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This Former U.S. Health Insurance Exec Says He And The Entire Industry Lied To Americans About Canadian Healthcare
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This Former U.S. Health Insurance Exec Says He And The Entire Industry Lied To Americans About Canadian Healthcare

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If someone told you that Canada’s health system is an example of socialist failure, where wait times are outrageous and people swarm to the U.S. to get the healthcare they really need, they probably lied.

Wendell Potter spent two decades working in the health insurance industry. He knew it in and out. And he got sick of it. In 2008, Potter quit his job at Cigna as head of corporate communications and has been on a mission to revamp the healthcare system in the country ever since. Serving as a whistleblower and exposing behind-the-scenes corruption and manipulation in the dirty world of health insurance, he posted a thread on Twitter the previous week in which he explained how he had personally been a part of dishonoring Canada’s system so that Americans would think theirs was superior.

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“Health insurers in the U.S. are just as driven to make a profit as ever. As long as that is the case, we will not have a system most Americans can afford,” Potter told Bored Panda.

According to him, the insurance industry has erected barriers that make it increasingly difficult for people to get the care they need when they need it to avoid paying claims and to maximize profits.

This include:

  • High deductible plans which most Americans have been forced into and which requires them to pay huge amounts of money out of their own pockets before their insurer will start paying for medical care;
  • Requiring doctors to obtain approval in advance before proceeding with treatment and even before prescribing certain medications;
  • Kicking many doctors, hospitals, and other facilities out of their provider networks;
  • People who get care from out-of-network providers (often unknowingly) are usually on the hook to pay much if not all of the resulting bills.

Image credits: wendellpotter

“These barriers are largely unknown in other healthcare systems around the world,” Potter said.

He said that slandering Canada’s system has largely damaged Americans, who have been so misled by the misinformation that they have become fearful of proposals that would make the U.S. system more like Canada’s. “As a result, hundreds of thousands of people have died prematurely and unnecessarily over the years because of a lack of access to affordable and timely care.”

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“The slander also undoubtedly has been useful to right-wing organizations in Canada, such as the Vancouver-based Fraser Institute which for years has tried to dismantle the Canadian system and privatize it,” Potter explained.

Potter said the industry continues spreading the same old lies. “They [still] use fresh cherry-picked data and anecdotes that cannot be verified but which many people are willing to believe, unfortunately,” he explained. “The biggest ongoing myth the industry continues to perpetuate is that Canadians wait endlessly for needed care. They obscure the truth that there are actually more doctors per 1,000 people in Canada than in the U.S., and Canadians see their doctors considerably more often than Americans do (6.8 times a year in Canada on average versus 4 times a year in the U.S.).”

Potter highlighted that the insurance industry enlists allies to spread lies and mislead people, including the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the Federation of Independent Business, both of which Potter used to work with when he was in the insurance industry.

“Those organizations purport to represent American businesses, small businesses especially. Their opinions do not reflect the opinions of many U.S. business leaders. I encourage people to be skeptical of anything those organizations say.”

To learn more about what the US healthcare system is and what it could be, check out Business Leaders for Health Care Transformation, an organization Potter leads that represents businesses of all sizes and types that worry about how rising healthcare costs will impact their business and their workforce. Or follow him on Twitter @wendellpotter.

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Rokas Laurinavičius

Rokas Laurinavičius

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Rokas is a writer at Bored Panda with a BA in Communication. After working for a sculptor, he fell in love with visual storytelling and enjoys covering everything from TV shows (any Sopranos fans out there?) to photography. Throughout his years in Bored Panda, over 235 million people have read the posts he's written, which is probably more than he could count to.

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Rokas Laurinavičius

Rokas Laurinavičius

Writer, BoredPanda staff

Rokas is a writer at Bored Panda with a BA in Communication. After working for a sculptor, he fell in love with visual storytelling and enjoys covering everything from TV shows (any Sopranos fans out there?) to photography. Throughout his years in Bored Panda, over 235 million people have read the posts he's written, which is probably more than he could count to.

