Woman Presents 6 Constructive Arguments On Why Those Who Consider A Fetus To Be A Baby Are Wrong
Abortions and recent laws related to it have always been followed by a heated debate. It divided people and made them choose between “pro-life” and “pro-choice” or “pro-reproductive rights” and “anti-abortion”. After Texas implemented an anti-abortion law on September 1st, 2021, people became even more vocal about this issue, stressing what really is at stake in this case. One of the TikTok users @drq_dpt made a video accentuating what should change in the system after a fetus is recognized as a baby. This TikTok soon became viral with more than 400k views inviting people to discuss this matter further.
More Info: TikTok
Talks about the anti-abortion law stirred quite a debate and caused a division in society
Image credits: Fibonacci Blue
This TikTok user decided to share her thoughts on changes that should be implemented if a fetus is considered to be a baby
Image credits: drq_dpt
These two viewpoints draw a very strict line between what people believe is the right thing to do in case of unwanted pregnancy. Those who choose “pro-life” are known to be concerned about the well-being of a new life, not taking into account that the woman who is carrying the fetus would not be able to raise and take care of the newborn. Their main argument is that even at the very early stage, the fetus is already alive and has the right to live. “Pro-choice” supporters think that women are the ones in this case who have the right to have the final say. There are numerous situations when an abortion is needed in order to save a woman’s life.
Image credits: drq_dpt
Quozette Valera who is a pelvic floor physical therapist shared her thoughts on TikTok about the anti-abortion law and how things should change so that both, the fetus and woman, would be well. One of the most important parts of the debate is whether the fetus should already be counted as a live human being. Having this in mind, the TikTok user presented some of the possible implementations in case the fetus is considered to be a baby.
Image credits: www.tiktok.com
Image credits: drq_dpt
Image credits: drq_dpt
She started her video by suggesting there should be a life insurance policy that would entitle women who had a miscarriage to receive insurance. While applying her makeup, she also added that with this implementation, having 6 miscarriages would then make her a millionaire. Quozette suggested that if a fetus is a baby, then child support should also start not from the moment the baby is born, but right after the pregnancy is confirmed. She then goes on with a few more examples of how things should change once the fetus is treated like a baby.
Image credits: drq_dpt
The TikTok user ended her video by saying “But now because a fetus isn’t a baby, you just want to control a woman’s reproductive rights”. A lot of people in the comments agreed with the creator, stating that it is easy to demonstrate one’s morals, but it takes time and recourse to actually make these things happen.
What is your take on this situation? Leave your thoughts in the comments down below!
Image credits: drq_dpt
You can watch the full video here!
@drq_dptyall be splitting hairs over the wrong thing🙄 #mindyourownuterus #prochoice #proabortion #reproductiverights #reprorights #sb8 #exvangelicaltiktok♬ original sound – Tik Toker
People in the comments also expressed their opinions on the ongoing discussion about reproductive rights
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This is brilliant. But for me there is one argument that winds them all. Foetus are not babies but it is irrelevant. The government does not have the right to ask you to donate your body to save another person, even if they will die. They cannot force you to donate blood or give part of your liver to save a citizen that will die. Every “pro life” person would be against that. Therefore the government cannot force women to risk their life and health and give their uterus to a fetus no matter if it’s or not a person.
Seriously. They're losing their s**t about being forced to wear masks in the grocery store.
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I'm so sad to see that such posts need to exist. It's always shocking for me to see how people fight to treat the "symptoms" not the root of the "symptoms". You want to stop the abortions? Then go to deal with the reasons why women want/need the abortions in the first place. Is birth control readily available/affordable? Is the father taking the responsibility? Is it a seed of the rape? Was a teenager too ashamed to buy birth control/unable to ask parents for it? Was a teenager denied the sex education? Etc. Pro-life people have tons of energy and a great ambition. I just really wished they used it in a right manner.
Absolutely agree. I am pro life but I would never judge a fellow woman in a stressful situation who chose abortion, but rather offer the (emotional) support she needs. Too often, the women do not get a proper and much needed support and I can't imagine how distraught many of them must be being pregnant on top of being in the middle of a vulnerable phase of life where they feel like they wouldn't be able to take care of (yet another) baby.
