Michael Moore Tries To Prove Women Are Better Than Men, Gets Brilliantly Shut Down By A Woman
There are plenty of badass women but Academy-Award winning filmmaker Michael Moore thinks there aren’t any bad ones. “No women ever invented an atomic bomb, built a smokestack, initiated a Holocaust, melted the polar ice caps or organized a school shooting,” Moore tweeted. Missing logic in his men vs. women claims, writer Jessica Ellis wrote an insightful rebuttal to Moore, and her Twitter response quickly went viral.
While attacking the patriarchy, Moore suggested that women are better than men in living up to universal moral standards. “My initial response was actually very personal,” Ellis, who considers herself a feminist, told Bored Panda. “I had been struggling with anxiety issues and going to therapy, where I realized I thought the fact that I had dark thoughts sometimes made me a bad person. I had also come to realize that part of the reason I felt this gender gap is that women are raised on a doctrine of purity and that Moore (who I respect greatly as a filmmaker) was furthering that concept. When you are taught that all women are naturally sweet and wonderful, you can feel extra-extra crazy if you feel anger or depression or anxiety.”
And even though ladies have not held powerful political positions as much as men, Ellis perfectly points out why they struggle with making ethically just decisions, too. “It’s bad for women’s mental health to be held to an unrealistic purity standard.” After all, we’re all human! Scroll down to read her gender equality reasoning and let us know your thoughts about it in the comments.
More info: Twitter
Academy-Award winning filmmaker Michael Moore tried to convince Twitter that there aren’t any bad women
But one lady wasn’t buying it
The internet quickly backed her up
Ellis would also like to add one more thing. “While I stand behind the point I was making, the tone is difficult on the internet, and I felt vaguely ashamed of speaking to a documentarian I respect so vehemently. On the other hand, this is hardly my first fiery rant about feminism, on Twitter or elsewhere, and I’m glad people connected to the message and hopefully understood that my anger was coming from a place of wanting to protect women from the dreaded pedestal, and not as an attack on [anyone].”
Point. Set. Match. Jessica Ellis is the winner by a landslide... Mr Moore... go home, stay there. You're done.
Queen Cercei Lannister ... another example of evil women :)
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Some of us are naturally blessed with a working 'STFU' gene, which tends to keep us out of trouble. Unfortunately Michael M. either lacks one altogether, or doesn't know how to apply it when necessary. 00-spitefu...82c6c3.gif 
One does not end up with his weighty influence or weighty body with a functioning STFU gene.
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Absolutely. I've been saying this for years. Women are not better nor worse than men. We are human and very flawed.
Queen Isabella of Castile started the Spanish Inquisition! Don't forget her! She burned, killed, and tortured hundreds of people in the 18th century.
The reign of Isabella the Catholic is from the fifteenth century you are illiterate
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I know that women, really no one should be proud of these things but I say amen sister. We are responsible for some things that we shouldn’t exactly be proud of but yeah
The problem is that, historically, women are always being shoved into molds that represent absolutes. We are neither all the demon Lillith, on the one hand, or the Virgin Mary, on the other. We're just people. Numerically, I think we have committed fewer of the world's atrocities, but that's due to circumstances, not nature.
Funny you should mention Lilith, whose mythology does not always make her a demon, but a first wife for Adam who refused to be subservient to him...
Load More Replies... Yeah we really can suck serious a*s. I've always found men are far better friends and company on the whole. Personal preference really. We suck as differently and equally as we succeed and excel.
I agree wholeheartedly with you, Trisha Dragon.
Load More Replies... I appreciate her posts; I was not aware of some of these facts, like the school shooter. She also shouldn't feel bad about calling MM out. He's a big boy -- a really big boy. He can take the criticism.
Moore virtue signaling as a 3rd- Wave Feminist to remain relevant. Failed. The Left eating itself.
yeah! that's good. being feminist's not mean being better than men it's just mean being the same.
Ok so if Michael Moore said the OPPOSITE, all these women would STILL be at his throat!!! Take what he said as a compliment towards women, people! He's trying to say that it's usually men who are responsible for most of the evil in this world. Shouldn't that be what these women WANT to hear? He's right anyways. It IS mostly men who do these bad things. It's just a fact.
The problem is the "trying". He failed at that trying. He didn't say "usually". And also, he was wrong, as the response from this women pointed out SPECIFIC cases in which he was wrong.
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About ten years ago, I heard two men talking about how the world would be a better place if women were in charge. I rolled my eyes and wished there was a way that I (a woman) could interrupt (that they'd listen to me) and tell them to do us a favor and stop patronizing us with placement on such a lofty pillar. Women are human beings, not soft-hearted Mothers who would rule with a kind, fair, and benevolent hand.
These dudes have clearly never been around a female sports league. The woman are VICIOUS, even at the highest levels. Kevin Dineen coached Olympic women's hockey and said he's been around the game his whole life and thought he'd heard all the trash talking...until he coached the women. He said they were on another level.
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Been saying it for years. Men and Women are two sides of the same human coin. To not give either side credit for good or evil is insulting and foolish.
I was ALLLLL about this, until she apologized for her perceived "tone." If you can't even correct someone (regardless of who he is) without apologizing for a tone he may or may not infer, haven't you sort of negated your whole feminist point?
No you haven't. Nothing is in absolutes. She understood the power of words and that not many will interpret with wisdom. It was nothing personal she had to dissociate the person from the message while still maintaining her stand. There is nothing in that but a lot of maturity, and discernment which a vast majority of people lack.
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Michael Moore is a true justice warrior. His statement was beautiful, but she is right. Maybe they'll make a movie together. It must be an eye opener for him. It was for me.
oftentimes, justice warriors are all about identity politics, and are intolerant of others' opinions
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She is not kidding. Women do have dark sides. Anyone who does not believe this is a fool.
