in white supremacy,” he said, and spoke harshly about African Americans, saying, “We can’t all of a sudden get down on our knees and turn everything over to the leadership of the blacks.” “I don’t believe in giving authority and positions of leadership and judgment to irresponsible people,” he said. This is just the tip of the iceberg. And Clint Eastwood talks to invisible people in chairs.
Einstein wasn’t a great guy. Brilliant, sure, but kinda douchy in his personal life.
He refused to marry his long time lover for years, even after she got pregnant. The child was assumed to be given up for adoption, but no record has ever been found.
He and his wife, Mileva Marić, worked together on their research. People saw them do it. They made jokes about it at parties. He proudly told people that she did all his calculations. They only put his name on their work and he went on to claim all the credit - ignoring any work she had done. Part of their agreement was that she would get the Nobel prize money but he tried to prevent that.
She raised two children - one schizophrenic - took care of the house and tutored to bring in extra money because he couldn’t get a job for a long time. He started getting more notoriety and then began an affair with his first cousin.
He moved to a different country to be with his new hillbilly mistress. He divorced his wife and quickly married the new, younger model. He had rules she had to abide by, such as leaving the room immediately when told and not expecting or asking for any sort of affection except when necessary for appearances sake.
Elsa, his second wife, was dying and he worked nonstop because he didn’t know what to do (I guess). She was basically abandoned her last few months.
He cheated on both his wives, numerous times. Ignored his children. Oh - and he was pretty into his second wife’s daughter and thought about marrying her instead.
About the missing child, there is a series called The Missing By Marget Peterson Haddix, book fives discusses it
Charles Dickens had his wife, the mother of his children, committed to an insane asylum so he could run off with a teenage actress.
Edit- I have been informed that this wasn't successful, he tried to have the mother of his ten children committed but it didn't work. Which is still quite bad
People (men, or ok "not all men") still try to label women as crazy or mentally unfit to get what they want.
Joseph Smith-
I grew up LDS and left with my family when I was in junior high. After some reading and learning from historical documents without church bias, I realized how drastically different he was when he wasn’t viewed in the eyes of the church.
Joseph Smith...Big pimpin' (I saw that on a t-shirt that I regret not buying. 😭)
Churchill. He started the Bengal Famine which killed 3 million people. He also was incredibly racist and liked killing through gas.
Winston Churchill, a hero according to the UK & US. Churchill carried out a genocide in India (4+ million killed through deliberate famine). And Churchill believed that eugenics could solve race deterioration and reduce crime and poverty. US & UK were very much on the side of Hitler, until they realized that he posed a threat to their power on the global stage. That seems to be missing in the narrative of why WW2 started.
Andrew Jackson.
He’s always presented as the “common man’s president” but he treated the Native American’s terribly . He also had a huge rowdy party and trashed the White House
Oliver Cromwell
Tried to make England a republic, ended up being a king in all but name. Butchered the Irish, banned Christmas and is partially responsible for the puritans (who fled to America after the monarchy was restarted)
Charlie Chaplin definitely. Dude groped/assaulted girls and married a woman 40 years younger than him
First wife had (falsely) announced a pregnancy at 16, then they married, later divorced. Second wife announced pregnancy at 15, he married her, otherwise might have been prosecuted because she was a minor when she got pregnant. Also divorced. Marriage no. 3 was relatively unspectacular age wise (she was 21). Within and in between marriages multiple affairs. His last wife, Oona, was 18 when they married (he was 54). They stayed together until his death, had eight children. (All according to Wikipedia - not good, but I found no 40 year age gap).
Benito Juárez
He was the type of president who kills his opposition instead of negotiating. He did a lot of illegal executions.
He was going to be executed in Guadalajara, however one of his ministers convinced the soldiers not to kill him with a famous phrase "alto, los valientes no asesinan", the soldiers forgave his life and risked theirs as the disobey an order. Well, as soon as Juarez returned to Mexico city, he immediately ordered to kill all of those soldiers with no mercy (source: my sister worked with the Sargent's descendant)
After Juárez's government, there's a period Known as the porfiriato, where Porfirio Díaz was Mexico's president for 30 years. It was possible just because there was no opposition alive
Juarez suddenly died in 1872 from a heart attack. It's believed that a woman, to avenge his husband, worked on his home as a maid, and when she had the opportunity, she put an infusion of "veintiunilla'" a herb known by the natives for being poisonous and cause a heart attack 21 days (veintiún dias) after it was drank
This. Not to mention he reformed the Mexican state by removing the church influence (which was not wrong) only to enrich himself and his family with all the resources confiscated. Also, he was indigenous but ashamed of it so he was extremely racist. If he hadn't died, he was ready to change the law to stay in power indefinitely.
Andy Warhol was a fraud and an abuser.
The book Edie is a great read, but sad.
Warhol wasn't great as a person, but I've done a little research into him. He was a complex person who suffered in some ways. He did horrible things, but he also served at his church's homeless shelter well into his later years. Derinitely suffered from trauma and possibly depression.
Dr Suess cheated on his partially disabled wife and she eventually committed suicide because of how distraught she was.
“I am too old and enmeshed in everything you do and are, that I cannot conceive of life without you,”
Kinda coming much more into light now but The Founding Fathers, all of them owned slaves and by modern day standards they would be horrible people. But something I think lots of people don’t remember is even if these things are utterly reprehensible, everyone was doing it and they were all children of their time.
What history books didn't mention that fact? I learned that in the 1970s! And we had debates in Ethics class about this stuff....
and Thomas Jefferson was against slaves but still owned them.
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No, not "everyone was doing it". Some of the Founding Fathers were strict opponents of slavery, for example John Adams so why does the picture show him?
B/c they don't know their history. And htey used a cheap online image instead of doing some work.
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"Children of their time". What a crock excuse. You know who else were in their "time"? Abolitionists. An entire movement that disagreed with the institution of slavery, participated in the underground railroad to help free them, and politically supported those who wanted to do away with it. If they, who were born and raised in the SAME time period as the slave drivers, can see and understand the evil nature of owning humans, those slave owners could have as well. ALL could have joined that movement at any time. They chose not to. They liked having slaves and being a master. Stop with that tired excuse.