Ilona Baliūnaitė

Ilona Baliūnaitė

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I'm a Visual Editor at Bored Panda since 2017. I've searched through a multitude of images to create over 2000 diverse posts on a wide range of topics. I love memes, funny, and cute stuff, but I'm also into social issues topics. Despite my background in communication, my heart belongs to visual media, especially photography. When I'm not at my desk, you're likely to find me in the streets with my camera, checking out cool exhibitions, watching a movie at the cinema or just chilling with a coffee in a cozy place

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Ilona Baliūnaitė

Ilona Baliūnaitė

Author, BoredPanda staff

I'm a Visual Editor at Bored Panda since 2017. I've searched through a multitude of images to create over 2000 diverse posts on a wide range of topics. I love memes, funny, and cute stuff, but I'm also into social issues topics. Despite my background in communication, my heart belongs to visual media, especially photography. When I'm not at my desk, you're likely to find me in the streets with my camera, checking out cool exhibitions, watching a movie at the cinema or just chilling with a coffee in a cozy place

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maddi_050203 avatar
LOttawa
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Yes we pay higher taxes for our health care but it's still not has much as some of those monthly insurance payments I have seen some people pay and we don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars hanging over our heads. I much prefer paying a few hundreds dollar a year (which I don't see since it's taken off my pay cheque every two weeks). Also, if you have health care insurance thru your employer (for prescriptions and things like that), you pay less taxes (at least in my province).

onemessylady avatar
Aunt Messy
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

We live in the States. Our health insurance for two retired people would be well over $2000.00 a MONTH. That's for two healthy people who are minimal meds. If we moved to BC.....as of January 1, NO ONE pays health insurance premiums.

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theresacecil avatar
Leafless
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Have you ever seen anyone in Europe or Canada protest for our system?

felicia_3 avatar
Felicia Dale
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Well, yes, but their complaints were relatively minor and mainly involved long wait times for elective procedures that weren't life threatening. Compared to the US, that's nothing.

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bronnie69 avatar
Bron
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Australia is similar to Canada, except there’s no such thing as insurance through employers. If we want, and can afford to, we can buy private health insurance. Sometimes it covers all costs, sometimes not. Yes, I do pay through my taxes but so what? Even though I hardly ever go to the doctor (once in the past 10 years), I’d rather contribute to the health and well-being of even the conservatives than contribute to the disgusting salaries of insurance executives etc.

deannawoods avatar
deanna woods
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am an American with lots of health problems and no health insurance. It is very difficult for me to go to the doctor or even the emergency room. I have had an abscessed tooth and instead of getting a root canal and saving the tooth, I am getting it pulled because that is much cheaper. I have anxiety and depression and if it weren't for a local mental health program, I wouldn't be able to get my medications. I understand that not every health care system is perfect, but at least some of these other countries try to do right by all their citizens. All American health insurance carriers seem to do is lie about how great their coverage is.

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

From what I have heard, dentistry is different than medical care, even in Canada, and is not included in their universal healthcare. Can a Canadian answer definitively? Thanks!

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jacobbeccagizmothesquirrel avatar
Becca Gizmo the Squirrel
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Yeah I owe probably around $8000 just from ER bills from before I had insurance. Now I'm on medicaid because my husband is disabled but I still have to pay $180 a month to see my doctor. The whole insurance/no insurance situation in America is ridiculous. We should be more like Canada. In a lot of ways.

laurahabermehl avatar
Laura Maeflower
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Wait...you have to pay to see a doctor? Like, even if nothing is wrong with you?

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parmeisan avatar
Parmeisan
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am alive today because of the Canadian health care system. If I lived in the states and knew I'd have to pay $300 for a visit to the ER (a quick google search puts the average at $1,389, but even if I knew it would be much less), I would have told myself that funny feeling was probably nothing, there wasn't even any pain, I was fine. And then I would have died from the pulmonary embolism that it actually was.

parmeisan avatar
Parmeisan
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have had a lot of health issues in my life. I've been on blood thinners and getting blood tests every week. I've been sent to so many different specialists for so many different tests. Sometimes I wait 2 or 3 months, sometimes I wait closer to a year. I've also been to the ER a number of times, where they let you in immediately for some symptoms and you wait up to 8 hours for others. In both cases, you're probably in for 12 hours of waiting between nurses coming in and asking questions, having blood or urine tests done, doctors coming in and asking more questions, special tests being ordered, etc etc. But they have always taken good care of me, been prompt when urgency is called for, never hesitated to call for tests or other procedures (e.g. dialysis), never made me question the overall competency of my carers (although I *have* had call to question the competency of certain individual doctors), and the most I've ever paid was for medication which is not always covered.