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Any middle ground here or…no? Both sides must acknowledge this fact: there will always be abortions. Will the pro-choice agree that an abortion isn’t a very humane thing to do to a human being, even if it’s still a fetus? Will the anti-abortion side agree that the best way to reduce them is by sex-ed and birth control, and acceptance of human sexual activity in its actual wide range? Do that and I guarantee you that legal abortions will be far, far fewer than coat-hanger abortions.
"Will the pro-choice agree that an abortion isn’t a very humane thing to do to a human being, even if it’s still a fetus?" This has never, ever been a point of contention unless you believe far-right media. Pro-choice people don't go out and have abortions for fun. It's f*****g awful and exhausting and tragic and will likely haunt you for the rest of your life emotionally and no pro-choice person wants to go through an abortion themselves. However, they want to BE ALLOWED TO go through with it when it's the better long-term choice for themselves and the potential child, especially if it can happen before the sense of pain is developed (~20 weeks). These are women trying to look out for children by not knowingly bringing them into a bad situation. Maybe while we have over 100,000 children in the US currently up for adoption, we shouldn't be FORCING more into the country without a welcoming family? To quote D**k Wolf, "an unwanted child’s already got two strikes against it." [Ed.: BP censors are Richards]
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Oh my word I'm reading the comments on here and people are wilfully ignoring her point and getting hung up on the details such as the word "fetus". Others are just so entrenched in their "but it's murder !!!" stance that they can't see the wood for the trees. Let me spell it out. She is pointing out the hypocrisy of the "a fetus is a baby" argument IN THE EYES OF THE LAW" Forget the moral and emotional side of it for a second. The reason put forward for the abortion ban is that a fetus is a baby and therefore has a right to life. Whether you agree with that or not, in all other legal aspects it is not viewed as a baby. Women do not get bereavement leave for a miscarriage. Men are not required to pay maintenence from the moment of conception. A fetus cannot be covered be life insurance in the event of a miscarriage. These are the examples she uses to point out the double standard that is occurring. So which is it? If a pregnancy cannot legally be terminated because it is a baby with rights, why do those rights not extend to all other legal and monetary aspects of being a living person? Why only this? She isn't advocating for all the examples to happen she is pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of the supreme court and law makers. Let's be honest, pro life isn't a thing. Call it what it is, it's pro birth.
It's forced birth and nothing else. Pro-life is a euphemism.
Load More Replies... Whenever I hear someone say "heartbeat is life" I think about how I once took heart muscle cells in culture in the lab and how they started contracting (beating) in a culture dish. And how skeletal muscle cells do the same.
Well you should get an F in science lol. So much wrong in this statement but no time to argue with someone who actually thinks this is a valid statement to why babies should be murdered.
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If abortion is so morally wrong, we should have required vasectomy for teen boys. Vasectomies are 100% effective at preventing pregnancies and is easily reversed. To prevent even the slightest possibly of error, sperm could be frozen before the procedure. When a couple is ready mentally, physically and financially they can get it reversed and have their children. That means there will be no unloved, unwanted children. The reason this option isn't part of the conversation is because this is about controlling women not safety nets. Male pro lifers would be like "it's my body you have no right." Hypocrites.
How about teaching them proper use of condoms and the parents how to talk to their children about contraception/intercourse and the responsibility that comes with being sexually active before putting them under the knife???
Load More Replies... Another point to add to her list.... if you are pregnant and invovled in say, a car accident (for egample) and the fetus dies, even at 9 months gestation, you are not elligible for insurance for loss of life of the fetus as it is not a living person. Also, if the fetus is supposed to be a living person, then any driver who causes the death of a fetus in an accident should be prosecuted for manslaughter.
What Texas did is despicable. I was asked to relocate to US operation a couple of years ago before COVID but I turned it down. I have quite a few American friends and I understood why they chose to work overseas at the first opportunity they had. With racism, gun problem, antivaxxers, gender discrimination and the list goes on, I'm better off elsewhere
Cat, yes we have problems here in 'Murica, and God knows, they've gotten worse since the Tangerine Tyrant inflamed all his goose stepping followers. But there are still a lot of good, sensible, progressive folks here who respect people of other races, genders and ideologies. Don't write us all off.