All of them owned slaves? I don’t think John Adam’s owned slaves. There were probably others as well. What the founding fathers were was the top 1% of earners of their time who started a war so they wouldn’t have to pay taxes. Then felt that only rich land owners should have the right to vote.
@Sarah Rose, by your logic current day lawmakers are horrible people too, because horrible legislation has been passed under their watch (even if they fought said legislation). Should they not even come to the table? What does that accomplish? We all do the best we can within the systems we're born with, while also trying to change those systems. Or, are you advocating violence every time you feel righteous anger? Terrible people feel righteous anger (from their perspective) every bit as strongly as you do. Who gets to decide when the violence is justified?
Load More Replies... I can't believe you said "everyone was doing it" as a justification or exemption.
Continues to stare in native, yea we have evidence that not everyone was doing it
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Historical figures are to be judge by the times in which THEY lived, not by the current times in which WE live.
Of the 1st 5 presidents John Adams was the only one with one term, the only not from Virginia, and the only one without slaves (his farm was ran by mostly Abigail and also himself when not in Philadelphia or Boston)
What a crock. You know who else were children of their time who weren't doing it"? Abolishionists! Even by the pasts standards slavery was utterly reprehensible. Try again!
"Everyone was doing it," isn't that what teenagers whose frontal cortex isn't fully developed, say? The wrongs and evils that have been committed because everyone was doing it are too many to count.
I'm raising money to carve butts into the back of Mount Rushmore
I was in high school 2000-2004 and we went over slavery, trail of tears, land grabbing from natives, plague blankets, and a bevy of topics
@Brian. You should look into the stories of Spanish Settlers that were living in what is now New Mexico and Texas. The horrible stories of how their land was stolen from them as well.
Load More Replies... Also should note that many of them slept with the slave women they owned. Jefferson had a few kids with his slaves...but at least he gave them all their freedom on his death.
they didn't sleep with the women they owned, they raped them. Not trying to tear you down Carol, just wanted to highlight the distinction
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John Adams was not a slave owner, nor was his son. They were anti-slavery. So no, not "all" Founding Fathers owned people.
THANK YOU! Modern standards people! This isn’t the 20th century when things were getting better, this was back when this was too normal. Way too normal. But what are we gonna do about it?
It was a double standard even then. Europe/colonists made a lot of money with slave trade and slave labour, while outlawing it at home.
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North and South Carolina got support to force the vote to become independent states apart from English rule (the Declaration of Independence) by unanimous vote only. They did this in order to keep the rule of slavery intact. Those two states forced the point, even though virtually all others were either opposed to slavery, or ambivalent. Washington tried to (through his will upon his death) free his slaves. His wife Martha however, nullified that due to the/her belief that they were "property" that belonged to her. People at times could free black persons but those persons could be kidnapped and subject to be sold and removed to the south where no one would contest their indentured service. Jefferson was clearly conflicted about the issue.
No, those founding fathers in colonies / states that did not allow for slavery did not own slaves. Such as John Adams, Ben Franklin and Gouverneur Morris.
There are lots of reasons to hate " Hamilton" (the crappy musical!)
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"All" of them did not own slaves. Governor Morris of NY did not own slaves. John Adams of Mass did not own slaves. Surprisingly, Ben Franklin did.
There was 74 yrs between Washington and end of slavery. Thats a long time to progress to the thinking that slavery is wrong and needs to be ended.
The Abolitionists were also "children of their time"! The enslaved were also children of their time! The Founding Fathers don't get a pass for being born in a certain era. Plenty of people knew enslaving people was wrong, including the people they enslaved (which people seem to always forget about when saying these men were products of their time.) Oh, and lets not forget the founding father who regularly r***ed a 14 year old enslaved girl, Thomas Jefferson!
It is always best to look at history within the context of its time before looking at it from the context of your own time.
Slavery, for centuries and centuries, was used by the victorious and powerful to punish, humiliate and take advantage of the powerless and conquered for financial, political and territorial gain. Everyone always knew it was horribly wrong, it was just that the money was more important. That's why the everyone was doing it argument fails.
Mm everyone? Pretty sure Black people didn’t .then again, racists don’t think Black people were people to begin with, so I guess the OP is also racist.
This is something I don't understand: how can people today condemn people of the past for what they did (or didn't do) by using standards of today? In order to understand the past, shouldn't you put yourself into their circumstances? I'm not saying slavery was right, or the raping of women because "that's what they did back then," but to say slavery/rape was wrong from your current point of view - isn't that wrong as well? I realize there were people back then who did think that was wrong (how else were we to learn and grow if we all thought the same?), but they were the minority. People are complex creatures. Overall, I think the majority of people have tried to do their best with what they had to work with at the time. And continue to do so. For all our faults -- no one is perfect -- I believe people, for the most part, are doing their best. It's when people start saying that everyone has to agree with them that they are wrong.
True. I can remember hearing racial/bigoted slurs growing up all of the time (not my family, but others). Don't hear most of them anymore. Times and civilizations change. Most people simply didn't recognize what they were doing or why because for them it is the norm. Any historical person should be judged according to the times they lived in.
Today we still have slavery hiding under poor salary to fill the pockets of the share olders
Knowing you're doing wrong but still doing it because "everyone else is" tells me you aren't a good person, even if you did some good stuff. One "aw s**t" wipes out a thousand "attaboys".
my teachers, EVEN THE BEST OF THEM, have always said to me "yeah he owned slaves, but he was just a product of his time". TIMES HAVE CHANGED YEAH SURE BUT THEY'RE NOT DONE CHANGING. and the way my middle school social studies teacher absolutely WORSHIPPED george washington... im tired guys. im tired, hangry, and havent listened to any other bands than rage against the machine in two weeks
That they were people of their time is often important to remember. Most of us are really complicated, and often hold ignorant beliefs until we get older and smarter.
Who said anything about history books ? An interesting topic, but off track. What OP is trying to say is that these people were each a product of their times. They had been molded and influenced by antiquated attitudes and a drastically different scope of knowledge. That really has to be taken into account before you start judging them. In THEIR time they were giants among men.