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ed_25 avatar
Electric Ed
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

"pre-existing clause/condition" - wait what does that mean? Its written so it sounds like the health insurance deny paying for the treatment? Someone from the USA pleas explain.

mrtree1779 avatar
MrTree1779
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

"Pre-existing condition" is a term used by medical insurance companies to avoid paying the bills, and a way for them to force the patient to pay them. It assumes that the patient has a condition which will require more medical care. If the medical insurance company were to be responsible for the costs, they would pay more. So, to pay as little as possible, the medical insurance company says that they will not be responsible for many illnesses which Americans have, and refuse to pay for those illnesses. It is a way for our medical insurance companies to be greedy and cruel, and win in court.

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kevinhickey avatar
Kevin Hickey
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Medicare for All will cost $30 Trillion over the next ten years!! That's always the headline. They never tell you that under our current system we'll be paying a lot more than that over the next ten years.

ljamie04 avatar
Weishaar Jamie
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Health care is not, and never was, suppose to be a business or about making money. America is SO greedy. Nothing gets done without it profiting someone. There are cures for cancers (and other diseases) but, far too much money is made by those in control of current treatments. As things are, we will never be healthy. There's too much money is making and keeping is sick! I will never understand how those people who profit from illness and death can live with themselves. It WILL come back to them. No system is perfect but, at least some other countries put people over profit.

mascha-claessens avatar
Mascha Claessens
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

This is a problem in many countries (though the US might be one of the worst, definitely). I'm pretty sure healthcare is much better where I live (mandatory health insurance, really lowering financial risks for people who get/are ill and/or in an accident), but there are still too many people profiting off health care, unfortunately: insurance companies, hospital boards, big pharma, etc...

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ljamie04 avatar
febfifteen2006 avatar
PaulV
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Thanks for nothing. His words are virtually worthless. He needs to go the warpath to fixing things.

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febfifteen2006 avatar
PaulV
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I think I've seen this guy on TV before, saying the same thing. It doesn't even matter anymore. His lies have taken root, and he'll have to do a lot more to undo those lies and more yet to atone for them. All the money he collected for these lies is ill-gotten. How many millions have died because of the American medical "system"? This is a crying shame.

christophebeunens avatar
Christophe Beunens
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Some figures of Europe : When not working, you pay in Luxembour, monthly +/- 110 EUR for health insurance (when working, your employer pays it). a Dr visit costs about 40 EUR (generalist), and you get +/- 80 % of all medical costs paid back (in case of hospital visit or serious sickness, up to 100%). There are no shortages nor priviledged users who get better service.

justforfacebook avatar
ƒιѕн
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

My ambulance ride I cant afford just got turned over to a debt collector.

laurahabermehl avatar
Laura Maeflower
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I think it's such an awful thing to have to decide whether you can afford an ambulance in an emergency. It's really life or death and in America you have to literally weigh the costs and risks before you call! Here in Canada you don't think twice, you just call if anything seems wrong.

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gabyk421 avatar
b l a n c
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

i had no idea americans thought this about canada's health system, and i live in canada! it's very surprising actually, i didn't know somebody lied about all this

patriciaryan avatar
Patricia Ryan
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I lived in Canada (gave birth to my kids there), and found the care for routine pediatric care was good - high quality and free (or cheap). If you have cancer, orthopedic problems, illness requiring multiple surgeries, the Canadian system has long wait times and sometimes such slow treatment that problems get worse or not treated at all. I have brought 6 family members to the US for back and hip surgery, and radiology services not available in Canada. Aunt had breast tumor that was not seen by the imaging services available to her. My brother-in-law had to call an ambulance to get follow up treatment from his colon cancer surgeon who would tell him when he was on call at a Toronto hospital. My nephew (26)was told his hip was inoperable- would need cane! He had surgery in US and is a personal trainer. Single Payer is "free", and decent general care. Problems that US citizens would expect to treat promptly and completely are not handled well, or at all, in Canadian system.

kjorn avatar
Kjorn
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

the guy is complaint about crappy internet and bad coffee after spending 11 in Intensive care?