I bet he wishes he'd done a quick Google search b4 making such grandiose claims. I'm opposite ; I believe most atrocities are done in the name of women either as appeasement or by direct direction. The old saying about "behind every gr8 man blah blah. What about the evil ones?
feminism is about making women seem equal not better people need to realize that
I would like to lead the internetz in a round of applause for Ms. Ellis.
Here point is brilliantly delivered, but over all I agree with Michael Moore's point. For the most part the vast majority of murderers, corporate polluters, military contractors, wall street financiers as well as high level drug dealers, corrupt politicians, brutal dictators are men. Why this is so is a far more important question. To assume some sort of biological differences in our moral development and cognitive patterns would certainly be a more detailed study.
I will be very surprised to learn Mr. Moore is upset by this "takedown." I'm sure he'll accept the lesson with his usual awkward grace.
Women are human...we make good and bad choices, just like all humans. Ellis is right. Don't count women out on anything, good or bad. We do make choices in our lives. Our choices, our lives. Get real, Mr. Moore.
There seems to be a lot of hate for Michael Moore in these postings. Let me just say that his intentions are absolutely in the right place. And while he is sometimes prone to hyperbole or presenting a skewed perspective to make a point, its always with the best of intentions. He cares immensely about people and about social justice. Is he perfect in his message? No, of course not. Few of us are. Just remember that he is on your side when you throw your vitriol in his direction.
Nope. This is the internet. Pick a side and stay 100% on it at all times, and hate anybody who's not totally with you in every way with every thought and action. Perhaps you didn't get the memo.
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Apparently, at least one person did :-) The thing is, I think he was relaying a thought that others have expressed at other times.
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So now we are competing on which gender is worst? This world is going to s**t.
Michael Moore is a self loathing human turd. Go back to making love to fried chicken.
I agree and disagree...I'm a woman btw. It's almost laughable and tiring how men really can't say any thing right. They really should just not talk abut women. If they say women are bad, they will get a new a$$hole ripped by the nearest woman. Same if they say women are good. There's no escape! Men: don't talk about women, good or bad. Or periods. If you open a door for a woman you might hear about it. If you dont, you also might. I'm a strong woman who competes in boxing. But I appreciate when guys open doors...and I say thank you.
If a man says "women are good", he deserves criticism. If a man says "women are bad", he deserves criticism. Same goes when the women are talking about men. That's the whole point. Women are not all alike. We're human. That was her point.
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michael moore made his fortune off of liberal followers by pretending to be an ultra-liberal himself, yet he's a huge capitalist.
If you become successful at business you instantly become a huge capitalist? At exactly what income level do your fundamental positions change?
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I don't think it's anything to be proud of that the first modern school shooter was a female
I am pretty sure she wasn't proud of it. She was saying that women are as capable of evil deeds as men.
Load More Replies... How can you tell when Michael Moore is saying something moronic? His mouth is open.
all the research he does for his films yet he cant stop and think before he tweets? ffs
He did think. He clearly didn't finish the thought, but he did think.
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Jessica is a genius and she did it so eloquently. The comments, though....(SyrMerlin's). I disagree. Yes, we've been in power for a lot less time, but it is scientifically proven that men are more aggressive and violent due to that lovely little hormone testosterone. Not to say women are incapable of evil, because that's pure baloney, but there is a difference. Women tend to engage in cold war rather than out-and-out violence. Just a look at the evening news will show, even though women make up a majority of the population, we commit far less violent crimes.
and they had to go back FORTY YEARS to find a female school shooter, when a new young male does it every week.
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Now if only so many other feminists could actually do what their title says they do.
As I've always thought... "Son-of-bitchism" is not related to the gender but to the person.
I'm sure he meant well, but it would be better to view morality through the "human" lense, instead of the man/woman lense- we are all one human race, and simultaneously, our acts of goodness or evil speak louder than our genders.
I agree. Women are full human beings, and as such they are fully sinful and need redemption as much as men, and it is offered equally to both sexes by God. Imposing purity on women and girls is both unrealistic and unhealthy, an impossible burden to bear. Good for her.
There have been plenty of women throughout history who have left their mark, same as any males who have done as much. Even just thinking of the ones like "Bloody Mary" & Margaret Thatcher, it's not hard to see that even women with power could be completely insane or just utterly heartless when it comes down to thinking of others less fortunate. There are probably far more examples, but my mind is totally blank (from lack of sleep over the past 3 days). I think I've made my point, though... 😅
All stereotypes are bad. I have met a number of evil, devious women, but given the condition of the world as it is now, I think it is time that women take control for a century or so. Women are still oppressed the world over, it was a situation perpetrated by men. Frankly, having traveled to many countries of the world, male privilege is on an even par if not significantly greater than white privilege. For every female atrocity that you cite Ms. Ellis, I am sure someone, including me, if I was so predisposed can cite 20 more committed by the male of the species. So young lady, your point is well taken and I would agree with you to some extent, but I think that perhaps in time, you will see that women are not often really placed on a pedestal. Spend some time exploring poverty in developing countries, or examining the terror and torture, women go through in war torn countries (of which there are many), genocide and rape as weapons of war. Keep writing and thinking be a leader.
Literally right TF now they are prosecuting to girls for planning a school shooting. There are plenty of evil women out there.
Ilse Koch was hung in front of those she had tortured for years. The "B***h of Bucanwald"
Well she is right. World can only see the equation between men and women as the result of three perceptions. Either they are equal or the one is better than other mostly that part were men r better . Which is a buttload of c**p. But what about the differences between us. What about a person's choices of making mistakes nd learning nd growing. Nobody ever wants to acknowledge the differences. The truth is we can't compare them or label them. Coz we all have different turfs. But with women the so called 'goodness' is forced upn them. They r not allowed to make mistakes, not allow to have a opinion, not allowed to rebel. Just coz we have vaginas. I personally know countless stories of oppression nd brainwashing through out history flowing down to the present. The world is just a s****y place unable to change.