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In the US, the number one reason is this: We have birthright citizenship. That means that the instant you're born, you're a US citizen...and not a moment before birth. The government cannot abrogate my unalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness in order to give rights to a non-citizen, and a fetus is not a citizen. Abortion bans are unconstitutional, end of argument.
No because you wouldnt have enough time to pay into the life insurance to get a bunch of money. The Koreans seem to think theyre 1 years old at birth
Most life insurance policies will pay out even if you die one day after the policy is approved
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An argument "there is a reason why it is called featus and not a baby" is so vague. The line between these two terms is artificial and made up by a man. The nature doesn't care how we decide to call it - a featus, a baby, a chocoball... once there is an fertelizied egg, it has the potential to become a human begin. Right from that one cell. And I am not saying, that woman don't have right to decide if they want a baby or not. But playing with terms and arguing that "it is not a human begin yet" is just trivializing the whole issue. And that is alwys bad.
We do not have laws that require any person to risk their own health or well-being in service of another person's medical needs, even if the lack of such will inevitably result in that person's death. This is why Roe v. Wade recognized that only after the fetal viability outside the womb becomes reasonably medically possible (22-24 weeks-ish), the state has an justifiably increased interest in the matter. The rationale is that it has gone from being purely about a woman's bodily autonomy to also considerations of residency (i.e. whether something would be legal done within in the womb that would be illegal if done outside of it). Can you imagine if we did have such laws requiring people to submit to circumstances that could endanger their health/well-being for another's medical needs? "Hi, Mom! I know I've been an alcoholic for the past 25 years and you want nothing more to do with me, but I'm going to need one of those kidneys and a chunk out of of that liver, too!"
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How about just let people decide what is right for their body and their life and that is that.
why is it considered a double homicide when a pregnant woman is murdered then huh?
That depends where you live and how far you are in the pregnancy, some places its called murder and unlawful termination
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A foetus is a foetus is a foetus. That, for me, is not a child. It needs to go down the canal to be a child.
ok I guess me a c section baby born at 23 weeks and now almost 16 years old wasn't a baby then 👍
Load More Replies... I love how she states that if she'd had six miscarriages, she'd be a millionaire. You can tell how much she values life with that statement.
really well thought out ways to convince yourself that you're not actually snuffing a life. I'm very pro-choice, but I'm mature enough to know whats actually happening when you abort a fetus.
Well, She doesn’t prove that a fetus is not a baby. She shows the inconsistency among pro life supporters.( I’m pro choice, a MD and have assisted in some abortions. But fortunately I live in Scandinavia. )
If abortion for economical reasons would be illegal, then the government should pay child support from the day there would have been an abortion, to the day the person turns 18. If abortion for mental reasons would be illegal, then the government should offer free psychiatric services. If health reasons, free health services. Because one would lose her job, paid maternity leave and making firing illegal. No safety net? Free home aid and kindergarten. If people would REALLY care about the children, this all would be offered as an alternative to abortion. Most of these are already in place in Europe, an lo! The number of abortions a small and gets smaller every day.
it's not the taxpayers fault you got pregnant/got someone pregnant 🤷♀️ try taking responsibility for your own actions instead of expecting other people to. ( this does not apply to r*pe, health reasons btw)
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1. Preposterous. There's no such thing as a "right" to an insurance policy. No insurer is going to underwrite that, so there's no issue in the first place. But if you can find one, go ahead and take out the policy. 2. Utter nonsense. If things are going correctly, the woman is MARRIED and the husband is already contributing to the welfare of the baby. This pile of c**p is so narcissistic she didn't even mention that possibility. 3. Agree with both. But that doesn't make a fetus "not a baby". It just means Congress hasn't taken up the issue. Write to your representative and get a bill introduced. DON'T try to rationalize murder. 4. B******t. Again, not receiving a stimulus check doesn't make a fetus "not a baby". It just means Congress didn't consider it. The whole story is b******t.