joicain avatar
Yayaboobo
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

This is just one industry. Think of the policies for implementing innovative best practices and effective, environmental, ethical, economical, educational that could be happening all over but for greed. The greater good is a thing of fantasy more and more. Many of these people practice the ideals found in Atlas Shrugged which basically says there's no greater freedom than to be free to reject humanitarian causes, mainly charity. Something like that. Scary.

el_dee avatar
El Dee
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have always been amazed that Americans believe that a highly expensive health care system that excludes you when you most need it (your off sick and not being paid) and even when you can make use of it you have deductibles and they are massive. Where I am we have free at the point of use, health, dental and opticians. Prescriptions are free too. I can't understand how they've been conned into somehow thinking that's a bad idea..

kennykulbiski avatar
Kenny Kulbiski
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Didn't get through all the comments but I didn't see anyone expressing surprise.

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

What a bunch of lies!!! 82% of their COVID deaths were seniors in nursing homes! And conditions were horrible before that!!! People be were sitting in soiled diapers and clothes, dehydrated and hungry! Don't believe me? Look it up! Single payer proponents say they "won't push granny off a cliff," but in Canada they treat the aged in ways that would make you cry if it was an animal shelter. Think getting old is a long time away? It comes sooner than you think!

katehargreaves678 avatar
columbokateUK
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Every other first world country is wrong but the USA is right then ?🤔 thanks for letting us all know 👍

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davenyc88 avatar
Dave P
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Not about his data, however after leaving the industry he first worked as a lobyyist of big pharma, then he took a job paying twice as much for political organization to lobby for nationalized healthcare. He did a 180 after taking his new high paying job and currenty earns more than he did as a health care executive between all his lobbying contacts. Not going into details on his data and claims, but questioning the man's credibility

romenriel avatar
Eliška Hůlková
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am from Czech Republic and I want to say that I am insanely grateful for our system of health insurance. As a student below 26, I don't have to contribute yet, but I am more than ready to do so as soon as I will have a job. Not everything in our health care system is perfect - naturally - but it works and is affordable.

vicd avatar
Vic D
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

As a Canadian I used to complain about waiting time in our health system, today after seeing how covid affected the different health systems around the world I would say we have one of the best system, they even managed to improve some of the services during this pandemic. The most covid cases registered in my province where in private nursing home ! The Private did worst than public, buy cheap medical supply, underpaid health workers they quickly got overwhelmed by covid cases !

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Country Nana - Forever We the North said something similar. I feel like US is the opposite - all seniors get Medicare. May people should live in Canada and retire in US. (I know it doesn't actually work like that.)

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janetclarke avatar
Hiker Chick
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have insurance through my work (that I pay for) but I will decline treatment if I have an expensive illness. My kids are adults now and I don't want them burdened with my debt, but I will end up homeless if I end up In the hospital for more than a few days. So, my choices are just die of natural causes or get treated but declare bankruptcy and probably lose my house. Payment plans are no longer workable, even at public hospitals, as I found out after my daughter's ambulance ride and hospitalization.

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-lays-bare-poor-conditions-in-canadas-nursing-homes-11592996400

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06-canada-worst-elderly-home-coronavirus.html

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://www.aplaceformom.com/blog/8-02-16-rethinking-health-care-for-canadian-seniors/

bojo30 avatar
slackjack
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

The difference is the systems that run it. As opposed to Canada, everything the US Fed Govt controls turns to s**t. (Prob get downvoted, but that's my observation.)

stanflouride avatar
Stannous Flouride
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Like the Postal Service that allows you to put a 55-cent stamp on an envelope and have it delivered safely to the most isolated places in the country in under 14 days? The system that the anti-government folks have saddled with a requirement that all pensions be completely covered for 75 years in advance and yet still makes a profit? (btw- These same people have no problem with corporations taking peoples' pension funds and then declaring bankruptcy to cheat them out of it)

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pragyafating_1 avatar
Jaded Queen
Community Member
3 years ago

This comment is hidden. Click here to view.

Either way people are dying. Earth is finally healing. We need more people to die and make robots to do work(i know a long way, but putting all resources and minds to this goal, i dont think it should take that much time). So we can all have mansions and our private islands. 8 billion people just isn't feasible. Stop procreating you idiots . And thank covid. I know it is painful. But if population is not kept under check this is wwhta happens

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I understand the point you are making. (I had a bumper sticker in high school that said "Save the Planet, Kill Yourself") But the people that are dying of coronavirus are, by and large, not people who are procreating. So the deaths will be a small blip in humanity. Also, there is enough wealth in the world for everyone to have a mansion right now. All 8 billion of us. The only thing preventing it is selfishness and greed.