Much more complicated than you imagine-- even in the North, slavery was common, as well as indentured servitude, which for all intents and purposes, was slavery. Look, people are a product of their times, and culture-- the fact that many of the founders were aware of their shortcomings, and tried to rectify them, as under the laws and customs of the time. In many areas, slaves could not be freed, by law, with few exceptions. Slavery was common throughout the world-- and is still common in many. Part of the magnificence of the founding documents is how much the learned, yet faulted men tried too build a Nation where Liberty was the guiding principles, as well as such obtuse concepts as fair play-- Were they perfect? Of course not-- that is the human condition--and anybody expecting perfection is on the wrong planet. Fall, stumble, pick yourself up, dust off, and try to do better is the best we can hope far in this mortal plain.
This is a stupid pick. 250 years from now, the people will say how “horrible” we all are during this time in history, for whatever reason. Things change, times change, societies change. It’s how the world works.
(...A)ll of them owned slaves(...) Um...no. John Adams never owned slaves and was, in fact, opposed to slavery. (He was, however, a bit of an Authoritarian.)
Y'know, people knew full well back then that slavery was wrong. The Constitution actually received a lot of criticism for talking about "freedom for all" when the U.S. practiced slavery. It's not like anyone back then was blind to the fact that slavery was awful.
Not to Leo Domitrix: You're right. It's often the case that when some people learn a surprising fact they immediately assume that it's brand new and no none's ever heard of it before. I learned about the horrors of slavery in school too--and that was 65 years ago.
The issue for me is that Washington and Jefferson believed slavery was wrong. In spite of that, Washington hunted for an an enslaved woman who had fled and apparently allowed floggings by his overseers. Jefferson repeatedly raped one of the enslaved woman in his control and sired children yet never emancipated her.
Interesting - out of 30 horrible people 3 are female, the rest male. Tells you a lot.
Not all of them owned slaves; IIRC Thomas Jefferson and John Adams were very anti-slavery but had to concede to the majority when drafting the DoI, Constitution, etc.
What was right at the time cannot be viewed with modern day ideals.
Same about sexism and elitism. They didn't beleive everyone should vote, much less women, but only land owners.
The wrote the constitution in a specific way to be able to abolish slavery in the future. Smart MFers.
I wonder sometimes how people insisting to measure a previous era's behaviour with today's social norms will feel when the coming generations (assuming we'll live to raise future generations) judge them, say, on owning mobile phones or having plastic stuff in their house. "What do you mean everyone had them at that time? In fact, there were forward thinking people already living off the grid, using only sustainable materials and renewable energy! That @hole just carried on destroying the planet only to post self-absorbed comments on BP."
John Adams did not own slaves, and Ben Franklin dabbled in the slave trade (obviously disgusting) but found the experience so repugnant that he became a devout abolitionist.
So, Mao Tse-tung, Hitler, and Pol Pot don't make the list. How about Putin, Lenin, Stalin, Idi Amin? You can find many who revere them. With a few exceptions, those on this list made significant positive contributions to their fields. Columbus smelled bad? Oh the horror!
"But something I think lots of people don’t remember is even if these things are utterly reprehensible, everyone was doing it and they were all children of their time." That's not true, while it may be with the wealthy class as it is now as well, normal people didn't and some states like New Jersey had it written in their constitution that slavery of any kind is illegal. The "founding fathers" were d***s
They get praised for breaking way from the English Monarchy when they only did it to save money and after the new government was set up with them in charge they milked it for every penny they could get, they also very quickly forgot how the Native Americans helped them win the war and basically wiped them out.
Yes but you never judge historical figures by todays moral standards, you judge based upon the standards of the day. And that by that measure, they were exceptional people ( if you disregard the fact that, according to the english, they were backstabbing traitorous vermin! )
A lot of them were against slavery and if they had slaves they were treated well and/ or payed
If they were against slavery, they would not have had slaves. You dont do things you do not want to do...I hate that animals are killed for their fur. So I dont wear or purchase fur products. If they did not want to participate in slavery, they simply would not have. No excuses.
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As a human, his faults do not diminish his accomplishments. His, and others sacrifices laid a groundwork for the United States. The country he had a hand in creating, with it's mistakes and faults, has done more for humanity as a whole than any other single entity in history. It is more than most others in the history of human kind can claim.
I will say….. HAMILTON DIDNT! But he also cheated on his wife. But that pales in comparison to Thomas Jefferson and Sally Hemmings.
But according to the standards of their time. It was not the same issue. (until it was. :D )
I came back to this to tell you that I downvoted the hell out of your post.
Why? It's true and it's literally common knowledge
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This is silly, this is WHAT ran the country. It wasnt all hippies and cancel culture. It was a hard life. S**t happens.
I don’t think people from other eras should be held to today’s moral standard.
Agreed, but the other side of the coin is we shouldn't ignore the problems their legacy left us.
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Yes, context of the period is important, even if we are made sad by the revelations.
Yes, they were children of their time. The standards and morals of modern society have no baring on the realities of life that modern humans couldn't even comprehend the trials of. Nothing new is "coming to light" it was all common knowledge for....ever. The only thing that's changed is people ignoring the realities of society in that era in an effort to paint a more provocative narrative that justifies the often radical idiocies being thrown around today.
owning slaves during a time when slavery was acceptable is kind of ignorant.
Honestly it's quite DUH that they had slaves, anyone with money would in those days, best situation would be if the master is nice to them. And look at politicians today, same horrible people a lot of times.
William Hurt. I remember seeing tons of praise for him when he passed recently.
Thing is, he beat and raped Marlee Matlin back in the 80s. She discussed it in her memoir. When he was approached about it, his response wasn't to deny it, but to apologize for any pain he "may have caused" to her.
If you want to praise his acting, fine. But remember what sort of person he was behind the characters you loved on film.
why are there people who are low-key defending an abuser and r@pist…
John Lennon.
I'll have to find some links to stuff but what I heard was he screamed his son's eardrums out and was generally apathetic about his familial duties and flew off the handle in violent fits often.
BRB gotta Google.
Yeah. Paul wrote Hey Jude about Lennon's son, Julian, because his father was a d**k to him. But, hey! All you need is love.