I understand that there are women who chose to abort their pregnancies because they got rape or special circumstances about the fetus (the quality of life that they will have post birth due to genetic anomalies). But other than that i don't see any point why you have to abort the fetus. I know it is their body, it is their choice. But they also have a choice to use birth control pills or other contraceptives or not having sex or tell the guy to use condom or have vasectomy. We have brains and self control. I know it is unpopular opinion. For me a fetus is already a human being, who also have rights.
I understand it's a woman's right to choose what happens to her body. However, if someone walks up and stabs a pregnant woman and resulting is a death of the baby, then that person is charged with murder.
F**k anyone who is against abortions. Stop trying to control other people's lives you're pathetic!
She’s going around looking like an idiot . There are more places on Earth other than the US . Don’t tar every country with the same single minded idiocy that they do.
If a fetus dies before being born, how many religions will allow a proper funeral, burial plot and headstone?
The argument about life insurance and miscarriages is outright nonsense. What an insurance company has to pay depends on the terms of conditions of that life insurance. If the insurance includes miscarriages the terms and the insurance premium would be different. I'm pretty certain you can buy insurance against miscarriages.
She isn't saying that it should happen. She is saying that if the "fetus is a baby" argument was valid then it would come with a whole bunch of other legal implications involving money, insurance and rights. But it doesn't. Do you see the hypocrisy?
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men should start paying child support the moment the pregnancy is confirmed?
If "conservatives" determine life begins at conception and it somehow becomes a matter of law, yes, yes they should. And everything else she mentioned.
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Also, what would her reasoning mean for a woman who lost her child because someone physically attacked her? Would that be irrelevant because it was 'just' a fetus? (I‘m not arguing against abortion - there are good reasons for an abortion at times, but it IS still a life that is ended.)
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There are some huge caveats in her reasoning though. The moment you force the alleged father to start paying child support from conception, as a women, you are also giving away your monopoly to chose to have an abortion, since now both parents are responsible for this fetus. Having to fight the father instead of the government might be better, but still you will lose the right to make that decision on your own. A life insurance will not get you rich, given that insurance policy is based on a persons economic value, and a fetus has none. Claiming tax and stimulus benefits would also mean that you, the parent, recognize your fetus as an actual baby/person, thereby forfeiting your right to an abortion since from that point onwards it would be considered murder. If her suggestion would ever actually become law, I'm convinced they would achieve the opposite of what she envisioned .
Life insurance is based on a specific amount (or amounts, based on actual circumstances like accident vs. medical) for which you choose to take out the policy for and pay the corresponding premiums. You are thinking of the determination of the amount of the financial compensation someone is due arising out of the determination of legal liability of a third party (person or organization/corporation) for having caused a death of a spouse or immediate family member through some act of negligence or intention.
Load More Replies... This is all money BS. Also all that can be changed, and actually is different in other parts of the world (Canada - life insurance as example). Absolutely nothing she wrote is in any way a compelling argument, or even close to it. More like a bunch of lazy sjw-type crap that passes on for powerful nowdays. There's adult people who are uninsurable as well, yet it is not moral, or legal to scrape them off the plane of existence. There's 2 clear lines - birth and conception. Since premature babies (born at 21+ weeks) can survive, they are by all accounts human beings, call them fetus, baby or whatever. Before that is up for debate. After that it's really murder, euthanasia if the baby has a sever condition. And the issue with "woman's right to her own body trumps the fetus/baby's right to a life" is really a difficult one, but anyone who is abrupt and even 100% decided on it, in my book either did not give the issue real thought, or is not all right in the head. But that's just my pov
THAT is what we are arguing for. Prior to 20 weeks there is no way the fetus can live outside the womb. Until then it should be viewed as that, a fetus. After the 20 week mark is when abortion should be illegal.
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Maybe (and I know I;m going to hear it from all) If women would stop using abortion as birth control, there would be a meeting of minds. Too many men don't feel like they HAVE TO wear a raincoat. Too many women are counting on it when they don't feel like taking birth control. A LOT of women can't afford BC. I understand that. But why are we making the women fight this battle, alone? If it is a matter of rape, sure! Abort. BUT take the piece of s**t down with ya. that got you that way. Cut His Balls Off!