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mjw0sysascend_com avatar
lara
Community Member
3 years ago

This comment is hidden. Click here to view.

I have three friends born and raised in Canada. Two of whom are now US citizens and that "positive" view of the Canadian health "care" system is not one they share. I think that the phrase they used was draconian bureaucracy.

anitac_ avatar
Mme de Poppadom
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Are they themselves doctors, and have to do the paperwork? Or, are they medical advisors for government healthcare policy? Otherwise, I (and likely every Canadian on this site) have no idea what you're talking about. When I think of "bureaucracy" I think of the pre-approval system of managed care, or the thousands of insurers to review and choose from, plus the billing system that the U.S., in all their socialist-hating glory, gives the illusion of freedom of choice and free market capitalism.

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petrikabellovoda avatar
CORLEONE
Community Member
3 years ago

This comment is hidden. Click here to view.

You write America is better than Canada. Canada is in America my doctor friend. When you write America you mean USA. right???? school gives you a job but it's not making you intelligent, sorry...

m2crows avatar
Mike Crow
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

It is true that Canada, Mexico and Argentina are part of America (North and South) and the USA is the United States OF America, but in today’s culture America and Americans usually refer to the USA

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truthmonster00 avatar
Truth Monster
Community Member
3 years ago

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Dirty Canadian secret. If you're undocumented (or in Canadian nomenclature 'irregular') you have to pay for your care privately. You don't get the "free healthcare." Imagine if hospitals in the USA noped out of providing care to approximately 12 million undocumented.

bp_10 avatar
WilvanderHeijden
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

US hospitals nope out on documented citizens if they can't afford their bills anymore. Don't try to make it look like the US for profit healthcare system has any advantages to the Canadian or European system. People dying because they can't afford treatment or medicines is a reality in the US, not in Canada or Europe. The same goes for people going bankrupt on medical bills or people that have to decline medical care just because they can't afford it. It wasn't too long ago that an old man killed his wife and next committed suicide in the US just because they couldn't pay their medicals bills and were afraid to end up homeless. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/elderly-couple-found-dead-in-apparent-murder-suicide-left-notes-about-high-medical-bills/

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truthmonster00 avatar
Truth Monster
Community Member
3 years ago

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Canada, the Whitest Nation in the New World. The only nation to pull off a system similar to other white nations in Europe. Interesting.

leodomitrix avatar
maddi_050203 avatar
LOttawa
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Yes we pay higher taxes for our health care but it's still not has much as some of those monthly insurance payments I have seen some people pay and we don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars hanging over our heads. I much prefer paying a few hundreds dollar a year (which I don't see since it's taken off my pay cheque every two weeks). Also, if you have health care insurance thru your employer (for prescriptions and things like that), you pay less taxes (at least in my province).

onemessylady avatar
Aunt Messy
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

We live in the States. Our health insurance for two retired people would be well over $2000.00 a MONTH. That's for two healthy people who are minimal meds. If we moved to BC.....as of January 1, NO ONE pays health insurance premiums.

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theresacecil avatar
Leafless
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Have you ever seen anyone in Europe or Canada protest for our system?

felicia_3 avatar
Felicia Dale
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Well, yes, but their complaints were relatively minor and mainly involved long wait times for elective procedures that weren't life threatening. Compared to the US, that's nothing.

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bronnie69 avatar
Bron
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Australia is similar to Canada, except there’s no such thing as insurance through employers. If we want, and can afford to, we can buy private health insurance. Sometimes it covers all costs, sometimes not. Yes, I do pay through my taxes but so what? Even though I hardly ever go to the doctor (once in the past 10 years), I’d rather contribute to the health and well-being of even the conservatives than contribute to the disgusting salaries of insurance executives etc.

deannawoods avatar
deanna woods
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am an American with lots of health problems and no health insurance. It is very difficult for me to go to the doctor or even the emergency room. I have had an abscessed tooth and instead of getting a root canal and saving the tooth, I am getting it pulled because that is much cheaper. I have anxiety and depression and if it weren't for a local mental health program, I wouldn't be able to get my medications. I understand that not every health care system is perfect, but at least some of these other countries try to do right by all their citizens. All American health insurance carriers seem to do is lie about how great their coverage is.