Gandhi , dude was a pervert. Mostly to kids
Margaret Sanger was pro-eugenics and a racist.
In promoting birth control, she advanced a controversial "Negro Project," wrote in her autobiography about speaking to a Ku Klux Klan group and advocated for a eugenics approach to breeding for “the gradual suppression, elimination and eventual extinction, of defective stocks — those human weeds which threaten the blooming of the finest flowers of American civilization.”
She is seen as a saint to many.
This is one of the biggest "it's complicated" issues to examine in terms of structural oppression. We can't separate what the Nazis did with eugenics. Two generations earlier, however, having a severely disabled child or children was rarely viable, especially for poor families. There were no resources, no funds, and very little education. There were no Special Olympics, no "mainstreaming," nothing. If you are a poor immigrant mother with four children already, living in a tenement in NYC during an economic panic, and you have a child with severe disabilities, what other options were there? Put them in expensive institutions rampant with sexual and physical abuse? Sell the kid to PT Barnum? Abandon it? The science at the time was all they had. This is ultimately about women having little power and few options, not a hatred of disabled people/minorities. Now that we know better, we do better.
PT Barnum. I mean, the movie was entertaining and great to watch, but it was definitely the life of PT Barnum the way he might have told the story. The man had a slave woman as part of his freak show. He scammed people and was just generally a nasty human being.
Helen Keller did some fantastic things in her personal life and for society, so that's great. She was also a staunch supporter of eugenics, which is uterly horrible. And while on the topic, Alexander Graham Bell invented the telophone and fought for the inclusion of deaf people... by trying to outlaw sign language and forbidding deaf people from marrying to prevent the birth of more deaf people, whom he saw as "the defective race"
As a woman who grew up severely disabled, and only had the opportunities she did because her parents were wealthy, Keller used her platform for her entire, hardworking life to spread awareness. She spoke about birth control for prostitutes, since babies born of syphilitic mothers was one of the leading causes of blindness, in a time when an angelic disabled lady wasn't supposed to know about prostitutes and sex, much less talk about them in Boston parlors. She performed on vaudeville stages to earn money to pay for other deafblind children's educations. "Tireless" doesn't even begin to describe her work. We have GOT to stop using "they supported eugenics" as an easy way to cancel out everything else, because that was the scientific understanding at the time, and it was related to economic and social accessibility. It's not all Nazis then. It is expensive to be disabled. If you were a "fallen woman" in the early 1900s with a blind baby, you didn't have many options or support.
if Penn and Teller ever taught me anything it’s the answer to this question, and that answer is Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Teresa, and The Dalai Lama
I really dislike the impulse to classify people as 100% good or 100% bad. Humans are flawed. Just because some of their actions were contemptible (by todays standards) doesn't mean their accomplishments should be erased from history. Just because they accomplished great things doesn't mean that their misdeeds should be brushed under the carpet.
Watch it. U gonna get cancelled, buddy. How dare u look at both sides of something. U are so 20th Century.
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Trump is not universally beloved he is an effing joke
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Elon Musk should be top of this list. Donald Trump, too. And for all that "Foundation" stuff, I've heard Bill Gates is a real..... But they're all idolized by many. To the devotees of Elon, please bear in mind we're not all Elonites, and can state our opinions without it rending the fabric of time-space to shreds :-)
But the point was to shed light on horrible people who the public seem to love. Most normal, intelligent human beings despise both of those "people" already.
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The problem with some of these is that people often do both good and bad things with their lives. Same with each of us, many of us have done bad things. Different shades of grey. Without a doubt, most of the peeps in this list are darker shades of grey, don’t get me wrong! But if we discredit anything someone does because of something bad they’ve done, well, there’d be no good person list. Lennon for example…surely a d*^k, but we also can’t discredit the impact he’s had on music. I feel it’s ok to recognize both the good and bad a person’s done, and to not ignore either.
It's gone now, but that John Wayne one was a crazy night. It was the Oscars and Marlon Brando was awarded something. But he sent Sacheen Littlefeather in his stead to decline and instead read a speech about the desecration and ethnocide of Native American culture and history. Wayne was certainly a piece of work in is own right, and went to pull her off stage but was restrained by a bunch of people so never actually laid a hand on her. It was quite the scandal and nothing since has really compared to the impact of that night.
There is already too much hate in the world today. Do we really need any more?
Interesting to read the list. So much of it is from toxic masculinity, misogyny, racism, religious based BS and classism.
Ok so Nelson Mandela beating his wife ( and talking about it openly in his biography) is not a big deal I guess.
Not to mention his friendships with some horrible people.https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/12/10/the-last-great-liberator-why-mandela-made-and-stayed-friends-with-dictators/
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Surprised at how far I had to scroll to see his name come up! A horrible racist who even ensured that his racist movies could not be remade
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Comments about racism for most of these people seems a little thoughtless. Is racism bad? Of course. However, all of the people are products of their time period and judging them based on values of the currently evolved societal values is not logical or fair
Exactly. If you're raised in a racist community, you will become racist too. It's hard to break this circle
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Some of these I don't think should be on this list. Others definitely should though. I kind of think some people are getting false information for a couple of them. Just be sure to do your research people, before idolizing or hating. And remember that we are all humans that are victim to our time of living! Such as slavery and racism. It is absolutely not okay, but in their time, it was not widely understood.
Every-one have a right to their opinion,right or wrong,reserched or not...like Cnn and Fox-news...all I know is that a friend of mine,English.worked as a voluntary for Mother Theresa in Calcutta for two years in the end 60ties....never saw or talked of abuse...she did become a vegetarian,saying having seen so many open wounds put her off meat...can well believe it.. India is not known for their compassion with the plight of poor people and Mother theresa was the first to take in the lowest of the lowest to better their lives....If it went to her head later in life,who knows?? power corrupts...
I have mixed feelings about some individuals on this list. Humans are human. If you dig deep enough into any individual, you’ll find something dark. However, I have less respect for individuals that acted on those dark thoughts in a way that affected others negatively.