YES! This! I think Michael Moore meant well, but he has some education to catch up on and Ms Ellis is an awesome teacher. Good for her!
Personally I hate it seeing feminists ignite a fight because there is no other way to settle anything and then throw a punch at a man and when he punches back they scream NEVER PUNCH A WOMAN like what the f**k if you want equal rights you need to accept the bad things that come with it too.
I think the guy had good intentions - but the road to hell is paved with them. Good work Jessica Ellis. I'd personally add to this list my favourite female monster, Elizabeth Báthory.
I appreciate acts of feminism done right. This is one example where a woman proved a man wrong but in the best way possible. Women have caused less disasters but are not less dangerous. There was a serial killer who killed 7 people who was a woman.
One thing she didn't point out and I didn't see it in the comments, either, is the choices women make. It is really sad to think that the choices that mothers make are seen as so inconsequential. Women buy disposable cleaning supplies and containers that pollute. Women are often drivers of the life conveniences that pollute the air, land, and water and add to climate change. Women have also often chosen not to take stands that would have prevented some atrocities in the world. I have never understood why women put up with so much in the last few centuries, knowing that they are dooming their daughters to put up with the same. These are some of the areas where women may be even more culpable as men. Everyone is saying, "Yes, women did these things, but it was mostly men." Women do some bad things on average much more so than men, but it's just not as grandiose. I've never tried to relay this aloud. I've never heard anyone mention it ever. Why not?
it would be nice if one side was cleaner than the other, to deny the points that show darkness comes from both sides is the same as saying mankind has no flaws
While Cain probably doesn't have an equal among women, neither does Jesus. That said, as is obvious, women (like men) are not cranked out to any specification. There are wonder women, and wonder men. There are vile monsters on either side of the genetic isle. The challenge of mortal life is the same for both: discern good and reject evil. The difficulty of mortal life is the same for both. The *distribution* of decisions made is NOT equal. While we each choose for just ourselves, having an EFFECT on others, but NOT OPERATING THEIR AGENCY, womankind is generally more righteous than mankind. Where good is not rewarded, there tends to be more women involved than men. Where degradation is not celebrated, there tends to be more men there than women. Still, we're all where we are by our choices. So, guys and gals, CHOOSE knowing you eat the fruit of the trees you nurture, not always now in mortal life, but definitely forever.
I adore Michael Moore too (and put him on a pedestal) but I must agree with this most erudite woman!
Hedy Lamarr patented the idea of "frequency hopping" which is used in cell phones, wi-fi, torpedo guidance, and smart bombs.
What does she have to do with this post in any capacity?
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I hate to be the one to point this out but PoC already know white women aren’t saints, there are plenty of dead PoC, who are dead solely because of the little bit of power some white women had, which was the ability to place blame on other people. Not that WoC are saints either, we haven’t committed any “mass” atrocities because we haven’t gotten into enough positions of power to do it, (although Condoleeza Rice springs to mind). He’s wrong because even the slightest bit of power is enough to corrupt some people regardless of race, or gender.
The inescapable fact is that women are much better suited to running things than men are, and so they have been doing exactly that since time immemorial. The hand that rocks the cradle is the hand that rules the world, and men are mostly hapless drones, at least the straight ones.
That being said, I've seen the way women treat other women, and they have an enormous capacity for ruthlessness.
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Holy C**P! While I DO NOT respect michael moore enough to even capitalize his name, I'll go one better to say that I abhor his very existence as a human being! Perhaps as a byproduct of a human eating and expelling waste (get my drift?), but nothing higher. moore has proven himself to be a bottom feeder, incapable of independent thought except when he capitalizes on misery. Witness his movie about the school shooting in Columbine for but one example. He hasn't produced anything else of merit and certainly nothing that excites a population to want to see because it doesn't involve misery and heartbreak. My advice to moore is to try and make a documentary on, say, the migrating penguin or hummingbirds. People like stuff like that and NOT so much about his juvenile slamming vitriolic rants against the NRA. But back to the point. In my life I have witnessed both the good and bad sides of women; both in my personal life as well public figures. So I can see the points Ms. Ellis points out.
Just wondering why Jess had to bring her vagina into the convo, nobody else mentioned it...and yes, Mr Moore was trying to make women seem better than men, but you guys shut that down in a hurry....good work; I guess.
LOL. Moore exposes some good things but he's such a DOOFUS at times that a lot of people can't take him seriously.
Been saying it for years. Women and Men are two sides of the same human coin. We are equally capable of good or evil. Pretending otherwise is both foolish and insulting.
Let's not forget https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Nyiramasuhuko Pauline Nyiramasuhuko, a Feminist, government Minister who was convicted of genocide as well as genocidal rape. Victims were raped, tortured, killed, and their bodies were burned. Nyiramasuhuko told militiamen, "before you kill the women, you need to rape them". In another incident, she ordered her men to take cans of gasoline from her car and use them to burn a group of women to death, leaving a surviving rape victim as a witness.
Ma Anand Sheela, Manager of the Rajneeshpuram community in Oregon, was responsible for the biggest act of bio terrorism in America and tried to have multiple people assassinated.
You want to read about an evil woman? https://www.medicalbag.com/grey-matter/the-legend-of-elizabeth-bathory-the-blood-countess/article/472831/
Brilliant ... the only reason women aren't widely recognized as bad actors is because they haven't been given as many opportunities to commit atrocities. We are totally f*cked! Either that, or we have to get off our fat *sses and make sure GOOD people are elected and promoted and get the chance to good for us all.