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

From what I have heard, dentistry is different than medical care, even in Canada, and is not included in their universal healthcare. Can a Canadian answer definitively? Thanks!

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Becca Gizmo the Squirrel
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Yeah I owe probably around $8000 just from ER bills from before I had insurance. Now I'm on medicaid because my husband is disabled but I still have to pay $180 a month to see my doctor. The whole insurance/no insurance situation in America is ridiculous. We should be more like Canada. In a lot of ways.

laurahabermehl avatar
Laura Maeflower
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Wait...you have to pay to see a doctor? Like, even if nothing is wrong with you?

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Parmeisan
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am alive today because of the Canadian health care system. If I lived in the states and knew I'd have to pay $300 for a visit to the ER (a quick google search puts the average at $1,389, but even if I knew it would be much less), I would have told myself that funny feeling was probably nothing, there wasn't even any pain, I was fine. And then I would have died from the pulmonary embolism that it actually was.

parmeisan avatar
Parmeisan
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have had a lot of health issues in my life. I've been on blood thinners and getting blood tests every week. I've been sent to so many different specialists for so many different tests. Sometimes I wait 2 or 3 months, sometimes I wait closer to a year. I've also been to the ER a number of times, where they let you in immediately for some symptoms and you wait up to 8 hours for others. In both cases, you're probably in for 12 hours of waiting between nurses coming in and asking questions, having blood or urine tests done, doctors coming in and asking more questions, special tests being ordered, etc etc. But they have always taken good care of me, been prompt when urgency is called for, never hesitated to call for tests or other procedures (e.g. dialysis), never made me question the overall competency of my carers (although I *have* had call to question the competency of certain individual doctors), and the most I've ever paid was for medication which is not always covered.

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ed_25 avatar
Electric Ed
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

"pre-existing clause/condition" - wait what does that mean? Its written so it sounds like the health insurance deny paying for the treatment? Someone from the USA pleas explain.

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MrTree1779
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

"Pre-existing condition" is a term used by medical insurance companies to avoid paying the bills, and a way for them to force the patient to pay them. It assumes that the patient has a condition which will require more medical care. If the medical insurance company were to be responsible for the costs, they would pay more. So, to pay as little as possible, the medical insurance company says that they will not be responsible for many illnesses which Americans have, and refuse to pay for those illnesses. It is a way for our medical insurance companies to be greedy and cruel, and win in court.

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Kevin Hickey
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Medicare for All will cost $30 Trillion over the next ten years!! That's always the headline. They never tell you that under our current system we'll be paying a lot more than that over the next ten years.

ljamie04 avatar
Weishaar Jamie
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Health care is not, and never was, suppose to be a business or about making money. America is SO greedy. Nothing gets done without it profiting someone. There are cures for cancers (and other diseases) but, far too much money is made by those in control of current treatments. As things are, we will never be healthy. There's too much money is making and keeping is sick! I will never understand how those people who profit from illness and death can live with themselves. It WILL come back to them. No system is perfect but, at least some other countries put people over profit.

mascha-claessens avatar
Mascha Claessens
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

This is a problem in many countries (though the US might be one of the worst, definitely). I'm pretty sure healthcare is much better where I live (mandatory health insurance, really lowering financial risks for people who get/are ill and/or in an accident), but there are still too many people profiting off health care, unfortunately: insurance companies, hospital boards, big pharma, etc...

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PaulV
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Thanks for nothing. His words are virtually worthless. He needs to go the warpath to fixing things.

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febfifteen2006 avatar
PaulV
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I think I've seen this guy on TV before, saying the same thing. It doesn't even matter anymore. His lies have taken root, and he'll have to do a lot more to undo those lies and more yet to atone for them. All the money he collected for these lies is ill-gotten. How many millions have died because of the American medical "system"? This is a crying shame.

christophebeunens avatar
Christophe Beunens
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Some figures of Europe : When not working, you pay in Luxembour, monthly +/- 110 EUR for health insurance (when working, your employer pays it). a Dr visit costs about 40 EUR (generalist), and you get +/- 80 % of all medical costs paid back (in case of hospital visit or serious sickness, up to 100%). There are no shortages nor priviledged users who get better service.

justforfacebook avatar
ƒιѕн
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

My ambulance ride I cant afford just got turned over to a debt collector.

laurahabermehl avatar
Laura Maeflower
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I think it's such an awful thing to have to decide whether you can afford an ambulance in an emergency. It's really life or death and in America you have to literally weigh the costs and risks before you call! Here in Canada you don't think twice, you just call if anything seems wrong.