So much of what men in positions of control and dominance (I refuse to keep misusing the word - power) did is only now being fully questioned. So yes, all those from the past might have done good deeds in their professions, but personal lives were horrifically flawed due to emotional immaturity as we see today, the cause and root of all our woes. Humanity needs a wake up call to all the still engaged immaturity actions in order to correct the issues we are still dealing with from all the fallout of that emotional irresponsibility.
I would hazard a guess that, if you ALL looked back far enough in your own family trees, you'd be surprised at some of the evil shite that you'd find there. Are some of these people evil? Certainly, without a doubt... but the majority of these posts are of long dead people, and in every case, only one side of the story is told. There are THREE sides to every story... what "party A" said, what "party B" said, and what REALLY happened. Not ONE single, reliable source has been included in these posts to prove what the poster has stated. "Those who live in glass houses, should not throw stones". I do not condone the actions of anyone mentioned in these posts, and I despise evil in all its forms, but I can pretty much guarantee that there isn't a single person posting in this article, whose family tree does not have some evil roots somewhere down the line. NONE of us are perfect.
All people are flawed and make mistakes, because they are people, hopefully so we or others can learn from them. They behaviour was related to the time they lived in; to write a character assassination of people who have done great things that have benefited the world is just distasteful, woke, cancel culture snowflake b******t, even though they may have done horrible things, haven’t we all. Im not sure anyone of us should judge.
Nature is cruel and makes many people have troublesome urges. Yet there are still plenty of people who think whatever is natural is good. No surprise people used to be cruel through most of the history, especially as the urges of those in power were normalized.
I don't understand how Rhodes, of "The Rhodes Scholar" fame, didn't make the list.
Michelangelo! He was run out of multiple towns, he was repeatedly suspected of pedo crimes against his young models. The Catholic Church in part helped him stay ahead of the claims, and paid him to continue the abuse under the guise of “art.”
Too often “genius” comes with an enormous slice of poor character. This just substantiates it.
Lol. Weird use of the word "genius" when I look at list above. Scientifically I can only see 1 on the list (though the list partially debunks that claim...)
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Anybody who likes this kind of stuff should check out the podcast "Evil Genius" by Russell Kane, which essentially puts a comedy spin on this. Though hosted and panelled by comedians, it is genuinely thought provoking and there's several people featured on the show with whom my perception has been significantly altered.
After all they were human beings. The way these persons were brought up and the prevailing social norms decided their personality & behaviour. Moreover common man always try to find lacuna among stalwarts. Karamchand Gandhi doesn’t deserve Mahatma title nor Mother Teressa a Noble prize or sainthood. ( Without any prejudice, they had immense good qualities, but their dark secrets never come in limelight)
I agree with many of these, but a lot of them are "Heroes always have feet of clay" kinds of things. Show me any person who has done great work in the world and it's likely you will find other things they've done that are horrible. Maybe don't worship people no matter what good things they've done. A few of these were people who behaved exactly as was expected of them culturally at the time. That doesn't make it okay, but it does mean that we are not in a position to judge. I guarantee that 100 years from now some of our greatest figures will turn out to have had some pretty horrible skeletons in their closets.
There's some real propaganda believers in some of these incomplete bios.
Where much is given, much is taken away. You really shouldn't ever meet people who achieve greatness; they're always deeply flawed and missing other areas.
Stauffenberg. Everybody remembers the attempted assassination of Hitler. Nobody remembers the fact he was just as much of a nationalist antisemite.
really disappointing to see bored panda promoting 'hate'. there is no such thing as a perfect human being. no one's life should be dismissed, nor should someone be hated, simply because they were, as all of us are, flawed human beings.
We just need to accept that men before a certain time, did not think of women as human beings. Many still don't. In the mind of these men, women, POCs, handicapped people are all inferior creatures - something akin to trained monkey - and treated as such.
This is such black and white thinking. And not everyone is racist lol good grief guys
I miss Martin Luther here. He, basically, wrote all the jew-related parts of "Mein Kampf" 500 ears before, Mr. Hitler just had to copy them. More than once, he did so word for word, and still, Luther is seen as that liberator of europe. He never was. Other Theologians of his time were disgusted about his antijudaism and how he'd like it executed.
Those that scream the loudest for extreme measures, will be those that the future will show to have been doing horrible things. The only difference is that while just until the recent past any spoken or written word disapeared into nothingness quite quickly and tge vast majority of the population of bad people was never punished for their actions and words. This will be different in the future. Both, extreme left and right sentiments will be punished in the future. And only people using their brain will make the cut in the long run. This, or society collapses.
Ah, and all people are pretty or horrendously horrible by todays standard. Some by the standard the time they lived. But depending on how history plays out, it differs. One example: if a rightful heir to tge zarist throne would exist, and would help the West to overthrow Putin, but wanted to establish a different form of russia, we would celebrate, even if it came at a horrible price. If Putin wins and gradually establishes a new Worldorder, ppl would be brainwashed, and sing Songs about defending Putin. And hate the evil heir, and the West. If you believe that you were not brainwashed, you err. Everybody is. The crux is to use your brain, to inform yourself, and to think. But don't follow Conspiracies. Find your own path.
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How about Frank Lloyd Wright who left his wife with six children, defaulted on child support, and lived a luxurious life style? FLW treated his married mistress to a life of extended travels to Japan and Europe. She also had to worry, though, about how he never paid his bills and had to skirt these issues with him, as well as some trust issues. Women were very attracted to him because of his fame as an architect and high living. He moved her up to his home, Taliesen, in Spring Green, Wisconsin, leaving her alone to manage their workers while he commuted back and forth to Oak Park and Chicago, where he worked for the Century of Progress World’s Fair prior to its opening. This ultimately led to her gruesome death and those of her two children. He had sent her a Barbadosian couple as servants to help out.Unfortunately, they were not emotionally stable, and caused a grisly death scene of fire and machete. Frank grieved for a short time, then went on to several more mistresses and wives.
I didn't know about many details, but in general, I don't tend to like historical figures, precisely because I really ignore what they really were like. As some people said, history is written by the winners, and though not everything is about wars, in general obviously most of what we know about these figures is basically hearsay. Heck, even people that is alive today or that you got to know in your lifetime, you don't really get to know them personally, but at least you have a closer idea than someone that has been dead for decades. Personally, other than Britney Spears I've never idolized anyone, and even I recognize her defects.