The percentage of women whose only birth control plan is "I'll just get an abortion" is pretty low. Additionally, many of those women come up with a far better plan if they or someone close to them goes through the process. It is generally emotionally devastating and is not without immediate health risks as well as longer term future reproductive capability (risks that will be highly exacerbated if we return to a time where back-alley illegal abortions are commonplace. As for rape, I fully understand the urge to cut off the rapist's balls, but we do have a Constitutional prohibition against "cruel and unusual punishment", which any permanent physical disfigurement as punishment for a crime would certainly be prohibited by.
Load More Replies... So if all of these things become true would you be okay with abortion being outlawed?
I think you misunderstood, this is a list of things that legally would have to happen if fetuses are recognized as people
Load More Replies... You don’t? Removing a wisdom tooth does not kill it? There is no killing
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If you can't put forth a reasoned argument without simply calling everyone fools and dumbasses you've lost all credibility
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More abortions are done by the left because people who need abortions realise how inhumane the right are
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lol. Thats a fail for argumentative reasoning. Where are your facts that prove a fetus is a baby?
Load More Replies... You obviously stopped learning before the last century
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So you agree that abortions should be legal?
Load More Replies... This is brilliant. But for me there is one argument that winds them all. Foetus are not babies but it is irrelevant. The government does not have the right to ask you to donate your body to save another person, even if they will die. They cannot force you to donate blood or give part of your liver to save a citizen that will die. Every “pro life” person would be against that. Therefore the government cannot force women to risk their life and health and give their uterus to a fetus no matter if it’s or not a person.
Seriously. They're losing their s**t about being forced to wear masks in the grocery store.
Load More Replies... I'm so sad to see that such posts need to exist. It's always shocking for me to see how people fight to treat the "symptoms" not the root of the "symptoms". You want to stop the abortions? Then go to deal with the reasons why women want/need the abortions in the first place. Is birth control readily available/affordable? Is the father taking the responsibility? Is it a seed of the rape? Was a teenager too ashamed to buy birth control/unable to ask parents for it? Was a teenager denied the sex education? Etc. Pro-life people have tons of energy and a great ambition. I just really wished they used it in a right manner.
Absolutely agree. I am pro life but I would never judge a fellow woman in a stressful situation who chose abortion, but rather offer the (emotional) support she needs. Too often, the women do not get a proper and much needed support and I can't imagine how distraught many of them must be being pregnant on top of being in the middle of a vulnerable phase of life where they feel like they wouldn't be able to take care of (yet another) baby.
Load More Replies... Any middle ground here or…no? Both sides must acknowledge this fact: there will always be abortions. Will the pro-choice agree that an abortion isn’t a very humane thing to do to a human being, even if it’s still a fetus? Will the anti-abortion side agree that the best way to reduce them is by sex-ed and birth control, and acceptance of human sexual activity in its actual wide range? Do that and I guarantee you that legal abortions will be far, far fewer than coat-hanger abortions.
"Will the pro-choice agree that an abortion isn’t a very humane thing to do to a human being, even if it’s still a fetus?" This has never, ever been a point of contention unless you believe far-right media. Pro-choice people don't go out and have abortions for fun. It's f*****g awful and exhausting and tragic and will likely haunt you for the rest of your life emotionally and no pro-choice person wants to go through an abortion themselves. However, they want to BE ALLOWED TO go through with it when it's the better long-term choice for themselves and the potential child, especially if it can happen before the sense of pain is developed (~20 weeks). These are women trying to look out for children by not knowingly bringing them into a bad situation. Maybe while we have over 100,000 children in the US currently up for adoption, we shouldn't be FORCING more into the country without a welcoming family? To quote D**k Wolf, "an unwanted child’s already got two strikes against it." [Ed.: BP censors are Richards]
Load More Replies... Oh my word I'm reading the comments on here and people are wilfully ignoring her point and getting hung up on the details such as the word "fetus". Others are just so entrenched in their "but it's murder !!!" stance that they can't see the wood for the trees. Let me spell it out. She is pointing out the hypocrisy of the "a fetus is a baby" argument IN THE EYES OF THE LAW" Forget the moral and emotional side of it for a second. The reason put forward for the abortion ban is that a fetus is a baby and therefore has a right to life. Whether you agree with that or not, in all other legal aspects it is not viewed as a baby. Women do not get bereavement leave for a miscarriage. Men are not required to pay maintenence from the moment of conception. A fetus cannot be covered be life insurance in the event of a miscarriage. These are the examples she uses to point out the double standard that is occurring. So which is it? If a pregnancy cannot legally be terminated because it is a baby with rights, why do those rights not extend to all other legal and monetary aspects of being a living person? Why only this? She isn't advocating for all the examples to happen she is pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of the supreme court and law makers. Let's be honest, pro life isn't a thing. Call it what it is, it's pro birth.