Cleopatra. Yes, that one, as in Mark Anthony and Elizabeth Taylor. Had most of her male relatives assassinated. Not a nice lady...
I like her response. When I read that women are so good I thought of two women in my life. My mother and my doctor. Two horrible females that know how to manipulate and keep their innocence but when exposed they are dangerous! So yeah! we are the human race and we always want to separate to indicate. That is all. I like the man in the Matrix who said humans are like a virus! I agree with that character's dialog on screen about us humans.
Feminism I Wil get behind and support at full-tilt. Proper Feminism! (note the pronoun punctuation). Equality before preference. Write that Down!
I don't understand - what pronoun punctuation? Do you know what a pronoun is?
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Michael Moore, like everybody, should REALLY research his facts before he starts typing. Seriously.....
Michael Moore is now, and has always been an idiot. He does, however, have SOME redeeming qualities, though I can't recall what they are...
Although he was proven wrong, wasn't he just trying to pay a compliment to women?
The woman who has probably done the most damage to the USA was Madalyn Murray O'Hair, founder of American Atheists, the first major hate group to come along after the KKK. They and their offshoots have done more to disrupt the civility and tolerance in the USA than any other group - maybe excepting Supreme Court Justice Brennan who decided to call flag burning "speech" in 1982.
To refute Michael's claims, it actually was a woman who gave birth to and raised him.....enough said. Or, maybe it was something in the Flint, Michigan water that made Michael so delusional.
I think she put that most succinctly. As for Michael Moore, Cashew calls him democratic. That's a laugh. He spits on a referendum that went against his wishes. He's not a democrat, he wants to be an autocrat.
Jesus, she went all in. I don't even like feminist but s**t, how are you coming back from that?
both are stupid. those women were acting within a male system of control. it's unknown how women would run the world because men have always done so. the fact that women can be bad too is totally irrelevant and proves neither of these attention seekers right.
You are absolutely wrong. Men have NOT always run the world. Hunter-gatherers (which is what most people were prior to about the 1600s) were egalitarian societies to the best of our knowledge. Also, there have been many matriarchal societies, many of them in the US not that long ago. Women being made to be subservient to men is a NEW thing, not old (and seems to get worse on average with every passing century). It's sad that so many women grow up with this myth that that fighting or equality means fighting for something we've never had. We are fighting for something we almost always had, but was taken away quite recently.
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oooppps my earlier comments contained a couple of typos. I apologize. Nonetheless I am curious as to what people believe causes the majority (but certainly not all) of evil actions to come from men?
I imagine the original tweet to b a sarcastic response to a typically worked up feminist who bashed men for being responsible for everything
Oh please. Your comment is just total supposition and wild generalisation. Next time, why not put forward a relevant fact.
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Never underestimate the ability of someone to ingest an entire Podiatrist's patient list.
Michael Moore is a joke.He fights against wealthy people and capitalism,but is wealthy and has a house with dozens of rooms.That is the definition of hypocrisy.He is full of s**t
At exactly what level of money is he supposed to start giving the rest away to charity? Whatever level you choose will still seem like an absolute luxury fortune to someone in a 3rd world slum. What you consider "too much" is just an arbitrary line in the sand.
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The crisco sweating underwear stain needs to let go of the toilet rim and just swirl away!
Can't even try to say something good about women anymore. Granted he was incorect, but damn.
Like seriously when men say, “Oh women don’t do anything, they don’t contribute to the world.” (And I know that men taje part in this) But women should just be like “Who the f**k MADE you? Did y’all give birth? Nah, b***h.”
Bravo. Feminism and Masculism are so last century. We are all just human.
Okay so has she commented anything about Anita Sarkeesian yet?? No?? She should.
Let's enjoy this moment of peace before the paid commenters come to fight their gender war and downvote this comment to the Abyss.
Never forget the difference between history and mythology.
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This is insane. She seems to be arguing for the right for women to be a******s. Nobody is denying women the right to be a******s. but Moore correctly points out that only a tiny percent of murderous a******s are women. to say there isn't a difference is insane.
The "Better or Worse" debate is obviously flawed and ignorant... But men are certainly more dangerous. We naturally produce more testosterone, which does cause an increase in anger, violence, competitiveness, etc. So just from a biological perspective, we are more prone to doing destructive things. In terms of morality, though, and choosing right from wrong, that's entirely dependent on the individual. Women have their vices just like men do. A lot of it, also, is cultural. So much factors into our thoughts and behavior that to assign a higher morality to any gender, race, ethnicity, nationality, etc., would be wildly ignorant. Also -- I think some men just take these stances because they think it'll win them points with women. That, in-and-of itself, is for creepers. I respect women fully, but I'm not ever going to blindly defend them without cause. Too many Sarah Huckabee-Sanders' out there using their womanhood to normalize the same bad things men do. We all have our battles.
To the people saying "this is feminism done right!" Um no. There is no such thing as a "right" kind of feminism. It is just feminism. I'm glad she told off Michael Moore about that since his way of thinking makes us women seem like we are just some monolith who all think and act the same. Instead of actually seeing us as individual human beings who are capable of making the choice to either be good or bad just like men can be. Which of course was the point of this woman telling him off.
You need to look up the definition of 'monolith'.
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Mary Walton doesn't really fit there. She didn't invent smokestacks. She invented a method of deflection for the emission. The industrial chimneys that she patented on were used since the 18th century.
Uh.. women have no "Ego Problems"? Wow. You must not go out much. I have met an equal amount of men and women with massive Ego Problems. Also, the fact that they weren't as "loud" doesn't excuse the evil they did. Look up the Witch of Buchenwald.