All these posts neglect that people do bad things, atrocious things at times, because we all fail to be perfect. Yet even with the flaws in their character, many people still contribute to society thru their creativity and innovation, which does not negate their bad behavior, if true, but also does not negate what they contributed.
If anybody would ever take the time to actually read the Bible instead of just bashing it it clearly tells us in the book of Psalms 146:3 Do not put your trust in nobles. Nor in the son of earthly man to whom no salvation belongs. Cant put it any clearer.
Not everyone believes in your Bible so your point doesn't stand. I've read the Bible I'm a recovering Catholic it furthered my justification in atheism.
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Honestly..... Are we even surprised at this? Humans are awful creatures. Higher intelligence does not make for a better species. We all suck.
sooooo humans being (bad) humans. Just cuz they are famous doesn't make any of them good.
So basically humans suck and nothing has changed since the beginning of time.
Well we now have about 1-5% of the worlds population that is no longer enslaved. Technically that's a big increase from a thousand years ago. Wonder if it's a linear adoption curve or....
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David Bowie ... he slept with and dated a 13-14 year old, who he cheated on with several men and women.
Steve Tyler of Aerosmith groomed a 14 yr old got her parents to sign rights over to him so he could adopt her then moved her into his home got her pregnant and forced her to have an abortion.
Load More Replies... Basically none of these are beloved. Most of them achieved some kind of widespread good, we celebrate that part, we don't really celebrate any of them as a person.
If being literally considered a saint is not celebrating someone as a person, then I don't know what is.
Load More Replies... Please add Margret Mead, Ayn Rand, Margret Thatcher, Joan Crawford, and Pope John Paul 2.
What did Margaret Mead do that was wrong, out of curiosity? I've studied her in a couple classes and we've not really been told anything bad about her.
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To all the people actively contributing to hate - I recommend the photo of a mirror as the number 1 post. Like so many of us are loveable saints... 🙄
I doubt that many of the commenters are widely beloved/idolised and, from the other side, sold children, enslaved people etc.
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Enid Blyton. the British children's Author famous for The Famous Five, The Secret Seven, Mallory Towers, Noddy, Mr. Galliano's Circus and The Faraway Tree etc. She was a prolific writer' but a horrible person. She had a series of affairs, including a lesbian relationship with one of the children's nannies. In 1941, Blyton met Kenneth Fraser Darrell Waters, a London surgeon with whom she began a serious affair. Pollock discovered the liaison, and threatened to initiate divorce proceedings. Due to fears that exposure of her adultery would ruin her public image, it was ultimately agreed that Blyton would instead file for divorce against her husband Major Hugh Alexander Pollock Blyton promised that if he admitted to infidelity, she would allow him parental access to their daughters; but after the divorce, he was denied contact with them, and Blyton made sure he was subsequently unable to find work in publishing. Pollock, having married Crowe on 26 October 1943, eventually resumed his heavy drinking and was forced to petition for bankruptcy in 1950.
All this "reimagining" of historic figures and events reeks of its own racism. I'll no longer be following your page. The cism and slavery that occured in America, more than 200 years ago, does not justify anyone being racist now. The focus on American slavery highlights how little black Americans know about the history of slavery in general. Look up the tomb of Ramesses III, it was built thousands of years before American slavery existed and one of the first things you will notice on the left wall near the entrance is a scene of DISTINCTLY African slaves engraved into it. (You can explore the burial site yourself on the Matterport website, it's free and doesn't require registration) my point is so much blame is put on America's past that black American's aren't learning about other important times in history. Depriving them of the knowledge of their past, especially in their native homeland, is a negative for everyone. I hope you guys check out the tomb in Egypt, it is truly amazing.
Well, it's abote people who are generally beloved, so the number of communists is bound to be small
Load More Replies... This rant is nonsensical. Idk what you're trying to achieve. Most of these people should've been in prison. Yeah some are being outed as liar cheaters bad parents so what? We can all make up our minds about that as well. Why are you so against the truth? It's not judgment when it's a factual statement. I can forgive or understand when people make mistakes I've made mistakes I've hurt people I've also taken responsibility and I also know I can't force anyone to accept my apology and will forever be not liked by someone. However I can't forgive rapists or pedophiles I don't have it in me.
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I really dislike the impulse to classify people as 100% good or 100% bad. Humans are flawed. Just because some of their actions were contemptible (by todays standards) doesn't mean their accomplishments should be erased from history. Just because they accomplished great things doesn't mean that their misdeeds should be brushed under the carpet.
Watch it. U gonna get cancelled, buddy. How dare u look at both sides of something. U are so 20th Century.
Load More Replies... Trump is not universally beloved he is an effing joke
Load More Replies... Elon Musk should be top of this list. Donald Trump, too. And for all that "Foundation" stuff, I've heard Bill Gates is a real..... But they're all idolized by many. To the devotees of Elon, please bear in mind we're not all Elonites, and can state our opinions without it rending the fabric of time-space to shreds :-)
But the point was to shed light on horrible people who the public seem to love. Most normal, intelligent human beings despise both of those "people" already.
Load More Replies... The problem with some of these is that people often do both good and bad things with their lives. Same with each of us, many of us have done bad things. Different shades of grey. Without a doubt, most of the peeps in this list are darker shades of grey, don’t get me wrong! But if we discredit anything someone does because of something bad they’ve done, well, there’d be no good person list. Lennon for example…surely a d*^k, but we also can’t discredit the impact he’s had on music. I feel it’s ok to recognize both the good and bad a person’s done, and to not ignore either.
It's gone now, but that John Wayne one was a crazy night. It was the Oscars and Marlon Brando was awarded something. But he sent Sacheen Littlefeather in his stead to decline and instead read a speech about the desecration and ethnocide of Native American culture and history. Wayne was certainly a piece of work in is own right, and went to pull her off stage but was restrained by a bunch of people so never actually laid a hand on her. It was quite the scandal and nothing since has really compared to the impact of that night.
There is already too much hate in the world today. Do we really need any more?
Interesting to read the list. So much of it is from toxic masculinity, misogyny, racism, religious based BS and classism.