It's forced birth and nothing else. Pro-life is a euphemism.
Load More Replies... Whenever I hear someone say "heartbeat is life" I think about how I once took heart muscle cells in culture in the lab and how they started contracting (beating) in a culture dish. And how skeletal muscle cells do the same.
Well you should get an F in science lol. So much wrong in this statement but no time to argue with someone who actually thinks this is a valid statement to why babies should be murdered.
Load More Replies... If abortion is so morally wrong, we should have required vasectomy for teen boys. Vasectomies are 100% effective at preventing pregnancies and is easily reversed. To prevent even the slightest possibly of error, sperm could be frozen before the procedure. When a couple is ready mentally, physically and financially they can get it reversed and have their children. That means there will be no unloved, unwanted children. The reason this option isn't part of the conversation is because this is about controlling women not safety nets. Male pro lifers would be like "it's my body you have no right." Hypocrites.
How about teaching them proper use of condoms and the parents how to talk to their children about contraception/intercourse and the responsibility that comes with being sexually active before putting them under the knife???
Load More Replies... Another point to add to her list.... if you are pregnant and invovled in say, a car accident (for egample) and the fetus dies, even at 9 months gestation, you are not elligible for insurance for loss of life of the fetus as it is not a living person. Also, if the fetus is supposed to be a living person, then any driver who causes the death of a fetus in an accident should be prosecuted for manslaughter.
What Texas did is despicable. I was asked to relocate to US operation a couple of years ago before COVID but I turned it down. I have quite a few American friends and I understood why they chose to work overseas at the first opportunity they had. With racism, gun problem, antivaxxers, gender discrimination and the list goes on, I'm better off elsewhere
Cat, yes we have problems here in 'Murica, and God knows, they've gotten worse since the Tangerine Tyrant inflamed all his goose stepping followers. But there are still a lot of good, sensible, progressive folks here who respect people of other races, genders and ideologies. Don't write us all off.
Load More Replies... In the US, the number one reason is this: We have birthright citizenship. That means that the instant you're born, you're a US citizen...and not a moment before birth. The government cannot abrogate my unalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness in order to give rights to a non-citizen, and a fetus is not a citizen. Abortion bans are unconstitutional, end of argument.
No because you wouldnt have enough time to pay into the life insurance to get a bunch of money. The Koreans seem to think theyre 1 years old at birth
Most life insurance policies will pay out even if you die one day after the policy is approved
Load More Replies... An argument "there is a reason why it is called featus and not a baby" is so vague. The line between these two terms is artificial and made up by a man. The nature doesn't care how we decide to call it - a featus, a baby, a chocoball... once there is an fertelizied egg, it has the potential to become a human begin. Right from that one cell. And I am not saying, that woman don't have right to decide if they want a baby or not. But playing with terms and arguing that "it is not a human begin yet" is just trivializing the whole issue. And that is alwys bad.