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'Sadly intense debates would be needed every 28 days'? Seriously? What ridiculous notion do you have about women's menstrual cycles? That we all go a little loopy when we have our period? That women menstruate their whole lives? Trotting out that old chestnut is demeaning to women - and adds nothing to your argument.
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Not the time, not the place. I know you're tryin' to be funny, but it ain't working. Sorry bud. Welcome to the abyss of the downvote.
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Read the email you get. Follow the instructions. Roaming around telling the internet you want to unsubscribe is rather useless in the ACTUAL unsubscribe process.
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If you look through history, there are just more men in power mentioned. Just because there are more examples, doesn't mean women are better.
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Wait. What. Attempting to understand or comment has broken my mind. Your assumption that the woman that killed all those Jews was... Jewish... what? Never mind. Any further attempts to understand you logic and my brain just might 'splode like an over cooked cannoli.
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Point. Set. Match. Jessica Ellis is the winner by a landslide... Mr Moore... go home, stay there. You're done.
Queen Cercei Lannister ... another example of evil women :)
Load More Replies... Some of us are naturally blessed with a working 'STFU' gene, which tends to keep us out of trouble. Unfortunately Michael M. either lacks one altogether, or doesn't know how to apply it when necessary. 00-spitefu...82c6c3.gif
One does not end up with his weighty influence or weighty body with a functioning STFU gene.
Load More Replies... Absolutely. I've been saying this for years. Women are not better nor worse than men. We are human and very flawed.
Queen Isabella of Castile started the Spanish Inquisition! Don't forget her! She burned, killed, and tortured hundreds of people in the 18th century.
The reign of Isabella the Catholic is from the fifteenth century you are illiterate
Load More Replies... I know that women, really no one should be proud of these things but I say amen sister. We are responsible for some things that we shouldn’t exactly be proud of but yeah
The problem is that, historically, women are always being shoved into molds that represent absolutes. We are neither all the demon Lillith, on the one hand, or the Virgin Mary, on the other. We're just people. Numerically, I think we have committed fewer of the world's atrocities, but that's due to circumstances, not nature.
Funny you should mention Lilith, whose mythology does not always make her a demon, but a first wife for Adam who refused to be subservient to him...
Load More Replies... Yeah we really can suck serious a*s. I've always found men are far better friends and company on the whole. Personal preference really. We suck as differently and equally as we succeed and excel.
I agree wholeheartedly with you, Trisha Dragon.
Load More Replies... I appreciate her posts; I was not aware of some of these facts, like the school shooter. She also shouldn't feel bad about calling MM out. He's a big boy -- a really big boy. He can take the criticism.
Moore virtue signaling as a 3rd- Wave Feminist to remain relevant. Failed. The Left eating itself.
yeah! that's good. being feminist's not mean being better than men it's just mean being the same.
Ok so if Michael Moore said the OPPOSITE, all these women would STILL be at his throat!!! Take what he said as a compliment towards women, people! He's trying to say that it's usually men who are responsible for most of the evil in this world. Shouldn't that be what these women WANT to hear? He's right anyways. It IS mostly men who do these bad things. It's just a fact.
The problem is the "trying". He failed at that trying. He didn't say "usually". And also, he was wrong, as the response from this women pointed out SPECIFIC cases in which he was wrong.
Load More Replies... About ten years ago, I heard two men talking about how the world would be a better place if women were in charge. I rolled my eyes and wished there was a way that I (a woman) could interrupt (that they'd listen to me) and tell them to do us a favor and stop patronizing us with placement on such a lofty pillar. Women are human beings, not soft-hearted Mothers who would rule with a kind, fair, and benevolent hand.
These dudes have clearly never been around a female sports league. The woman are VICIOUS, even at the highest levels. Kevin Dineen coached Olympic women's hockey and said he's been around the game his whole life and thought he'd heard all the trash talking...until he coached the women. He said they were on another level.
Load More Replies... Been saying it for years. Men and Women are two sides of the same human coin. To not give either side credit for good or evil is insulting and foolish.
I was ALLLLL about this, until she apologized for her perceived "tone." If you can't even correct someone (regardless of who he is) without apologizing for a tone he may or may not infer, haven't you sort of negated your whole feminist point?
No you haven't. Nothing is in absolutes. She understood the power of words and that not many will interpret with wisdom. It was nothing personal she had to dissociate the person from the message while still maintaining her stand. There is nothing in that but a lot of maturity, and discernment which a vast majority of people lack.
Load More Replies... Michael Moore is a true justice warrior. His statement was beautiful, but she is right. Maybe they'll make a movie together. It must be an eye opener for him. It was for me.
oftentimes, justice warriors are all about identity politics, and are intolerant of others' opinions
Load More Replies... She is not kidding. Women do have dark sides. Anyone who does not believe this is a fool.
I bet he wishes he'd done a quick Google search b4 making such grandiose claims. I'm opposite ; I believe most atrocities are done in the name of women either as appeasement or by direct direction. The old saying about "behind every gr8 man blah blah. What about the evil ones?
feminism is about making women seem equal not better people need to realize that
I would like to lead the internetz in a round of applause for Ms. Ellis.
Here point is brilliantly delivered, but over all I agree with Michael Moore's point. For the most part the vast majority of murderers, corporate polluters, military contractors, wall street financiers as well as high level drug dealers, corrupt politicians, brutal dictators are men. Why this is so is a far more important question. To assume some sort of biological differences in our moral development and cognitive patterns would certainly be a more detailed study.
I will be very surprised to learn Mr. Moore is upset by this "takedown." I'm sure he'll accept the lesson with his usual awkward grace.
Women are human...we make good and bad choices, just like all humans. Ellis is right. Don't count women out on anything, good or bad. We do make choices in our lives. Our choices, our lives. Get real, Mr. Moore.