Ok so Nelson Mandela beating his wife ( and talking about it openly in his biography) is not a big deal I guess.
Not to mention his friendships with some horrible people.https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/12/10/the-last-great-liberator-why-mandela-made-and-stayed-friends-with-dictators/
Load More Replies... Surprised at how far I had to scroll to see his name come up! A horrible racist who even ensured that his racist movies could not be remade
Load More Replies... Comments about racism for most of these people seems a little thoughtless. Is racism bad? Of course. However, all of the people are products of their time period and judging them based on values of the currently evolved societal values is not logical or fair
Exactly. If you're raised in a racist community, you will become racist too. It's hard to break this circle
Load More Replies... Some of these I don't think should be on this list. Others definitely should though. I kind of think some people are getting false information for a couple of them. Just be sure to do your research people, before idolizing or hating. And remember that we are all humans that are victim to our time of living! Such as slavery and racism. It is absolutely not okay, but in their time, it was not widely understood.
Every-one have a right to their opinion,right or wrong,reserched or not...like Cnn and Fox-news...all I know is that a friend of mine,English.worked as a voluntary for Mother Theresa in Calcutta for two years in the end 60ties....never saw or talked of abuse...she did become a vegetarian,saying having seen so many open wounds put her off meat...can well believe it.. India is not known for their compassion with the plight of poor people and Mother theresa was the first to take in the lowest of the lowest to better their lives....If it went to her head later in life,who knows?? power corrupts...
I have mixed feelings about some individuals on this list. Humans are human. If you dig deep enough into any individual, you’ll find something dark. However, I have less respect for individuals that acted on those dark thoughts in a way that affected others negatively.
So much of what men in positions of control and dominance (I refuse to keep misusing the word - power) did is only now being fully questioned. So yes, all those from the past might have done good deeds in their professions, but personal lives were horrifically flawed due to emotional immaturity as we see today, the cause and root of all our woes. Humanity needs a wake up call to all the still engaged immaturity actions in order to correct the issues we are still dealing with from all the fallout of that emotional irresponsibility.
I would hazard a guess that, if you ALL looked back far enough in your own family trees, you'd be surprised at some of the evil shite that you'd find there. Are some of these people evil? Certainly, without a doubt... but the majority of these posts are of long dead people, and in every case, only one side of the story is told. There are THREE sides to every story... what "party A" said, what "party B" said, and what REALLY happened. Not ONE single, reliable source has been included in these posts to prove what the poster has stated. "Those who live in glass houses, should not throw stones". I do not condone the actions of anyone mentioned in these posts, and I despise evil in all its forms, but I can pretty much guarantee that there isn't a single person posting in this article, whose family tree does not have some evil roots somewhere down the line. NONE of us are perfect.
All people are flawed and make mistakes, because they are people, hopefully so we or others can learn from them. They behaviour was related to the time they lived in; to write a character assassination of people who have done great things that have benefited the world is just distasteful, woke, cancel culture snowflake b******t, even though they may have done horrible things, haven’t we all. Im not sure anyone of us should judge.
Nature is cruel and makes many people have troublesome urges. Yet there are still plenty of people who think whatever is natural is good. No surprise people used to be cruel through most of the history, especially as the urges of those in power were normalized.
I don't understand how Rhodes, of "The Rhodes Scholar" fame, didn't make the list.
Michelangelo! He was run out of multiple towns, he was repeatedly suspected of pedo crimes against his young models. The Catholic Church in part helped him stay ahead of the claims, and paid him to continue the abuse under the guise of “art.”
Too often “genius” comes with an enormous slice of poor character. This just substantiates it.
Lol. Weird use of the word "genius" when I look at list above. Scientifically I can only see 1 on the list (though the list partially debunks that claim...)
Load More Replies... Anybody who likes this kind of stuff should check out the podcast "Evil Genius" by Russell Kane, which essentially puts a comedy spin on this. Though hosted and panelled by comedians, it is genuinely thought provoking and there's several people featured on the show with whom my perception has been significantly altered.
After all they were human beings. The way these persons were brought up and the prevailing social norms decided their personality & behaviour. Moreover common man always try to find lacuna among stalwarts. Karamchand Gandhi doesn’t deserve Mahatma title nor Mother Teressa a Noble prize or sainthood. ( Without any prejudice, they had immense good qualities, but their dark secrets never come in limelight)
I agree with many of these, but a lot of them are "Heroes always have feet of clay" kinds of things. Show me any person who has done great work in the world and it's likely you will find other things they've done that are horrible. Maybe don't worship people no matter what good things they've done. A few of these were people who behaved exactly as was expected of them culturally at the time. That doesn't make it okay, but it does mean that we are not in a position to judge. I guarantee that 100 years from now some of our greatest figures will turn out to have had some pretty horrible skeletons in their closets.
There's some real propaganda believers in some of these incomplete bios.
Where much is given, much is taken away. You really shouldn't ever meet people who achieve greatness; they're always deeply flawed and missing other areas.
Stauffenberg. Everybody remembers the attempted assassination of Hitler. Nobody remembers the fact he was just as much of a nationalist antisemite.
really disappointing to see bored panda promoting 'hate'. there is no such thing as a perfect human being. no one's life should be dismissed, nor should someone be hated, simply because they were, as all of us are, flawed human beings.
We just need to accept that men before a certain time, did not think of women as human beings. Many still don't. In the mind of these men, women, POCs, handicapped people are all inferior creatures - something akin to trained monkey - and treated as such.
This is such black and white thinking. And not everyone is racist lol good grief guys
I miss Martin Luther here. He, basically, wrote all the jew-related parts of "Mein Kampf" 500 ears before, Mr. Hitler just had to copy them. More than once, he did so word for word, and still, Luther is seen as that liberator of europe. He never was. Other Theologians of his time were disgusted about his antijudaism and how he'd like it executed.
Those that scream the loudest for extreme measures, will be those that the future will show to have been doing horrible things. The only difference is that while just until the recent past any spoken or written word disapeared into nothingness quite quickly and tge vast majority of the population of bad people was never punished for their actions and words. This will be different in the future. Both, extreme left and right sentiments will be punished in the future. And only people using their brain will make the cut in the long run. This, or society collapses.