We do not have laws that require any person to risk their own health or well-being in service of another person's medical needs, even if the lack of such will inevitably result in that person's death. This is why Roe v. Wade recognized that only after the fetal viability outside the womb becomes reasonably medically possible (22-24 weeks-ish), the state has an justifiably increased interest in the matter. The rationale is that it has gone from being purely about a woman's bodily autonomy to also considerations of residency (i.e. whether something would be legal done within in the womb that would be illegal if done outside of it). Can you imagine if we did have such laws requiring people to submit to circumstances that could endanger their health/well-being for another's medical needs? "Hi, Mom! I know I've been an alcoholic for the past 25 years and you want nothing more to do with me, but I'm going to need one of those kidneys and a chunk out of of that liver, too!"
Load More Replies... How about just let people decide what is right for their body and their life and that is that.
why is it considered a double homicide when a pregnant woman is murdered then huh?
That depends where you live and how far you are in the pregnancy, some places its called murder and unlawful termination
Load More Replies... A foetus is a foetus is a foetus. That, for me, is not a child. It needs to go down the canal to be a child.
ok I guess me a c section baby born at 23 weeks and now almost 16 years old wasn't a baby then 👍
Load More Replies... I love how she states that if she'd had six miscarriages, she'd be a millionaire. You can tell how much she values life with that statement.
really well thought out ways to convince yourself that you're not actually snuffing a life. I'm very pro-choice, but I'm mature enough to know whats actually happening when you abort a fetus.
Well, She doesn’t prove that a fetus is not a baby. She shows the inconsistency among pro life supporters.( I’m pro choice, a MD and have assisted in some abortions. But fortunately I live in Scandinavia. )
If abortion for economical reasons would be illegal, then the government should pay child support from the day there would have been an abortion, to the day the person turns 18. If abortion for mental reasons would be illegal, then the government should offer free psychiatric services. If health reasons, free health services. Because one would lose her job, paid maternity leave and making firing illegal. No safety net? Free home aid and kindergarten. If people would REALLY care about the children, this all would be offered as an alternative to abortion. Most of these are already in place in Europe, an lo! The number of abortions a small and gets smaller every day.
it's not the taxpayers fault you got pregnant/got someone pregnant 🤷♀️ try taking responsibility for your own actions instead of expecting other people to. ( this does not apply to r*pe, health reasons btw)
Load More Replies... 1. Preposterous. There's no such thing as a "right" to an insurance policy. No insurer is going to underwrite that, so there's no issue in the first place. But if you can find one, go ahead and take out the policy. 2. Utter nonsense. If things are going correctly, the woman is MARRIED and the husband is already contributing to the welfare of the baby. This pile of c**p is so narcissistic she didn't even mention that possibility. 3. Agree with both. But that doesn't make a fetus "not a baby". It just means Congress hasn't taken up the issue. Write to your representative and get a bill introduced. DON'T try to rationalize murder. 4. B******t. Again, not receiving a stimulus check doesn't make a fetus "not a baby". It just means Congress didn't consider it. The whole story is b******t.
I understand that there are women who chose to abort their pregnancies because they got rape or special circumstances about the fetus (the quality of life that they will have post birth due to genetic anomalies). But other than that i don't see any point why you have to abort the fetus. I know it is their body, it is their choice. But they also have a choice to use birth control pills or other contraceptives or not having sex or tell the guy to use condom or have vasectomy. We have brains and self control. I know it is unpopular opinion. For me a fetus is already a human being, who also have rights.
I understand it's a woman's right to choose what happens to her body. However, if someone walks up and stabs a pregnant woman and resulting is a death of the baby, then that person is charged with murder.
F**k anyone who is against abortions. Stop trying to control other people's lives you're pathetic!
She’s going around looking like an idiot . There are more places on Earth other than the US . Don’t tar every country with the same single minded idiocy that they do.
If a fetus dies before being born, how many religions will allow a proper funeral, burial plot and headstone?
The argument about life insurance and miscarriages is outright nonsense. What an insurance company has to pay depends on the terms of conditions of that life insurance. If the insurance includes miscarriages the terms and the insurance premium would be different. I'm pretty certain you can buy insurance against miscarriages.
She isn't saying that it should happen. She is saying that if the "fetus is a baby" argument was valid then it would come with a whole bunch of other legal implications involving money, insurance and rights. But it doesn't. Do you see the hypocrisy?
Load More Replies... men should start paying child support the moment the pregnancy is confirmed?