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b l a n c
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

i had no idea americans thought this about canada's health system, and i live in canada! it's very surprising actually, i didn't know somebody lied about all this

patriciaryan avatar
Patricia Ryan
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I lived in Canada (gave birth to my kids there), and found the care for routine pediatric care was good - high quality and free (or cheap). If you have cancer, orthopedic problems, illness requiring multiple surgeries, the Canadian system has long wait times and sometimes such slow treatment that problems get worse or not treated at all. I have brought 6 family members to the US for back and hip surgery, and radiology services not available in Canada. Aunt had breast tumor that was not seen by the imaging services available to her. My brother-in-law had to call an ambulance to get follow up treatment from his colon cancer surgeon who would tell him when he was on call at a Toronto hospital. My nephew (26)was told his hip was inoperable- would need cane! He had surgery in US and is a personal trainer. Single Payer is "free", and decent general care. Problems that US citizens would expect to treat promptly and completely are not handled well, or at all, in Canadian system.

kjorn avatar
Kjorn
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

the guy is complaint about crappy internet and bad coffee after spending 11 in Intensive care?

joicain avatar
Yayaboobo
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

This is just one industry. Think of the policies for implementing innovative best practices and effective, environmental, ethical, economical, educational that could be happening all over but for greed. The greater good is a thing of fantasy more and more. Many of these people practice the ideals found in Atlas Shrugged which basically says there's no greater freedom than to be free to reject humanitarian causes, mainly charity. Something like that. Scary.

el_dee avatar
El Dee
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have always been amazed that Americans believe that a highly expensive health care system that excludes you when you most need it (your off sick and not being paid) and even when you can make use of it you have deductibles and they are massive. Where I am we have free at the point of use, health, dental and opticians. Prescriptions are free too. I can't understand how they've been conned into somehow thinking that's a bad idea..

kennykulbiski avatar
Kenny Kulbiski
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Didn't get through all the comments but I didn't see anyone expressing surprise.

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

What a bunch of lies!!! 82% of their COVID deaths were seniors in nursing homes! And conditions were horrible before that!!! People be were sitting in soiled diapers and clothes, dehydrated and hungry! Don't believe me? Look it up! Single payer proponents say they "won't push granny off a cliff," but in Canada they treat the aged in ways that would make you cry if it was an animal shelter. Think getting old is a long time away? It comes sooner than you think!

katehargreaves678 avatar
columbokateUK
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Every other first world country is wrong but the USA is right then ?🤔 thanks for letting us all know 👍

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davenyc88 avatar
Dave P
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Not about his data, however after leaving the industry he first worked as a lobyyist of big pharma, then he took a job paying twice as much for political organization to lobby for nationalized healthcare. He did a 180 after taking his new high paying job and currenty earns more than he did as a health care executive between all his lobbying contacts. Not going into details on his data and claims, but questioning the man's credibility

romenriel avatar
Eliška Hůlková
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I am from Czech Republic and I want to say that I am insanely grateful for our system of health insurance. As a student below 26, I don't have to contribute yet, but I am more than ready to do so as soon as I will have a job. Not everything in our health care system is perfect - naturally - but it works and is affordable.

vicd avatar
Vic D
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

As a Canadian I used to complain about waiting time in our health system, today after seeing how covid affected the different health systems around the world I would say we have one of the best system, they even managed to improve some of the services during this pandemic. The most covid cases registered in my province where in private nursing home ! The Private did worst than public, buy cheap medical supply, underpaid health workers they quickly got overwhelmed by covid cases !

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Country Nana - Forever We the North said something similar. I feel like US is the opposite - all seniors get Medicare. May people should live in Canada and retire in US. (I know it doesn't actually work like that.)