Ah, and all people are pretty or horrendously horrible by todays standard. Some by the standard the time they lived. But depending on how history plays out, it differs. One example: if a rightful heir to tge zarist throne would exist, and would help the West to overthrow Putin, but wanted to establish a different form of russia, we would celebrate, even if it came at a horrible price. If Putin wins and gradually establishes a new Worldorder, ppl would be brainwashed, and sing Songs about defending Putin. And hate the evil heir, and the West. If you believe that you were not brainwashed, you err. Everybody is. The crux is to use your brain, to inform yourself, and to think. But don't follow Conspiracies. Find your own path.
Load More Replies... How about Frank Lloyd Wright who left his wife with six children, defaulted on child support, and lived a luxurious life style? FLW treated his married mistress to a life of extended travels to Japan and Europe. She also had to worry, though, about how he never paid his bills and had to skirt these issues with him, as well as some trust issues. Women were very attracted to him because of his fame as an architect and high living. He moved her up to his home, Taliesen, in Spring Green, Wisconsin, leaving her alone to manage their workers while he commuted back and forth to Oak Park and Chicago, where he worked for the Century of Progress World’s Fair prior to its opening. This ultimately led to her gruesome death and those of her two children. He had sent her a Barbadosian couple as servants to help out.Unfortunately, they were not emotionally stable, and caused a grisly death scene of fire and machete. Frank grieved for a short time, then went on to several more mistresses and wives.
I didn't know about many details, but in general, I don't tend to like historical figures, precisely because I really ignore what they really were like. As some people said, history is written by the winners, and though not everything is about wars, in general obviously most of what we know about these figures is basically hearsay. Heck, even people that is alive today or that you got to know in your lifetime, you don't really get to know them personally, but at least you have a closer idea than someone that has been dead for decades. Personally, other than Britney Spears I've never idolized anyone, and even I recognize her defects.
All these posts neglect that people do bad things, atrocious things at times, because we all fail to be perfect. Yet even with the flaws in their character, many people still contribute to society thru their creativity and innovation, which does not negate their bad behavior, if true, but also does not negate what they contributed.
If anybody would ever take the time to actually read the Bible instead of just bashing it it clearly tells us in the book of Psalms 146:3 Do not put your trust in nobles. Nor in the son of earthly man to whom no salvation belongs. Cant put it any clearer.
Not everyone believes in your Bible so your point doesn't stand. I've read the Bible I'm a recovering Catholic it furthered my justification in atheism.
Load More Replies... Honestly..... Are we even surprised at this? Humans are awful creatures. Higher intelligence does not make for a better species. We all suck.
sooooo humans being (bad) humans. Just cuz they are famous doesn't make any of them good.
So basically humans suck and nothing has changed since the beginning of time.
Well we now have about 1-5% of the worlds population that is no longer enslaved. Technically that's a big increase from a thousand years ago. Wonder if it's a linear adoption curve or....
Load More Replies... David Bowie ... he slept with and dated a 13-14 year old, who he cheated on with several men and women.
Steve Tyler of Aerosmith groomed a 14 yr old got her parents to sign rights over to him so he could adopt her then moved her into his home got her pregnant and forced her to have an abortion.
Load More Replies... Basically none of these are beloved. Most of them achieved some kind of widespread good, we celebrate that part, we don't really celebrate any of them as a person.
If being literally considered a saint is not celebrating someone as a person, then I don't know what is.
Load More Replies... Please add Margret Mead, Ayn Rand, Margret Thatcher, Joan Crawford, and Pope John Paul 2.
What did Margaret Mead do that was wrong, out of curiosity? I've studied her in a couple classes and we've not really been told anything bad about her.
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To all the people actively contributing to hate - I recommend the photo of a mirror as the number 1 post. Like so many of us are loveable saints... 🙄
I doubt that many of the commenters are widely beloved/idolised and, from the other side, sold children, enslaved people etc.
Load More Replies... Enid Blyton. the British children's Author famous for The Famous Five, The Secret Seven, Mallory Towers, Noddy, Mr. Galliano's Circus and The Faraway Tree etc. She was a prolific writer' but a horrible person. She had a series of affairs, including a lesbian relationship with one of the children's nannies. In 1941, Blyton met Kenneth Fraser Darrell Waters, a London surgeon with whom she began a serious affair. Pollock discovered the liaison, and threatened to initiate divorce proceedings. Due to fears that exposure of her adultery would ruin her public image, it was ultimately agreed that Blyton would instead file for divorce against her husband Major Hugh Alexander Pollock Blyton promised that if he admitted to infidelity, she would allow him parental access to their daughters; but after the divorce, he was denied contact with them, and Blyton made sure he was subsequently unable to find work in publishing. Pollock, having married Crowe on 26 October 1943, eventually resumed his heavy drinking and was forced to petition for bankruptcy in 1950.
All this "reimagining" of historic figures and events reeks of its own racism. I'll no longer be following your page. The cism and slavery that occured in America, more than 200 years ago, does not justify anyone being racist now. The focus on American slavery highlights how little black Americans know about the history of slavery in general. Look up the tomb of Ramesses III, it was built thousands of years before American slavery existed and one of the first things you will notice on the left wall near the entrance is a scene of DISTINCTLY African slaves engraved into it. (You can explore the burial site yourself on the Matterport website, it's free and doesn't require registration) my point is so much blame is put on America's past that black American's aren't learning about other important times in history. Depriving them of the knowledge of their past, especially in their native homeland, is a negative for everyone. I hope you guys check out the tomb in Egypt, it is truly amazing.
Well, it's abote people who are generally beloved, so the number of communists is bound to be small
Load More Replies... This rant is nonsensical. Idk what you're trying to achieve. Most of these people should've been in prison. Yeah some are being outed as liar cheaters bad parents so what? We can all make up our minds about that as well. Why are you so against the truth? It's not judgment when it's a factual statement. I can forgive or understand when people make mistakes I've made mistakes I've hurt people I've also taken responsibility and I also know I can't force anyone to accept my apology and will forever be not liked by someone. However I can't forgive rapists or pedophiles I don't have it in me.
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