If "conservatives" determine life begins at conception and it somehow becomes a matter of law, yes, yes they should. And everything else she mentioned.
Load More Replies... Also, what would her reasoning mean for a woman who lost her child because someone physically attacked her? Would that be irrelevant because it was 'just' a fetus? (I‘m not arguing against abortion - there are good reasons for an abortion at times, but it IS still a life that is ended.)
Load More Replies... There are some huge caveats in her reasoning though. The moment you force the alleged father to start paying child support from conception, as a women, you are also giving away your monopoly to chose to have an abortion, since now both parents are responsible for this fetus. Having to fight the father instead of the government might be better, but still you will lose the right to make that decision on your own. A life insurance will not get you rich, given that insurance policy is based on a persons economic value, and a fetus has none. Claiming tax and stimulus benefits would also mean that you, the parent, recognize your fetus as an actual baby/person, thereby forfeiting your right to an abortion since from that point onwards it would be considered murder. If her suggestion would ever actually become law, I'm convinced they would achieve the opposite of what she envisioned .
Life insurance is based on a specific amount (or amounts, based on actual circumstances like accident vs. medical) for which you choose to take out the policy for and pay the corresponding premiums. You are thinking of the determination of the amount of the financial compensation someone is due arising out of the determination of legal liability of a third party (person or organization/corporation) for having caused a death of a spouse or immediate family member through some act of negligence or intention.
Load More Replies... This is all money BS. Also all that can be changed, and actually is different in other parts of the world (Canada - life insurance as example). Absolutely nothing she wrote is in any way a compelling argument, or even close to it. More like a bunch of lazy sjw-type crap that passes on for powerful nowdays. There's adult people who are uninsurable as well, yet it is not moral, or legal to scrape them off the plane of existence. There's 2 clear lines - birth and conception. Since premature babies (born at 21+ weeks) can survive, they are by all accounts human beings, call them fetus, baby or whatever. Before that is up for debate. After that it's really murder, euthanasia if the baby has a sever condition. And the issue with "woman's right to her own body trumps the fetus/baby's right to a life" is really a difficult one, but anyone who is abrupt and even 100% decided on it, in my book either did not give the issue real thought, or is not all right in the head. But that's just my pov
THAT is what we are arguing for. Prior to 20 weeks there is no way the fetus can live outside the womb. Until then it should be viewed as that, a fetus. After the 20 week mark is when abortion should be illegal.
Load More Replies... Maybe (and I know I;m going to hear it from all) If women would stop using abortion as birth control, there would be a meeting of minds. Too many men don't feel like they HAVE TO wear a raincoat. Too many women are counting on it when they don't feel like taking birth control. A LOT of women can't afford BC. I understand that. But why are we making the women fight this battle, alone? If it is a matter of rape, sure! Abort. BUT take the piece of s**t down with ya. that got you that way. Cut His Balls Off!
The percentage of women whose only birth control plan is "I'll just get an abortion" is pretty low. Additionally, many of those women come up with a far better plan if they or someone close to them goes through the process. It is generally emotionally devastating and is not without immediate health risks as well as longer term future reproductive capability (risks that will be highly exacerbated if we return to a time where back-alley illegal abortions are commonplace. As for rape, I fully understand the urge to cut off the rapist's balls, but we do have a Constitutional prohibition against "cruel and unusual punishment", which any permanent physical disfigurement as punishment for a crime would certainly be prohibited by.
Load More Replies... So if all of these things become true would you be okay with abortion being outlawed?
I think you misunderstood, this is a list of things that legally would have to happen if fetuses are recognized as people
Load More Replies... You don’t? Removing a wisdom tooth does not kill it? There is no killing
Load More Replies... If you can't put forth a reasoned argument without simply calling everyone fools and dumbasses you've lost all credibility
Load More Replies... More abortions are done by the left because people who need abortions realise how inhumane the right are
Load More Replies... lol. Thats a fail for argumentative reasoning. Where are your facts that prove a fetus is a baby?
Load More Replies... You obviously stopped learning before the last century
Load More Replies... So you agree that abortions should be legal?
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