There seems to be a lot of hate for Michael Moore in these postings. Let me just say that his intentions are absolutely in the right place. And while he is sometimes prone to hyperbole or presenting a skewed perspective to make a point, its always with the best of intentions. He cares immensely about people and about social justice. Is he perfect in his message? No, of course not. Few of us are. Just remember that he is on your side when you throw your vitriol in his direction.
Nope. This is the internet. Pick a side and stay 100% on it at all times, and hate anybody who's not totally with you in every way with every thought and action. Perhaps you didn't get the memo.
Load More Replies... Apparently, at least one person did :-) The thing is, I think he was relaying a thought that others have expressed at other times.
Load More Replies... So now we are competing on which gender is worst? This world is going to s**t.
Michael Moore is a self loathing human turd. Go back to making love to fried chicken.
I agree and disagree...I'm a woman btw. It's almost laughable and tiring how men really can't say any thing right. They really should just not talk abut women. If they say women are bad, they will get a new a$$hole ripped by the nearest woman. Same if they say women are good. There's no escape! Men: don't talk about women, good or bad. Or periods. If you open a door for a woman you might hear about it. If you dont, you also might. I'm a strong woman who competes in boxing. But I appreciate when guys open doors...and I say thank you.
If a man says "women are good", he deserves criticism. If a man says "women are bad", he deserves criticism. Same goes when the women are talking about men. That's the whole point. Women are not all alike. We're human. That was her point.
Load More Replies... michael moore made his fortune off of liberal followers by pretending to be an ultra-liberal himself, yet he's a huge capitalist.
If you become successful at business you instantly become a huge capitalist? At exactly what income level do your fundamental positions change?
Load More Replies... I don't think it's anything to be proud of that the first modern school shooter was a female
I am pretty sure she wasn't proud of it. She was saying that women are as capable of evil deeds as men.
Load More Replies... How can you tell when Michael Moore is saying something moronic? His mouth is open.
all the research he does for his films yet he cant stop and think before he tweets? ffs
He did think. He clearly didn't finish the thought, but he did think.
Load More Replies... Jessica is a genius and she did it so eloquently. The comments, though....(SyrMerlin's). I disagree. Yes, we've been in power for a lot less time, but it is scientifically proven that men are more aggressive and violent due to that lovely little hormone testosterone. Not to say women are incapable of evil, because that's pure baloney, but there is a difference. Women tend to engage in cold war rather than out-and-out violence. Just a look at the evening news will show, even though women make up a majority of the population, we commit far less violent crimes.
and they had to go back FORTY YEARS to find a female school shooter, when a new young male does it every week.
Load More Replies... Now if only so many other feminists could actually do what their title says they do.
As I've always thought... "Son-of-bitchism" is not related to the gender but to the person.
I'm sure he meant well, but it would be better to view morality through the "human" lense, instead of the man/woman lense- we are all one human race, and simultaneously, our acts of goodness or evil speak louder than our genders.
I agree. Women are full human beings, and as such they are fully sinful and need redemption as much as men, and it is offered equally to both sexes by God. Imposing purity on women and girls is both unrealistic and unhealthy, an impossible burden to bear. Good for her.
There have been plenty of women throughout history who have left their mark, same as any males who have done as much. Even just thinking of the ones like "Bloody Mary" & Margaret Thatcher, it's not hard to see that even women with power could be completely insane or just utterly heartless when it comes down to thinking of others less fortunate. There are probably far more examples, but my mind is totally blank (from lack of sleep over the past 3 days). I think I've made my point, though... 😅
All stereotypes are bad. I have met a number of evil, devious women, but given the condition of the world as it is now, I think it is time that women take control for a century or so. Women are still oppressed the world over, it was a situation perpetrated by men. Frankly, having traveled to many countries of the world, male privilege is on an even par if not significantly greater than white privilege. For every female atrocity that you cite Ms. Ellis, I am sure someone, including me, if I was so predisposed can cite 20 more committed by the male of the species. So young lady, your point is well taken and I would agree with you to some extent, but I think that perhaps in time, you will see that women are not often really placed on a pedestal. Spend some time exploring poverty in developing countries, or examining the terror and torture, women go through in war torn countries (of which there are many), genocide and rape as weapons of war. Keep writing and thinking be a leader.
Literally right TF now they are prosecuting to girls for planning a school shooting. There are plenty of evil women out there.
Ilse Koch was hung in front of those she had tortured for years. The "B***h of Bucanwald"
Well she is right. World can only see the equation between men and women as the result of three perceptions. Either they are equal or the one is better than other mostly that part were men r better . Which is a buttload of c**p. But what about the differences between us. What about a person's choices of making mistakes nd learning nd growing. Nobody ever wants to acknowledge the differences. The truth is we can't compare them or label them. Coz we all have different turfs. But with women the so called 'goodness' is forced upn them. They r not allowed to make mistakes, not allow to have a opinion, not allowed to rebel. Just coz we have vaginas. I personally know countless stories of oppression nd brainwashing through out history flowing down to the present. The world is just a s****y place unable to change.
YES! This! I think Michael Moore meant well, but he has some education to catch up on and Ms Ellis is an awesome teacher. Good for her!
Personally I hate it seeing feminists ignite a fight because there is no other way to settle anything and then throw a punch at a man and when he punches back they scream NEVER PUNCH A WOMAN like what the f**k if you want equal rights you need to accept the bad things that come with it too.
I think the guy had good intentions - but the road to hell is paved with them. Good work Jessica Ellis. I'd personally add to this list my favourite female monster, Elizabeth Báthory.
I appreciate acts of feminism done right. This is one example where a woman proved a man wrong but in the best way possible. Women have caused less disasters but are not less dangerous. There was a serial killer who killed 7 people who was a woman.