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Hiker Chick
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I have insurance through my work (that I pay for) but I will decline treatment if I have an expensive illness. My kids are adults now and I don't want them burdened with my debt, but I will end up homeless if I end up In the hospital for more than a few days. So, my choices are just die of natural causes or get treated but declare bankruptcy and probably lose my house. Payment plans are no longer workable, even at public hospitals, as I found out after my daughter's ambulance ride and hospitalization.

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-lays-bare-poor-conditions-in-canadas-nursing-homes-11592996400

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06-canada-worst-elderly-home-coronavirus.html

leahiniowa avatar
Country Nana
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

https://www.aplaceformom.com/blog/8-02-16-rethinking-health-care-for-canadian-seniors/

bojo30 avatar
slackjack
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

The difference is the systems that run it. As opposed to Canada, everything the US Fed Govt controls turns to s**t. (Prob get downvoted, but that's my observation.)

stanflouride avatar
Stannous Flouride
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Like the Postal Service that allows you to put a 55-cent stamp on an envelope and have it delivered safely to the most isolated places in the country in under 14 days? The system that the anti-government folks have saddled with a requirement that all pensions be completely covered for 75 years in advance and yet still makes a profit? (btw- These same people have no problem with corporations taking peoples' pension funds and then declaring bankruptcy to cheat them out of it)

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Jaded Queen
Community Member
3 years ago

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Either way people are dying. Earth is finally healing. We need more people to die and make robots to do work(i know a long way, but putting all resources and minds to this goal, i dont think it should take that much time). So we can all have mansions and our private islands. 8 billion people just isn't feasible. Stop procreating you idiots . And thank covid. I know it is painful. But if population is not kept under check this is wwhta happens

chimesstreet avatar
Tabitha L
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I understand the point you are making. (I had a bumper sticker in high school that said "Save the Planet, Kill Yourself") But the people that are dying of coronavirus are, by and large, not people who are procreating. So the deaths will be a small blip in humanity. Also, there is enough wealth in the world for everyone to have a mansion right now. All 8 billion of us. The only thing preventing it is selfishness and greed.

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lara
Community Member
3 years ago

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I have three friends born and raised in Canada. Two of whom are now US citizens and that "positive" view of the Canadian health "care" system is not one they share. I think that the phrase they used was draconian bureaucracy.

anitac_ avatar
Mme de Poppadom
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Are they themselves doctors, and have to do the paperwork? Or, are they medical advisors for government healthcare policy? Otherwise, I (and likely every Canadian on this site) have no idea what you're talking about. When I think of "bureaucracy" I think of the pre-approval system of managed care, or the thousands of insurers to review and choose from, plus the billing system that the U.S., in all their socialist-hating glory, gives the illusion of freedom of choice and free market capitalism.

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CORLEONE
Community Member
3 years ago

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You write America is better than Canada. Canada is in America my doctor friend. When you write America you mean USA. right???? school gives you a job but it's not making you intelligent, sorry...

m2crows avatar
Mike Crow
Community Member
3 years ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

It is true that Canada, Mexico and Argentina are part of America (North and South) and the USA is the United States OF America, but in today’s culture America and Americans usually refer to the USA

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truthmonster00 avatar
Truth Monster
Community Member
3 years ago

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Dirty Canadian secret. If you're undocumented (or in Canadian nomenclature 'irregular') you have to pay for your care privately. You don't get the "free healthcare." Imagine if hospitals in the USA noped out of providing care to approximately 12 million undocumented.

bp_10 avatar
WilvanderHeijden
Community Member
3 years ago (edited) DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

US hospitals nope out on documented citizens if they can't afford their bills anymore. Don't try to make it look like the US for profit healthcare system has any advantages to the Canadian or European system. People dying because they can't afford treatment or medicines is a reality in the US, not in Canada or Europe. The same goes for people going bankrupt on medical bills or people that have to decline medical care just because they can't afford it. It wasn't too long ago that an old man killed his wife and next committed suicide in the US just because they couldn't pay their medicals bills and were afraid to end up homeless. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/elderly-couple-found-dead-in-apparent-murder-suicide-left-notes-about-high-medical-bills/

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truthmonster00 avatar
Truth Monster
Community Member
3 years ago

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Canada, the Whitest Nation in the New World. The only nation to pull off a system similar to other white nations in Europe. Interesting.

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