One thing she didn't point out and I didn't see it in the comments, either, is the choices women make. It is really sad to think that the choices that mothers make are seen as so inconsequential. Women buy disposable cleaning supplies and containers that pollute. Women are often drivers of the life conveniences that pollute the air, land, and water and add to climate change. Women have also often chosen not to take stands that would have prevented some atrocities in the world. I have never understood why women put up with so much in the last few centuries, knowing that they are dooming their daughters to put up with the same. These are some of the areas where women may be even more culpable as men. Everyone is saying, "Yes, women did these things, but it was mostly men." Women do some bad things on average much more so than men, but it's just not as grandiose. I've never tried to relay this aloud. I've never heard anyone mention it ever. Why not?
it would be nice if one side was cleaner than the other, to deny the points that show darkness comes from both sides is the same as saying mankind has no flaws
While Cain probably doesn't have an equal among women, neither does Jesus. That said, as is obvious, women (like men) are not cranked out to any specification. There are wonder women, and wonder men. There are vile monsters on either side of the genetic isle. The challenge of mortal life is the same for both: discern good and reject evil. The difficulty of mortal life is the same for both. The *distribution* of decisions made is NOT equal. While we each choose for just ourselves, having an EFFECT on others, but NOT OPERATING THEIR AGENCY, womankind is generally more righteous than mankind. Where good is not rewarded, there tends to be more women involved than men. Where degradation is not celebrated, there tends to be more men there than women. Still, we're all where we are by our choices. So, guys and gals, CHOOSE knowing you eat the fruit of the trees you nurture, not always now in mortal life, but definitely forever.
I adore Michael Moore too (and put him on a pedestal) but I must agree with this most erudite woman!
Hedy Lamarr patented the idea of "frequency hopping" which is used in cell phones, wi-fi, torpedo guidance, and smart bombs.
What does she have to do with this post in any capacity?
Load More Replies... I hate to be the one to point this out but PoC already know white women aren’t saints, there are plenty of dead PoC, who are dead solely because of the little bit of power some white women had, which was the ability to place blame on other people. Not that WoC are saints either, we haven’t committed any “mass” atrocities because we haven’t gotten into enough positions of power to do it, (although Condoleeza Rice springs to mind). He’s wrong because even the slightest bit of power is enough to corrupt some people regardless of race, or gender.
The inescapable fact is that women are much better suited to running things than men are, and so they have been doing exactly that since time immemorial. The hand that rocks the cradle is the hand that rules the world, and men are mostly hapless drones, at least the straight ones.
That being said, I've seen the way women treat other women, and they have an enormous capacity for ruthlessness.
Load More Replies... Holy C**P! While I DO NOT respect michael moore enough to even capitalize his name, I'll go one better to say that I abhor his very existence as a human being! Perhaps as a byproduct of a human eating and expelling waste (get my drift?), but nothing higher. moore has proven himself to be a bottom feeder, incapable of independent thought except when he capitalizes on misery. Witness his movie about the school shooting in Columbine for but one example. He hasn't produced anything else of merit and certainly nothing that excites a population to want to see because it doesn't involve misery and heartbreak. My advice to moore is to try and make a documentary on, say, the migrating penguin or hummingbirds. People like stuff like that and NOT so much about his juvenile slamming vitriolic rants against the NRA. But back to the point. In my life I have witnessed both the good and bad sides of women; both in my personal life as well public figures. So I can see the points Ms. Ellis points out.
Just wondering why Jess had to bring her vagina into the convo, nobody else mentioned it...and yes, Mr Moore was trying to make women seem better than men, but you guys shut that down in a hurry....good work; I guess.
LOL. Moore exposes some good things but he's such a DOOFUS at times that a lot of people can't take him seriously.
Been saying it for years. Women and Men are two sides of the same human coin. We are equally capable of good or evil. Pretending otherwise is both foolish and insulting.
Let's not forget https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Nyiramasuhuko Pauline Nyiramasuhuko, a Feminist, government Minister who was convicted of genocide as well as genocidal rape. Victims were raped, tortured, killed, and their bodies were burned. Nyiramasuhuko told militiamen, "before you kill the women, you need to rape them". In another incident, she ordered her men to take cans of gasoline from her car and use them to burn a group of women to death, leaving a surviving rape victim as a witness.
Ma Anand Sheela, Manager of the Rajneeshpuram community in Oregon, was responsible for the biggest act of bio terrorism in America and tried to have multiple people assassinated.
You want to read about an evil woman? https://www.medicalbag.com/grey-matter/the-legend-of-elizabeth-bathory-the-blood-countess/article/472831/
Brilliant ... the only reason women aren't widely recognized as bad actors is because they haven't been given as many opportunities to commit atrocities. We are totally f*cked! Either that, or we have to get off our fat *sses and make sure GOOD people are elected and promoted and get the chance to good for us all.
Cleopatra. Yes, that one, as in Mark Anthony and Elizabeth Taylor. Had most of her male relatives assassinated. Not a nice lady...
I like her response. When I read that women are so good I thought of two women in my life. My mother and my doctor. Two horrible females that know how to manipulate and keep their innocence but when exposed they are dangerous! So yeah! we are the human race and we always want to separate to indicate. That is all. I like the man in the Matrix who said humans are like a virus! I agree with that character's dialog on screen about us humans.
Feminism I Wil get behind and support at full-tilt. Proper Feminism! (note the pronoun punctuation). Equality before preference. Write that Down!
I don't understand - what pronoun punctuation? Do you know what a pronoun is?
Load More Replies... Michael Moore, like everybody, should REALLY research his facts before he starts typing. Seriously.....
Michael Moore is now, and has always been an idiot. He does, however, have SOME redeeming qualities, though I can't recall what they are...
Although he was proven wrong, wasn't he just trying to pay a compliment to women?
The woman who has probably done the most damage to the USA was Madalyn Murray O'Hair, founder of American Atheists, the first major hate group to come along after the KKK. They and their offshoots have done more to disrupt the civility and tolerance in the USA than any other group - maybe excepting Supreme Court Justice Brennan who decided to call flag burning "speech" in 1982.
To refute Michael's claims, it actually was a woman who gave birth to and raised him.....enough said. Or, maybe it was something in the Flint, Michigan water that made Michael so delusional.
I think she put that most succinctly. As for Michael Moore, Cashew calls him democratic. That's a laugh. He spits on a referendum that went against his wishes. He's not a democrat, he wants to be an autocrat.
Jesus, she went all in. I don't even like feminist but s**t, how are you coming back from that?
both are stupid. those women were acting within a male system of control. it's unknown how women would run the world because men have always done so. the fact that women can be bad too is totally irrelevant and proves neither of these attention seekers right.
You are absolutely wrong. Men have NOT always run the world. Hunter-gatherers (which is what most people were prior to about the 1600s) were egalitarian societies to the best of our knowledge. Also, there have been many matriarchal societies, many of them in the US not that long ago. Women being made to be subservient to men is a NEW thing, not old (and seems to get worse on average with every passing century). It's sad that so many women grow up with this myth that that fighting or equality means fighting for something we've never had. We are fighting for something we almost always had, but was taken away quite recently.
Load More Replies... oooppps my earlier comments contained a couple of typos. I apologize. Nonetheless I am curious as to what people believe causes the majority (but certainly not all) of evil actions to come from men?
I imagine the original tweet to b a sarcastic response to a typically worked up feminist who bashed men for being responsible for everything
Oh please. Your comment is just total supposition and wild generalisation. Next time, why not put forward a relevant fact.
Load More Replies... Never underestimate the ability of someone to ingest an entire Podiatrist's patient list.
Michael Moore is a joke.He fights against wealthy people and capitalism,but is wealthy and has a house with dozens of rooms.That is the definition of hypocrisy.He is full of s**t
At exactly what level of money is he supposed to start giving the rest away to charity? Whatever level you choose will still seem like an absolute luxury fortune to someone in a 3rd world slum. What you consider "too much" is just an arbitrary line in the sand.
Load More Replies... The crisco sweating underwear stain needs to let go of the toilet rim and just swirl away!
Can't even try to say something good about women anymore. Granted he was incorect, but damn.
Like seriously when men say, “Oh women don’t do anything, they don’t contribute to the world.” (And I know that men taje part in this) But women should just be like “Who the f**k MADE you? Did y’all give birth? Nah, b***h.”
Bravo. Feminism and Masculism are so last century. We are all just human.
Okay so has she commented anything about Anita Sarkeesian yet?? No?? She should.
Let's enjoy this moment of peace before the paid commenters come to fight their gender war and downvote this comment to the Abyss.
Never forget the difference between history and mythology.
Load More Replies... This is insane. She seems to be arguing for the right for women to be a******s. Nobody is denying women the right to be a******s. but Moore correctly points out that only a tiny percent of murderous a******s are women. to say there isn't a difference is insane.
The "Better or Worse" debate is obviously flawed and ignorant... But men are certainly more dangerous. We naturally produce more testosterone, which does cause an increase in anger, violence, competitiveness, etc. So just from a biological perspective, we are more prone to doing destructive things. In terms of morality, though, and choosing right from wrong, that's entirely dependent on the individual. Women have their vices just like men do. A lot of it, also, is cultural. So much factors into our thoughts and behavior that to assign a higher morality to any gender, race, ethnicity, nationality, etc., would be wildly ignorant. Also -- I think some men just take these stances because they think it'll win them points with women. That, in-and-of itself, is for creepers. I respect women fully, but I'm not ever going to blindly defend them without cause. Too many Sarah Huckabee-Sanders' out there using their womanhood to normalize the same bad things men do. We all have our battles.
To the people saying "this is feminism done right!" Um no. There is no such thing as a "right" kind of feminism. It is just feminism. I'm glad she told off Michael Moore about that since his way of thinking makes us women seem like we are just some monolith who all think and act the same. Instead of actually seeing us as individual human beings who are capable of making the choice to either be good or bad just like men can be. Which of course was the point of this woman telling him off.
You need to look up the definition of 'monolith'.
Load More Replies... Mary Walton doesn't really fit there. She didn't invent smokestacks. She invented a method of deflection for the emission. The industrial chimneys that she patented on were used since the 18th century.
Uh.. women have no "Ego Problems"? Wow. You must not go out much. I have met an equal amount of men and women with massive Ego Problems. Also, the fact that they weren't as "loud" doesn't excuse the evil they did. Look up the Witch of Buchenwald.
Load More Replies... 'Sadly intense debates would be needed every 28 days'? Seriously? What ridiculous notion do you have about women's menstrual cycles? That we all go a little loopy when we have our period? That women menstruate their whole lives? Trotting out that old chestnut is demeaning to women - and adds nothing to your argument.
Load More Replies... Not the time, not the place. I know you're tryin' to be funny, but it ain't working. Sorry bud. Welcome to the abyss of the downvote.
Load More Replies... Read the email you get. Follow the instructions. Roaming around telling the internet you want to unsubscribe is rather useless in the ACTUAL unsubscribe process.
Load More Replies... If you look through history, there are just more men in power mentioned. Just because there are more examples, doesn't mean women are better.
Load More Replies... Wait. What. Attempting to understand or comment has broken my mind. Your assumption that the woman that killed all those Jews was... Jewish... what? Never mind. Any further attempts to understand you logic and my brain just might 'splode like an over cooked cannoli.
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